I think we should all own and keep assault weapons at home, hopefully once they get banned in the usa the supply up here will be enhanced a little. ;-) With all that is going on in our world it's just a matter of time before the next big war breaks out, if it ever comes to my neighborhood I'd prefer to have a weapon and not just a hunting rifle.

Any thoughts?

What's the closest thing to an AR type rifle that you guys can currently own? A BAR?

The absolute birthright to own ANY type of weapon or tool that a native-born Canadian chooses to has been abrogated in Canada, for many decades.

This, is a disgrace and an insult to the memory of the tens of thousands of Canadians who died to preserve this nation from it's inception in the 16thC. by various northwestern European colonists and many fine aboriginal peoples, as well.

This, plus the hideous genocide of "by choice" abortion are the two aspects of my beloved country that both sicken and enrage me and I have fought by peaceful and legal methods against both for more than forty years.

Oddly, I have a lot of rather "highend" guns and NO military ones as they do not interest me and I see no need in MY life for spending money on them. However, if my friend, Jim "Canuckshooter" even WANTS to own one, it is his RIGHT!!!!!

However, many politicians, ESPECIALLY those of "non-traditional" immigrant origin, are totally against Jim and I and other Canadians,owning ANY guns......what,I wonder, should we Canucks do about this travesty?

In the right hands, and I am right handed, my hunting rifles are weapons. I have one that is supposed to hold true to 1000 metres, though I have never shot it that far. It's good to a quarter of a mile, though.

The magazine capacity seems be be a conundrum.

exbio - from my understanding, you can own an AR-15 or handgun, but you must complete extra training (to get a "restricted" firearms license) and then you can only use a restricted firearm at an approved gun range - and no where else. You must also have authorization to transport such a firearm to and from the range.

There are certain firearms that are "prohibited", meaning you can't own them no matter what. Someone else might be able to dig up a list of those.

For general hunting shotguns and rifles, you complete a weekend course and take a test, giving you a license for "non-restricted" weapons meaning you can legally buy, sell, use and possess non-restricted firearms. This must be renewed every 5 years by simply filling out a form.

Being an American living in Canada, who spends a great deal of time in the northern bush, I find it weird to not carry a sidearm of the handgun variety for all sorts of useful purposes, but it is what it is.

shootist - I think the biggest debate centered on having guns for protection is the thought of mass armaggedon meaning you would want a gun with stopping power that holds lots of ammo, not to snipe at long ranges. Hence the debate around mag capacity and semi auto/auto. Look at the videos of Black Friday and replace cheap Chinese electronics with food or water.

I think a 12 gauge with extended tube mag is your best bet for home based defense against a mob, some prefer an AR-15 set-up.

I like to look on the bright side but I have that luxury living in the North. If the SHTF, I jump on my skidoo, or grab the canoe and hole up for awhile.

I wish we had more people like you in the US. You sir, are a patriot.

In accordance with the Firearms Act, a new firearms safety course focusing on restricted firearms (primarily handguns) was developed and implemented on February 1, 1999. The legislation stipulates that individuals wishing to acquire restricted and/or prohibited firearms must take the Canadian Firearms Safety Course (CFSC) and the Canadian Restricted Firearms Safety Course (CRFSC) and pass the tests OR challenge and pass the CFSC and the CRFSC tests without taking either course.

Topics covered in the CRFSC include:

�the evolution of firearms, major parts, types and actions;
�basic firearms safety practices;
�ammunition;
�operating handgun actions;
�firing techniques and procedures for handguns;
�care of restricted firearms;
�responsibilities of the firearms owner/user; and
�safe storage, display, transportation and handling of restricted firearms.

If you know a little bit about firearms it is a pretty easy test so my recommendation is to just challenge it without the course, which is what I did.

Get one of these, they are legal in Canada.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t6OZjYuZs-k

n007 - Really? I thought all shotgun barrels had to be 18 inches.

I was thinking about getting one of those Mare's Leg rifles from Rossi. Pretty cool little gun.

I seriously doubt that the tatooed skinhead in that video, has ever seen a bear and while I have known Joe Dlask, since he came to Canada, and he did three P-64 actions for me when I was still working in forestry, alone in the bush, for the AFS, he is not really a guy to have build Grizzly guns.

I have packed shotguns when supervising forestry crews, over 40 years ago and I never really felt comfortable with the slugs we could then obtain. I much prefer a .338WM or another rifle like that and I consider a gun such as that depicted to be more of a "toy" than a practical tool.

One CAN carry a .44M. revolver in the bush in Canada, simply be obtaining the licence to do so for employment purposes, this is not difficult and many of my friends do this. I am retired and not interested in more handguns, sold my Redhawk and still tend to prefer a 20" bbl'ed .375, which I have and sometimes carry.

I feel "safer"with a Freon horn, caution and avoiding certain areas in the "hyperphagic" time of the bear's season, than I ever did just packing a revolver. YMMV, of course, I am all in favour of legitimate Canucks and legal residents carrying any damn gun they want to.

I was more thinking it would be nice to carry a little 22 revolver. Shoot a hare here and there. Dispatch animals caught in snares. Be a nice survival tool if something goes wrong, etc but is light and stays out of the way. I used to carry one trapping in the US all the time. It felt weird when I first moved here, to be canoeing in the middle of nowhere and not have some sort of firearm but now I've gotten used to it.

For bears, I've never relied on a gun either kutenay. We do the bear spray/bangers/horn and good judgement. It has worked so far.

After using the C7 rifle for the last part of my Military career, I have zero interest in the AR15 type firearms. However, if I could, I would own an FN C1 in a heartbeat! Too bad it is on the prohib list. Not to say we shouldn't be able to own/use/carry the firearm of our choice, of course we should. Till then the SHTF firearm of choice for me is a short barrel 12g.
Back country firearm of choice is a levergun plus pepper spray.

The Swissarms version of the Sig 550 is a non restricted firearms as is the Isreali Tabor

Although it is a pain to have a 30 round mag pinned to 5 rounds

+1

Bob

www.bigbores.ca

First and foremost to all who are using the term "assault weapon
I VERY MUCH doubt that any of you own an assault rifle!! If you check the definition of such it is a rifle that allows selective fire from full to repetitive fire. Does any one own such a rifle.
I believe what you are talking about is an AR-15 type of rifle that is an auto loading gun!!Please correct me if I am wrong. By using the term A.W. you are playing right into the hands of those who want to ban them. Just my 2cents. Cheers NC

Pepper spray is one of the things customs seems to frown on.
I see "dog repellent" at Canadian Tire.
Is pepper spray as such sold?

I had a near mint Israeli FN-FAL for a few years but sold it as I was working lightstations for the Can. Coast Guard and my wife was nervous alone in our townhouse in Burnaby with guns like that stored there.

I once went to Lever Arms, Vancouver's once fabulous gunshop and bought some generic 7.62 Nato ammo and took the FN to the now-closed Barnet Rifle Club. I shot sub-inch groups consistently with the issue iron sights and was just astounded. I liked that rifle, but, such guns are mere memories now.......ALL Canadian political parties have connived in disarming us and we NEED to realize that the CPC is NOT a real "friend" to we gun people.

The SIG 550 is one rifle I have almost bought several times in the past 2-3 months, as I have sold off all but my CRF bolt rifles and I still might......pricey, though and I have far too many guns as it is.

Yup, I had two fine custom Grizzly guns, built on levers, both .45-70s, but, while I have owned about every big bore lever rifle made, just sold my Sako Finnwolf, I have never been able to shoot them as well as I can Mod. 70s, Brnos and Mausers...and, as an "old phart", getting into my dotage, I think it best to carry and depend on that gun which works best for he who is using it,lever, bolt or whatever.

I would not bother packing both a .44M and a rifle, I know some who do, but, I feel safest with a well-tested bolt gun and so I guess I am "PC" to the vile gun banners!

VERY well said and we all benefit from reminding each other of such issues, IMHO.

wabigoon;
I trust that this finds you acceptably well this wet December evening sir.

Pepper spray is one of "those things" that make some of us who travel both sides of the medicine line shake our heads more often than not.

We can buy many of the same sprays up here as you can down there - there may be some brands not available up here, but believe it or not I think it's because of a restricted propellant and not the capsicum levels.

We can not however cross into the US with it, so the cans of bear repellent hanging on the coat rack at the entrance have to stay home. Unless I missed something, I could have bought the same stuff in Montana that we can get up here and carried it while we were there, but again I can't bring it back home to Canada.....

Clear as mud, no?

Regarding the nomenclature used for tools that shoot bullets, as a long time Hunter Safety examiner in BC and a currently in hiatus Federal Firearms examiner I try to not call any of them weapons as I tend to think it might send the wrong message to the less informed.

I totally agree with my cyber friend troutfly in that if I could play afield with a black rifle it would be an FN in 7.62, but I also agree with kutenay that we should be able to pack what we want as free citizens.

When the whole mandatory PAL system was in it's inception I trained a few RCMP recruits as they didn't have in house trainers at first or so I was told anyway.

The irony of me being OK in the eyes of the federal government to train them in order so they could possess a sidearm, but not being OK enough to be trusted to carry a sidearm myself was not lost on me - not once.

Anyway with all that said, many years ago the late Col. Jeff Cooper ran a bunch of tests at ranges from conversational to about 200yds, with shooters of various skill levels using an AR variant, an AK variant and a 94 equipped with a receiver sight and a trigger job. The 94 made a pretty fair showing for itself in terms of hits, even with rapid fire - but of course is slower to recharge when dry.

I hope and pray to never need it for anything serious but if called upon in time of need, in the back of the safe rests a very slicked and tweaked mid '70's 94. It's my saddle gun when chasing cows and accompanies our family on tenting trips, so it's a bit of a favorite of mine that has proven terminal for enough live targets that I'd bet on it being as deadly a tool as I'd hopefully never need.

All the best to you and yours this Christmas wabigoon and all the best to you in 2013 as well.

Regards,
Dwayne

I am talking about a fully automatic capable assault rifle. When the time comes, such a weapon would be a desirable commodity for protecting my family. Given the opportunity I'd get one in a minute....

The pinned mag is one reason I have zero interest in an AR type firearm. In a SHTF scenario the 5 rounds would be........How many 5 round mags can a guy carry? Makes more sense to carry a lever gun capable of having up to 10 rounds avail or a short barrel 12g with mag extender. The shotgun is likely the optimal tool as in a number of cases you could have a longer barrel for food gathering plus a shorter barrel with a mag ext for defensive puposes.
Regardless of your firearm choice, rifle or shotgun, be it a semi, lever, bolt or pump action, practice with it till you become proficent with it as both a food gathering and defensive tool. Regardless, we need to support one anothers choice. A hand gun would be a nice addition too.

The best stuff in Canada is made by UDAP. It certainly does work, I can tell you, BTDT.
The rules about bear spray and the border are quite rediculous as the diffrences are minimal.
I carry both spray and a lever gun with the spray being deployed first. The rifle is to back up the spray if the bear decides to take another run at me or there are multiple bears, then it gets deployed first. While I rather enjoy bear steaks with a side of apple sauce, I have no desire to kill a bear if I don't need to. If we both walk away, it was a good day for both of us. Not saying everyone should look at it this way, just the choice I have made.
(I have heard that bear spray has been known to deter two legged varmints as well)
Back on topic.

Frankly, a selective fire rifle/carbine with even 40 rd. mags is not a very sound choice in a defensive situation. It's "utility"is largely a fantasy derived from the contemporary "ninja" media culture which has subsumed much of North America's gun culture, to our detriment.

Such a gun, if used frequently on "full rock and roll" as the wannabes call it, will soon burn out the throat of it's bbl. and lose accuracy. It is a tool designed for contaminating a large area with projectiles to wound the enemy and thus engage a larger number of troops in caring for their comrades, rendering them less of a threat. It is useful in military applications, but, is not much good for careful, legal home defence.

I might add that one cannot be "safe"from an armed enemy, unless the S.O.B. is either DEAD or severely wounded and ONE precise hit in a vital area is STILL the best means to that end.

A good field shot with a sound hunting rifle, an extended mag. repeating shotgun and a good handgun can defend his home more effectively than some tattooed weirdo with a "black gun" that he owns to project a quality of manhood that he so pathetically lacks....the BC Lower Mainland is full of 5'5"-145 lb. "kewl dudes" of exactly this sort.......

I believe any shotgun has to be 32" min length to be legal.
Thus the reason the 12" barreled "backpackers" are legal since they have a full Butt stock bringing them to min length.
That shotty in vid would not be 32".

26" or the metric equivalent over all length. Not designed to fired by one hand. Barrel not sawed off - so factory length. Think that's how it goes, or at least used to go.

The Ranch Hand/Mare's Leg comes under the length, but it is not designed to be fired by one hand. Weird.

Okay, using the term "Assault weapon" makes you look like an idiot. That's the fearmongering term the gun-grabbers came up with, don't use it. Grenade launcher? Landing craft? Bangalore torpedo? Mortar launched grappling hook? Or military-styled semi-automatic rifle?

Yes, we should be able to own them. They aren't any more dangerous than a Remington semi-auto in .30-06, which I'm sure most people are fine with.

Oh, and for the record, the old SMLE makes for a great platform. Very fast bolt, 10 round capacity, loaded with stripper clips. I gotta get me one.

The original assault weapon was likely a rock or a stick. How do you suppose Cain did in Abel?

Yes, and bare hands. A pillow has been a weapon as well.

We are all convinced, now on to the gun haters.

Sorry, I thought we were discussing assault weapons. How rude of me!

I was talking about being smothered with a pillow.

What were YOU thinking?

Really, not needed. Any rifle or shotgun is more than adequate.

Military style semi-automatic with full automatic capabilities.....now your talking!!

https://www.canadaammo.com/product/detail/58/dominion-arms-backpacker-single-barrel-shotgun-13/


With practice/organized ammo you can get 15 to 20 rounds off per minute. An auto ejector would be nice but honing out the chamber a bit allows 'flick of the wrist' evacuation of the spent shell. Shock and awe in dim light has to be seen to be believed.

The only thing more "Up close and personal" than that would be a knife.
Nothing like a bit of practice to get the rounds crankin down range. I can accurately empty my 1894 in mere seconds, those single shot shotguns can be cycled pretty quick too.

having worked in Canada for a while, ( employed by a Canadian Company I might add, not an American one...), plus all of my travels there annually... seeing and visiting from Newfoundland to BC and the Yukon...

like Kutenay, it is sad to see all of these immigrants from China, India, Pakistan and the Middle East, changing the very fabric of the country, the same as has happened in the USA..

if we didn't have all of this, I wish both Canada and the USA, also had military requirements of its sane citizens... that we were all part of our military reserved, armed and required to be proficient in the use of said weapons, along with other required military training... to include field medical first aid taught to basic combat medics..

Switzerland and Israel are two countries that have the right idea... defending ourselves and our nations are a God given right, which politicians continually try to take away from all of us..

armed citizens would certainly cut down on the crime rate.. where ever there is a high crime rate...

of course leftists would just proclaim it would only increase crime and violence... maybe in the beginning they'd be right.. but in the long run, it would certainly clean out the bad elements...

Kutes,

too bad half the good folks of Canada and half the good folks on our side the border.. didn't have your level of common sense...

I live where I can buy such rifles and such hand guns.. yet I don't own them for the exact reasons you posted above...

plus if ever needed those types would quickly find themselves also out of ammo..

for those that want to be lethal in defense of their family and homes, they should also really learn about first aid treating combat gunshot wounds... also about Anatomy and Physiology... and more about what kind of performance that bullets can perform in the best of scenarios..

I suggest all of that, as I was a trained basic combat medic and a highly advanced trained medic for a variety of scenarios to include Nuclear Biological and Chemical Warfare...and have also completed the Green Beret Medic Course..

The suggestion of that training if one wants to survive, lets you know where to hit a threat and how to put them down quickly, with a wide variety of available resources, regardless of how much 'body armour' they may be wearing...slow moving bullets like a 22 mag will go thru a lot of body armour available out there...

a slow moving varmint bullet can do a lot of damage to tissue in all directions... a varmint bullet hitting a leg can take down someone and cut a major artery or vein quite quickly...

there is about 6 litres of blood within the human body...so it takes little time to "bleed out" if something major is hit to open up the enclosed system of our circulatory system...

maybe morbid to speak of... but much more effective, than Rambo and his tattoos and full auto AK or AR...

besides if anyone has fired one of those on full auto at a target at 100 meters, they'll find they won't have much of a 'group'... so it is easy to unload a mag and not hit a darn thing you are aiming at...

It takes a lot less blood than one would think to lose consciousness. About a half the blood we have is circulating in arteries and veins. The rest is in organs such as liver kidneys and pancreas. Seafire is right. Knowing where to hit major arterial plexis or nerves and knowing how to take care of injuries are useful knowledge.

Seen more than a few "bleed out" right quickly when the aeorta gets either ripped off or shot off the top of the heart. It may not be instantaneous, but it ain't much off that.

My experience with people is responding as a medic not as the one causing damage. With animals we want quick death whereas with people instant incapacitation. A single well placed shot will give the desired effect. By the way I have responded to a number of people shot in the head who were messed up but not incapacitated.

I was talking about human targets, not deer or moose.

And head shots not being fatal - - must have been liberals or NDP -- nothing vital on one of them north of the belly button.

Now that's funny.

CS, I agree that we should have the right. I would probably own one because they are fun to shoot more than anything.

I was down in Eugene a couple of years ago and stopped at an indoor range where for a fee you can shoot a handgun. The group I was with all did so but having a number of handguns and shooting them a lot I did not.

After everyone was outfitted and banging away I remarked on the Thompson machinegun on the wall not realizing it was available to shoot. Well I had that loaded up in record time!

Anyway, it was a whole lot of fun to shoot, surprisingly heavy, surprisingly accurate on semi auto, and a handful on full auto.

The point here is that, for me, in a defense application this firearm would be most useful in semiauto mode. Auto just empties too fast. And on semi I can hit things fairly well.

We used to train on the Thompson for bank escorts when I was first on the police force. You are absolutely right about their accuracy on semi-auto. We shot them at 25 yards on semi-auto, and group sizes were quite impressive.

Then when we tripped the fun lever we got to see how the thing really rocked and rolled. We were supposed to try to fire three shot bursts . . . . yeah, right. Like telling a bunch of guys who were trying electric train sets not to go full throttle. 30 shot stick mag empties in about thee seconds.

I wouldn't mind the carbine version even in semi-auto.

That is what this one had, the stick magazines, so that was 30, it didn't take long to empty.

By 3rd mag I was able to hold on the target pretty good. It was impressive as it kind of chopped the center of the target out.

They have been called, "Choppers", as well as a number of other things.
The Thompson must be more accurate than the Reising, those got bad reviews, wire stock, and all.

Ours had the wooden stocks front and rear. They had the drum mags available for the actual bank escorts, but they were cumbersome and most of the guys preferred the sticks. And ours weren't some sort of cheap knock offs, they were the real deal -- Thompsons. What's not to like about 230 grains of bullet rolling down range like a bowling ball?

The Reisings had the wire stock. They used the ACP round as well.
You pay for the ammo, and I'll have fun with a Thompson.
For the most part, after artillerty training, my curiosity in regards to noise, flash, and smoke, has been pretty much sasified.

Yeah, this one had wood too. Apparently this one was made in 1927 or so if that sounds right.

I think Thompson called it the 1927A1 or some such, regardless of the year of manufacture. At any rate, a great firearm, and a bit of history as well.

It'd be reloads if I was responsible for the cost.

As I say about many of them, I'd rather be behind, than in front of them.
Sort of a moot issue, given the price,and restrictions on a Thompson. Unless that is, you have one stashed away somewhere.

Assault weapons for Canadians?

Don't worry about the USA.
You'll have your own problems with the Justin Trudeau led Liberals back in 2015.
America always sorts its shyt out.
Bans have been tried in America and they failed every time.
I'd be more concerned about that long and growing "prohibited" firearms list in Canada if I were you.
Harper pulling the rug out from under the firearms advisory committee a few weeks ago isn't a good sign of good things to come for Canadian gun owners.

Damn fellas, I knew the laws were bad up there but I had no idea they were that bad

Any one of you guys ever head down to Tennessee or Mississippi, shoot me a PM....we can take my FN FAL out and do some damage

I think my brother has an FN of some sort -- probably a C1A1. We used the old FN in semi auto configuration (C1A1) as our main battle rifle on the police force for quite a number of years before it was replaced by a Ruger Mini-14. What a poor trade that was -- lighter in more ways than one.

Assault rifles will be banned in Canada before they are banned in the USA.
I don't envy Canadian gun owners once heir apparent to the Canadian throne Trudeau Jr. moves into the big house on Sussex Drive.
The Canadian Anti-gun Witch of the North Wendy Cukier makes Dianne Feinstein look like Annie Oakley and her & Trudeau Jr. will get along really well.

Cukier and Feinstein have something other than their aversion to private ownership of guns in common and many, if not most of the rabid "gun banners" share this with them.

It is a most disturbing aspect of contemporary North American life that this particular small minority has such enormous and enduring influence on US and, now, on Canadian political policies, domestic and foreign.

I just saw Cukier on TV a couple days before Christmas and what I noticed were her eyes, hard, cold and brutal. She and Allan Rock, the former Canadian "Justice Minister", have exactly the same cold, cruel and arrogant eyes.....they look exactly like old photos of Reichs Fuhrer Reinhardt "Hangman" Heydrich, the "No. 2" man in Himmler's Gestapo.

Look for yourself, the resemblance is just eerie and VERY disconcerting.

Kute: It is called a "soul-less" hatered for anyone who is in opposition thier agenda.

I saw this look while serving in the former Yugo as a Peacekeeper. As a Medic, obligated to help anyone regardless of politics, many times I was placed between opposing clans and I remember that look.Very disturbing and yes, we now see it directed towards ourselves by supposed fellow Canadians. Not a good scene at all.

True, but, that is not what I had in mind and the issue is becoming one of great difficulty for Canada and our traditional policies/allies as our PM's behaviour makes all too apparent.

I meant the cold look in thier eyes was the same as your examples as well as where I had seen it. Pure comparison is all.
Way beyond normal politics.

Fascist psychopaths, simple as that. They are RIGHT, everyone else is wrong and they KNOW what is "best" for all of us......much like Adolph Hitler, who also had the hard, cold, stare...........

Dammit Kute, why da Hell do ya always have to post things I agree with so strongly??? Whether it is you Canuckians or us guys down here, Free,honest and repsonsible folks should have these guns at their disposal. We do as gunners have an unspoken responsibilty to weed the mad dogs from our ranks. So,as much as I love teasing the daylights out of you guys and occasionally getting pissed off when I detect too much British influence we are actually the best friends either country is likely to see. The real enemy for us all is government power run amok. The tools to end that must be ours.

It is the decline in REAL ...British influence..., here in Canada and in "The Old Commonwealth", i.e. Australia and New Zealand, that IS our major problem.....which, btw, was/is the crux of my point here.

The perversions wrought upon our British parliamentary government and constitutional monarchy, are MOST obvious where firearms issues are concerned, however, there are other, deeper and even more insidious forces now attacking Canada, some of "cultural" and others of economic type and they ARE winning.

The entire "Official Multiculturalism" and "Human Rights Commission" mess is the most obvious problem, but, the constant attacks upon our British-based and once-proud culture, are even more destructive and these largely are in our (laff,laff) "education system" and corporate media. The latter is largely owned and controlled by the same group that the "gun grabbers" draw so many members from.

...detect too much British influence..., why, would the internal, cultural mores of a foreign nation concern you, given that Canada, is hardly a military threat to the USA? This, is an issue about Americans, that has always puzzled me, but, as you say, the ties of friendship are strong and we certainly agree on the whole ...government power... point.

The initial thing I would love to see is the government enacting legislation to prevent the corporate ownership of large sections of Canadian mass media. This, is one MAJOR problem in this country and it should not be allowed.

as far as assault weapons"....

im still struggling to figure out what "weapon" i couldnt commit an "assault" with

SAKO75;
I hope this finds you and yours acceptably well this last Saturday in December '12.

Your comment is of course exactly on point and succinctly shows the problematic approach that is typical of those who wish to ban tools.

I recall vividly having a conversation decades ago with an RCMP Constable when we were having FN FAL's go on the restricted list. I suggested to him that there was no logical reason for what was essentially the beginning of a ban on them.

He replied that if someone pointed an FN FAL at him, he wouldn't be able to tell the difference between a semi-auto version which we were speaking of or a full auto capable version that was already prohibited here.

When I heard that particular line of flawed logic, I responded my saying that if someone pointed a single shot Cooey .22 at me he had my undivided attention and that wouldn't change one iota regardless of the color of the rifle being pointed at me.

Anyway I'm not sure I changed anyone's mind that day, but the Constable did concede that he really wasn't keen on being shot with anything either.

To my way of thinking, those who wish to ban tools - guns in this case - find it easier to do if they can compartmentalize certain tools and then give them labels which might frighten the uninformed and uneducated.

I actually was plowing out my neighbor's driveway a day or two back and got into this discussion with them. They are nice enough folks, but certainly would be considered politically much to the left of where I stand......of course I'm a wee bit right of Attila the Hun.

Anyway they were all for banning this and that tool and finally admitted that they'd like all guns banned. I pointed out that for instance Mexico currently had a ban in place and it didn't take a lot of research to see how wonderfully that was working out for them.

I also pointed out how armed the Finns and the Swiss are - my take and opinion being that either here or in your homeland, any issues with violence and tools are emphatically not tool issues.

Anyway sir, I am cognizant that I'm preaching to the proverbial choir here, but this is only to let you know that I do preach to the congregation and the people on the streets as well.

Lastly, according to my faulty memory of assault stats here in Canada, knives and assorted clubs were used many fold more times than any firearms. Again, it's not a tool issue we have here - it's a deep rooted societal cancer that some would rather treat with some cough syrup than the chemo we need.

On a cheerier note, I do hope that 2013 is a banner year for you and your family sir - all the best to you all.

Dwayne

Kute,I shoulda been more precise with the comment about British influences. CURRENT not Traditional. BIG difference. Currently the Brits have become a client state. Folks would rather be on the dole than working. I think taht is a fair illustration of attitudes in general.

Well there is always the Mennonite assault rifle -- a 760 Remmy pump 30-06.

Fellas, the Brown Bess was the "assault weapon" of its day. Higher than average rate of fire (original definition of "firepower") mounted a bayonet and HORRORS, they were used for assaults!! EVIL STUFF THERE!!

Great Britain, certainly has their share of problems, much of which stem from their magnificent stand against the spread of totalitarianism, in two World Wars, alone, for almost all of "The Great War" to our victory and for much of WWII.

However, London and New York, still are the two top financial centers in the world, exchanging the first and second positions regularly and the enormous cultural influence, worldwide, of England, on literally billions of people(s) exceeds that of either Russia or even China.

The reputation of the British is respected everywhere, their military is THE pattern for almost every successful military on Earth and H.M. Queen Elizabeth II, is the one monarch, who can and does travel worldwide to be greeted with admiration and respect.....the "upper classes" in the eastern US fawn all over her.

When, Britain's little outpost in "The Falklands" was attacked by the macho Argies, the outpouring of volunteer support here in Canada and in the other Dominions, was enormous....we were ready to fight and win, as we always have, against the bloody invader and while the offers were refused, they were genuine...I know, I was among them.

So, old boy, many if not most Canadians and, certainly, those, like me, of the families who built this nation over the past almost 400 years, WANT the British influence here, now and forever.....God Save The Queen!!!

I would like to re-do our rather pathetic Constitution, however and here is where I feel the USA got it right and we should use yours, largely written by English liberals, as a "pattern".

The other aspect of this is many, me included, want British influence to stay strong to fight off the hated "monsewers" and "the multicult mob".

The "Assault Weapon" label changes for us every election. SOB's! I have two that would probably qualify, a Ruger 10-22 because it can accept high capacity mags, and my M1A Supermatch for the same reason. I bought both because they are fun to shoot. If I had to defend myself in my home, I surely wouldn't use either one. I would use a handgun on short notice. If I knew it was coming and had a moment, I'd stuff the Remington 1100 with #4 bird shot. 5 shots as fast as I can pull the trigger and minimal over penetration.

I had a guy try to steal an outboard motor off a boat on the deck. I pointed my .44 mag at him through the sliding door. After he ran off, I called the police. They told me I was lucky I didn't shoot the guy. I'd have been arrested for malicious intent. I looked into it and you really don't want anything around that says to a jury "I was just waiting to kill the guy who breaks in." Assault Weapon, Street Sweeper, Black Talon Bullets, Personal Defense loads, 000 Buckshot... Doesn't look good in the papers, and a jury probably won't appreciate it. Having someone break in and shooting them with your bird gun with bird shot sounds a whole lot better, and less malicious. Doesn't make the guy less dead, but helps your case.

A nice Remington or Beretta trap or skeet gun with a 26" barrel, improved cylinder choke, and a nice 1 1/4 oz heavy pheasant load is a very potent personal defense, and it implies nothing of malice or predisposition to harm someone. "I heard the window downstairs break and I grabbed my bird gun, stuffed in a few bird loads and went downstairs to investigate!" Sounds better than a police report saying the home owner used a Spas 12 street sweeper shotgun with 12 round extended magazine and Shredder anti personnel buckshot loads." Doesn't it!

Yup, the "rot" is EVERYWHERE, the magnificent "Second Amendment", notwithstanding. The statist goons, minions of the corporate elite stand ready to arrest/imprison a decent citizen for DARING to protect his family, home and possessions.....

I chased an intruder out of my kitchen, who calmly walked in at dusk, several years ago, another New Years Eve, with my Ruger GP-100. Calling the VPD is a total waste of time, they act as though YOU are "the bad guy" because you have GUNS and will not respond in person to many calls.

I have a Benelli Nova with 3.5" No 5 Turkey loads and if I HAD to use a gun to protect my semi-invalid wife, that is my first choice.

I despise lawyers, politicians, power-tripping cops and all the useless, tax-wasting apparatus of the state, that cannot and does not protect we citizens and, yet, militates against our BIRTH RIGHT to do so.

Both Canada and the USA NEED to get back to the ideals of our Viking founders and support self-defence and home protection with NO state interference. I would bet that a new political party here in Canada, based on this and a few other basic issues might do very well in elections.

Some good points.
Years back, when the young fellows carried a fancy club in the cars, I told them that would look bad as "Exhbit A",to the jury.
I recomended a straight claw hammer. A bit easier to pass off as pure self defence.

A mag lite (big aluminum flashlight) is even better.

By the way, the viking reference made me think of a passage I read in Michael Critons Eaters of the Dead. He said that viking long houses had one door and it was very low, only waist height so people going in had to stoop. One could stand aside and lop their heads off if they came in uninvited!

Hate to be looking for directions in that neighbourhood.

A baseball bat is even better........much more effective & more explainable.
Classification: Kid's toy
Officer asks: "What were you doing with a baseball bat on the back seat?"
My response: "I've got 2 teenage boys officer. Teenage boys play a lot of baseball."
Yup.....to the cops (who let's face it are and always were minions of the government) we're worse than the bad guys the criminal justice system molly coddles just for having guns. It's not hard to see where this is all heading with Obama, the UN & the ATT, Soros, Bloomberg, Pelosi & Feinstein backing the backstage international super-rich elite who themselves are surrounded with armed body guards.
When the LPC regains power in Canada under Justin Trudeau whose father was a champion among the elite international gun banners the Canadians will no doubt be turning in their handguns and semi-autos as soon as the next "enabling' mass shooting incident happens.......and the incidents will continue to happen because political correctness and the disarmament agenda is more important to them than even our kids and they will not post armed guards in schools no matter how many kids are slaughtered. They will never let the truth get in the way of ideology.

I would say then, it depends on what fits. I heard a a story about a tiling spade as a weapon. "I'll cut your head off". The man telling the story said, 'I think it he could have done it too".
Course, these "tools", don't have much reach.
I suppose we could live in a tower, and pour bolling oil on intruders.
That might be a step backwards for civilization, and another place Brother Keith might not want to ask directions.

. . . . . . . . . . and have you checked the price on a barrel of oil lately? Ammo is cheap alongside that stuff.

Ah, yes, another good point. Used oil I suppose, but then it takes fuel to boil it.
If a fellow could just not be assaulted in the first place, things would be simpler.

And why are we afraid of the consequences?

If an intruder breaks into my home at 3 am uninvited, I assume he has evil intent, and I'm prepared (since I'm married to the same woman I've loved for the past 55 years) to take WHATEVER action necessary to defend her. I don't care what is stolen, it can be replaced, but I'll NOT allow that intruder to steal the life of my wife!!! There's NOTHING material I own that's worth taking a life over, BUT at the mere hint of my wife being harmed, I will take whatever action necessary. And Canadian law will defend me!!

Yeah, I might detest the attitudes of some officers of the law, and some court minions, but I'd take it to the highest court in the land if need be, and to the Highest Court that rules over all.

Oh yeah, you're right, I am being monitored right now by someone, we can't escape that, but I'm not afraid... I had my 77th yesterday, and "what can mere mortals do to me?". My life is owned by Another. If my wife is harmed by ANYONE, there'll be "hell to pay", literally.

A number of years ago, when I was pastor of a Toronto church, we helped sponsor a radio ministry behind the "Iron Curtain". The speakers/preachers were Russian and Polish. The Russian was a member of our church, and made several trips to Russia each year in support of Christians who were tortured, persecuted, discriminated against, imprisoned and living constantly under the treat of death. Always, he was followed and interfered with by the KJB. Whenever he returned to Canada, within a week, CISIS was ringing his doorbell! He invited them in politely. They "asked" ("interrogated" would be a more precise term)their 50 or so questions, with a tone of accusation, which he politely responded to. The interrogation was over within an hour or so... then he politely asked them to leave, which they did. His comment was: "I got used to it... it wasn't really that much different than my interviews with the KJB!".

And he wasn't trying to be smart... he was just being his normal, pleasant self... which perturbed his examiners on both sides of the ocean.

Bob

www.bigbores.ca

Hot sand works as well as oil. It's cheap and you can heat it with wood fires.

With all due respect you need to wake up & smell the coffee guy.
The Canadian criminal justice system routinely persecutes and prosecutes citizens for defending their homes, loved ones and property with guns. There are several noted cases on record.
If you defend yourself in Canada with a gun you will very likely be charged and even if you are acquitted the legal costs will break you financially.
If you don't take the offered plea bargain which means surrender of your firearms license and all your guns for no compensation your looking at tens of thousands of dollars in lawyer fees.
The Canadian legal system would prefer to draw a chalk line around the dead bodies of you & yours on the floor of your own home than see you use a gun to defend yourself.

That is substantially correct and the majority of current L.E.O.s also are very "anti" self-defence by firearms and this comes from considerable firsthand experience. They seem to feel that THEY alone should have the rights outlined in Sections 33-37, of The Criminal Code of Canada and we "serfs" merely exist to pay their inflated salaries.

So, keeping a $3000.00+ "black gun"to "defend" one's hacienda, is largely a fool's means of dealing with the frequent home invasions and brutal attacks so prevalent in "multicultural" Canada and there ARE better ways of defending oneself,family and so on.

The MOST important one,is to ALWAYS phone your local coppers for help, and we keep cell phones with us for this. If, you MUST shoot to save your wife from the savagery we often see in "The Peaceable Kingdom (HA)", then, when the court sits in judgement on you, the fact that you TRIED to get help might assist in your defence.

Some years ago, an Eaton, used a handgun to ward off an intruder in one of their palatial homes and NO charges were ever brought forth; WE are NOT Eatons or Westons or Thompsons or Irvings and thus we are vulnerable to the morally decadent state in which we live, sad to say.

We NEED changes in Canada and soon and the first should be to close our borders, make Canadian citizenship more difficult to obtain and to always cancel the status of a "naturalized" citizen and then deport them for ANY crime!

So very true....a sad state of affairs for sure.

Changes are needed in Canada my second country of citizenship but who is going to make those changes?
Even before the Newtown, Connecticut tragedy Harper had already sent clear signals that the abolition of the long gun registry was all the Canadian gun owners were going to get. The bulk of the oppressive Liberal C-68 firearms bill is still in effect.
Who is going to make these changes? The Justin Trudeau led Liberal government in 2015? I hardly think so.
The RCMP, the CFOs and the Quebec government will have enough information to reinstate the long gun registry and handguns and semi-automatic long guns will be banned to punish the Canadian gun owners for backing Harper and his Conservative party.
And YES, the majority of Canadian gun owners wlll re-register their long guns.

Sad, that an immigrant to Canada, sees the FACTS of this situation more clearly than most Canadian gun owners allow themselves to do.

That said, I very seriously doubt that the LPC WILL form another government for quite some time to come and, while "La Dauphin" may become P.M., it will not happen as simply as many seem to think.

NOW, repeat, NOW,is the time for the YOUNGER shooters to get busy, form political alliances and elect solid "PRO" people to The House of Commons. We older, as in 60+ folks are about done and having been active in fighting gun control since I was 21, am 66 now, I am tired, have a semi-invalid wife to consider and no younger relatives to help. So, it's up to the people who have most to lose.

IF, Harper, sees a political advantage to it, he will accept that committee's proposals and even more gun freedom in a "New York Minute", the man is ALL about opportunism and that is politics in 2013, all over the globe.

Very good post, "pricedo", welcome to "the Great White North" and keep up the good work!

I dont see it. Long gun owners balked at registration already, and they will balk again. Less than 50% of long gun owners registered their guns when C-68 went through, and after this fiasco I see less than 10% compliance the next time.

I never registered a single long gun I owned, and I waited out the storm until the registry was done. And I didn't bury these guns, either, I used them for hunting and shooting at the range. Mos people know did the same.

When the BC Co's checked us while hunting, they were universal "Don't even bother to look for your registration certificates, because we don;t give a crap about them. Just show us your guns are unloaded in your vehicle and your hunting licenses, and that is it"

RCMP were a little less emphatic, but similar. "You hunting? okay. You got PAL's? Great, lets see them. We only need to see one for all of you. Guns registered? Yes? Great. We don't need to check. Thanks"

Canadians will never submit to another long gun registry as long as most of us will live. Even the cops think it's bullshit.

Don't get me wrong here, I never had nor ever will have any liking for the long gone gun registry, but I did register my guns out of respect for law.
My question Gatehouse is this.... you claim to have had no registered firearms so then how did you acquire your much bragged about Ruger Alaskan after the registry was in effect.
If that is so you broke the then existing law as did the store that sold a registered firearm to you without a transfer,obviously not a legal transaction.
You set a fine example as moderator on a so-called hunting forum.

Busted?? ;-).

Friends don't ask friends questions like that on a public forum.

Don't ask, don't tell.

Bud, has a VERY legitimate point here and with all respect to Gatehouse or anyone else here, I would be VERY cautious concerning an open admission to breaking Canadian laws.

Gentlemen, we are NOT "out of the woods"on this, yet, and very likely will see further destructive activity by the forces of the essentially fascist gun banners.....and Harper, WILL do whatever will get him votes!

I would be cautious about an open admission to breaking Canadian law because there will always be someone who will get their panties in a twist and try to moralize about it.
I found dealing with the registry interesting. I called once to register a rifle I planned to take to the next gunshow. The caliber and barrel length were not original. Whenb told I would have to take it to a verifier, I replied that I had no intention of going to a verifier and they could register or not register it and I didn't care much one way or another. The rifle was then registered.
We can only hope the registry stays gone and continue to push for reasonable regulations concerning restricted and prohibited arms. GD

Harper will do what he thinks most voters want.
Really, when you think about it isn't that how democracy is supposed to work?

What burns my butt is the liberal media brainwashing Canadians into thinking guns and hunting are evil with lies, misconceptions and pure BS!

It's not a level playing field where all the facts are being reported honestly to Canadians so they can make balanced decisions.

The problem is not the politicians.

The problem is the media and their anti-gun, anti-hunting prejudicial brainwashing using misinformation and outright lies.

Do you mean politicians, like Harper's man,Peter Kent......?

Sorry, old boy, but Harper's agenda for Canada, will include slow and total disarmament of all Canadians. I no longer really care, I have no children, my nephews.niece do not shoot and own guns and I have all the guns I can ever use and will for as long as I want them.....but, I would no more trust Harper, than I did Mulroney or Chretien.

YMMV,of course, that's S.O.P. for forums of this sort.

A guy with a pair of kahunias so let's gang up on him because he makes us feel ashamed of ourselves cause we rolled over and took it dry from the Chretien Liberals......typical.

"I never registered a single long gun I owned"

Looking objectively at his statement he didn't say that he didn't have any registered firearms.

I think he said that he never actively registered a gun that he owned before the long gun registry came in.

Any gun he purchased legally after the long gun registry became law would be automatically registered for him at the point of purchase.

No, I don't see anyone bashing Clarke, whom I have exchanged many PMs with on a few forums,often helping with backpacking gear advice as I am much older than he and have been at it for decades.

What, I DO see, is some merely offering a cautionary post and some of us doing so actually have employment experience of a nature that tends tosubstantiate our concerns.

Courage,is great, but, remember the full-on frontal attacks on Dominion Day, 1916, at "The Somme" and what that cost us.....sometimes, a little more discretion wins a greater victory in the long term, as the C.E.F. under Bing's brilliant training/leadership showed at "Vimy" almost a year later..........

If I annoyed anyone or gatehouse with my post I do apologize here and now.
However to my way of thinking to brag about defying and / or breaking any law of the land is really no different than a 16 yr. old boasting on Youtube that he ran Mommie's Beemer up to 100mph on the freeway just for the sake of receiving accolades from his pimply-faced audience.
Lets be more discreet... the anti- gun group does not need more fodder... my two cents...

The question is, was it an open admission of a crime being committed? Or was it a clever play on words? Gatehouse can be quite sly with word smithing at times, and that is my take on it. :-)

I think alotta Canadian gun owners engaged in "dumb civil disobedience" after the LGR became law........in other words they didn't register all their guns and kept their mouths shut about the guns they didn't register.
One Canadian I know registered a made over 303 BR Lee Enfield that had a cheap Tasco scope on top, a cheap as dirt NEF 12 gauge to hunt with & kept the rest unregistered and locked up.
If there is an attempted resurrection of the LGR in the future I expect significantly less compliance than with the first LGR.
Dumb civil disobedience.......a severe lapse of memory in regards to bad laws brought on by political cowardice & stupidity seems to be spreading like wildfire in America now too under the threat of the Feinstein ban bill.
The Feinstein ban bill provisions that will confiscate ARs from dead Americans sounds alot like Section 12 of the Canadian Firearms Act.
I think these antis are reading from the same playbook.

Harper says he won't relax prohibited weapons, rejects advice of advisory group

By Bruce Cheadle, The Canadian Press December 6, 2012

Prime Minister Stephen Harper welcomes new MP Eve Adams at the start of caucus meetings in Ottawa on June 1, 2011. Conservative MP Eve Adams says there's no connection between violence against women and more changes to Canada's gun-control laws being considered by the Harper government.

THE CANADIAN PRESS/Adrian WyldOTTAWA - Prime Minister Stephen Harper has issued an unexpected rebuke to his government's own firearms advisory committee, rejecting its recommendations and suggesting the group's membership may need revisiting.

Documents obtained by the Coalition for Gun Control reveal the committee advising Public Safety Minister Vic Toews wants some prohibited weapons, including hand guns and assault rifles, reclassified to make them more easily available.

The 14-member group is also pushing to make firearm licences good for at least 10 years, rather than the current five � a measure opposed by police who say the five-year renewals are a chance to weed out unstable gun owners.

Coming on the anniversary of Montreal's Ecole Polytechnique massacre � in which 14 young women died at the hands of a deranged gunman � the documents provided opposition MPs with new ammunition to fire at a government that earlier this year repealed and destroyed the federal long-gun registry.

But even as gun enthusiasts cheered the proposed reforms Thursday on online message boards, Harper was pouring cold water on the committee in the House of Commons.

"Let me be as clear as I can be," the prime minister said in response to a question from NDP Leader Tom Mulcair.

"Prohibited weapons exist as a category under the law for essential reasons of public security. The government has absolutely no intention of weakening that category of protections."

Harper stressed repeatedly that the recommendations contained in a March 2012 "memorandum for the minister" are not government policy.

And when interim Liberal Leader Bob Rae suggested the government's advisory committee � which is dominated by sport shooting enthusiasts and those opposed to gun control � needed wider representation, including from police chiefs, those fighting domestic violence and groups dealing with suicide prevention, Harper all but agreed.

"I will take the advice of the leader of the Liberal party under consideration," Harper responded.

"I'm obviously very concerned with some of the recommendations made in that report, and I think the committee does need some re-examination in that light."

The prime minister's comments will certainly be a come-down for gun enthusiasts who were cheering a Toronto Star report of the committee recommendations earlier Thursday.

"A shocking outbreak of common sense? What are they drinking in Ottawa these days?" said one poster on Outdoorsmenforum.ca.

"This is great!! I am so glad we have a government that has some common sense ... at least for now," wrote another.

Conservatives used the Liberal long-gun registry as a prime fundraising tool and rural electoral wedge issue for more than a decade. But now that the registry is gone, the government appears to be playing down further changes � at least for broad public consumption.

Two important developments this fall, the final destruction of all gun registry data outside Quebec and the further postponement of gun-marking regulations, were proactively announced by the government to the gun lobby but not to a national audience via the news media.

Toews' firearms advisory committee is co-chaired by Steve Torino, the president of the Canadian Shooting Sports Association.

It includes prominent anti-registry advocates including Tony Bernardo, a self-described gun-rights champion with Torino's CSSA; Greg Farrant of the Ontario Federation of Anglers and Hunters; Linda Thom, an Olympic gold medallist in pistol shooting; and Niagara police constable John Gayder, an advocate who has written pieces such as "Is Modern Gun Control Hazardous to Police?" which posits that gun control "will prove to be as disastrously misguided as leech therapy, shock treatment and Thalidomide were to the field of medicine."

The Canadian Association of Chiefs of Police has actively lobbied to be represented on the committee, without success.

"The CACP is very interested in being represented on this committee, as this would provide you with timely and balanced advice on firearms issues from the leading law enforcement organization in Canada," the association's president, Toronto Police Chief Bill Blair, wrote to Toews two weeks after the May 2011 election.

Rae emerged from the Commons to suggest the prime minister "has learned something from this experience."

"This is an area where frankly the public does not share the ideological enthusiasm of the Conservative back bench," Rae said.

"People are just not interested in increasing access to weapons. They're interested very much in reducing access to dangerous firearms."

Both Harper and Toews stressed the Conservative government's firearm focus is now on tougher sentences for gun-related convictions.

"We've made it very clear that we see no benefit to the long-gun registry," Toews told the Commons.

"However, what we have indicated is that we must continue to implement measures that in fact target the criminal use of firearms."

The Public Safety minister also noted that firearms crime rates are at their lowest in 50 years.

The homicide rate from guns is down 30 per cent since 2008, Toews added, "because of the very strong measures that this government has taken against the criminal use of firearms," drawing a huge round of applause and desk thumping from the Conservative benches.

Bob, "Babyface" Cohen, his REAL name, is among the most odious and disgusting politicians I can recall in Canada, during my lifetime. He, typifies the university "trained" '60s leftist-liberals, who are convinced that THEY are ENTITLED to RULE OVER we mere "serfs"in their glorious "Just Society", which WE pay excessive taxes to support.

When, "Babyface" was the Premier of Ontario, a disastrous era in Canada's past, he made L.E.O.s write a freakin' report EVERY TIME they unholstered their sidearms. This totalitarian policy was eagerly administered by "Zanana Akande", a token Negress, who was his cabinet minister concerned....she, had as much real qualification for this post as "Boy George" has and all this did was to WASTE time and taxes.....hey, what else have Lieberals and "Dippers" ever accomplished?

Harper, is a cheap opportunist, but, the alternative??????? God forbid!!!!!

Can't blame Harper for being political........that's what politicians do too survive.
I sure wish Harper was managing the US economy rather than "buy votes with free stuff" Obama who'll rack up enough debt in the next 4 years to bankrupt the next 10 generations of Americans.
Mitt Romney found out the hard way that a prudent business plan for getting the economy back on track can't compete with "free stuff" to get votes.
At the end of his 2 terms Obama will have spent the country into financial slavery to hold on to power.
I don't think the next 4 years is going to be real good for American gun owners.
Canadians got it good with Stephen Harper........in a real world he's as good as it gets.

Stop calling them ASSAULT WEAPONS!!!!!!! They are either military surplus rifles, or semi-auto rifles which LOOK like military rifles, but aren't.

Hear hear!

The functional difference between a military assault weapon and the civilian knock-offs is that most assault weapons like the M16 & Kalashnikov have a select fire switch that allows the soldier to switch from semi-auto (1 shot per trigger pull), 3-shot burst (1 trigger pull generates 3 shots at the firearms design cyclic rate) and full auto (will fire as long as trigger is depressed).
The civilian models are capable of semi-auto fire mode only.
Some Americans mistakenly feel that you can appease or placate the gun grabbers by giving up 1 kind of "bad" gun and then they will go away.
The antis will transfer the "bad gun" donkeys tail to every type of gun until there is not a single firearm left in civilian possession.
YOU CANNOT APPEASE THE GUN GRABBERS - THEY WILL EVENTUALLY TAKE AWAY ALL CIVILIAN FIREARMS IF WE LET THEM !!

I agree, just like the smoking nazis...first no smoking in planes, then restaurants, then bars....and now they are trying to enforce anti smoking in public parks and on beaches for Chrys sake!! If it starts with the anti gun nazis...it will be the same thing.