Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Handguns Ithaca 1911 A1 from WWII era "Lunch Box Gun?"

At the gun shop I saw an Ithaca 1911 A1 with correct US military markings. Excellent condition (looks nearly new), except the serial number was strange. Looked like it was put on amateurishly in large font. I asked the owner and he said it was a "lunch box gun." He explained that it was likely either made from parts that were smuggled out by a worker from the Ithaca factory during WWII or it was smuggled out whole before it got a serial number. Later, in order to make it legal, the police department put a serial number on it when it came into the hands of a cop who inherited it from his father.

They want $800.00 out the door for it. My question is, since this is not really a military 1911 A1, is it worth $800.00? I mean, it probably never had its parts fitted together to factory standards, i.e., it was likely made from freshly made Ithaca parts that were smuggled out one by one. Looks practically new, though. It looks great, in fact, until you notice the odd serial number. Is this a risky purchase, or a "jump on it" deal? Thanks.

Back in the '60's I was stationed for a while at a USN shore facility in SEA where the quarterdeck watch was armed with a 1911 that was passed from watch to watch. It was an Ithaca. You never know, Hawkeye, it might have been put together better than factory specs. As far as value, I'm not one to comment on that. I have no knowledge of collector value. If I saw it and it looked good to me, I'd offer the guy six and a half and negotiate from there.

The negotiation boat already sailed. It was priced at $900.00 plus tax. I asked him if he'd take $800.00 "out the door," and he said he would. He allowed me some time to think about it.

Never buy the story, only buy the gun. If it's not a properly marked Ithaca, it's not an Ithca, period. Now that said, doesn't mean it's not a good gun, but my bet is, it's rather over priced for something built up on a less than righteous receiver.

YEP!

Both the receiver and the slide are properly marked and are clearly Ithaca made. Even the space marked for the serial number is correct, except what follows it is not a factory type serial number (it clearly left the factory with no serial number). No effort was even made to make the serial number look "factory." Font size and type are way off. Looks just like a police department armoror (who didn't give a crap what it looked like) put it on there. Other than the serial number, though, it is clearly an Ithaca WWII era 1911. But since both you and T Lee would have reservations at this price (an Ithica in this condition would normally be over two thousand dollars, by the way), I think I will pass on it. I might feel differently if I could test fire it, but short of that I am now leaning away from the deal.

If you want it, get it.

If not, pass.

I would much rather have a perfect WWII Ithical representative, i.e., one with factory engraved serial number, but seems to me that even just for the parts it would be worth what the guy's asking (says "United States Army," "Ithaca," and "US Property" in all the right places). Thing is, though, I was planning on using that money to square me up with my credit card debt, which is why I'm even debating the purchase, really. Otherwise, if it was just spare cash, I'd go for it I think. Maybe I'll sleep on it.

Either you're wanting it, and trying to convince yourself not to get it (in which case you'll kick yourself later), or you don't want it, and are trying to talk yourself into it (in which case you'll kick yourself later).

Which one is it?

If only I had the answer to that question, I'd know just what to do.

There are just soooo many of us who have that affliction.

I know it well............. too well..............

No.

I mean, it probably never had its parts fitted together to factory standards, i.e., it was likely made from freshly made Ithaca parts that were smuggled out one by one.

Just because the SN looks odd doesn't mean it's not factory. To me, it just simply wouldn't be worth the chance though.

If you're really getting into collecting, you should've flown in to Tulsa last weekend. It is THE collector show. There was tons of collector stuff there. Evidently the big-time collector's are even nervous about Obama and are divesting themselves of their high-dollar stuff before something comes down. Knowing some of these clowns personally, I have to chuckle a bit.

Nah. Ithaca probably didn't start serial numbers with XX. The number's not even in a straight line. It clearly looked like whoever did it didn't give a crap what it looked like, or about consistency with all the other authentic markings. Their only concern was obviously just to make it legal to own and register in New York (which is where I am at the moment).

well, one thing I would NOT worry about is the fitting issue, since any .45 that stayed in service for very long got parts replaced out of an armorer's drawer, and factory hand fitting was minimal to non-existent on wartime production 1911s. I've heard about lunch box guns, but never saw one, it that's what it is.

the prices being paid for original WWII vintage .45s are breathtaking these days....but if it were me, I'd hold out for one without the squirrelly serial number.

The only lunchbox gun I've seen was a Colt's. It had no serial number, no inspector's mark, but did have the "US Property" mark.

As Steve suggests, the fit isn't an issue.

A single X at the beginning of a serial number indicates an arsenal re-work of a stolen gun. I have seen one so marked. The guns were marked at the various arsenals.

Are there any other markings on the pistol? If not, you may be correct that it was a lunchbox gun.

Every other mark on the gun is identical to a WWII Ithaca 1911 A1. Even the word "No." (for serial number) is there and in perfectly correct form, but it left the factory with a blank following it. The only thing non-standard about it is the serial number.

That's reassuring. Maybe I will go back today and take a more careful look at it. Maybe I'll even field strip it.

I would not give any more than $400.00 for it.

Gun stores usually have at least a 50% mark up on used guns and I'll bet the owner paid no more than 350.00 for it.

It's on consignment. No way anyone's getting a near mint condition WWII era Ithaca USGI 1911 A1 for $350, or anything close to that these days, funky serial number or no.