Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Ask The Gunwriters Hollowing butt on laminated stock to lighten/shift balance- anyone done this?

I seen an article/info where a stock company, perhaps Boyds offered lam stocks that had the butt hollowed out, said it would knock off 6-8 ounces or so, and that you can also cut a groove in bbl channel. Would the last step 'weaken' forearm? How much would you cut in it.

On the butt of stock, how much to cut - anyone know?

Art (Sitka Deer) is the man in the know on this question.

Get him in on the thread, and pay very close attention.

Thanks-

Art, you around?

Sitka (Art) is one of the moderators.

Use Sitka Deer in header, he will catch it. He might see it quicker on the campfire forum.

There are some links stored somewhere, but I've not been smart enough to type the correct search yet.

You may not like what you hear if you ask Art about laminated stocks.

Gotcha, remember some of the posts, but if your gonna mess with laminates those were good threads, for the info and the humor, .

Helps one to maintain a well-rounded philosophy, like me~~~ !!!

Click on search at top of page. page opens to other windows to fill in. In top Search window highlight the subject body type

" laminates "

Notce I put space between the quote marks and the word at BOTH ends of the word.

The rest of windows are self-explanatory for date range and no. of pages & review info on posts. Just enter max, I think 2 yrs.

Click search. If I haven't made clear,, click on tips for search located near subject area.

Sitka's name will be highlighted in green, so easy to find. The review of post will help speed info you are looking for. And, believe me there will be more than you want to know.

Sitka may be busy right now. I was searching to specifically to get the info. Sometimes a simple word works better on the search function here. A lot of the inquiries on the forum have been rehashed so much, there is a lot of good info already here. Saves posters and searchers a lot of time in the long run. If you find a name you like info given, you can enter that with subject in the name window also, to narrow the posts. And,... you might want to read them all, some are pretty funny. Sitka is recognized as the forum authority (well one of them anyway, ) on woods.

Gosh... I am flatered and my cheeks are red! But I will remain seated so they don't show!

I routinely hollow butts and channels in the hunt for 20-25 ounce wood stocks with quickness and heft neatly matched.

A laminate stock is not going to make it into that weight range, but it will be slicker than it was from the factory.

I made a set of calipers... Essentially a pair of very long skinny "S" curves of aluminum pinned in the exact middle with a bolt and wingnut. Bending them gently so the two ends meet at exactly the same time produces a way to reach way down into a hole in a buttstock to measure the wall thickness.

I start with an auger bit of about 1 1/4" and bore three holes between the butt pad screws. They will overlap. I measure the wall thickness frequently and when I start getting nervous I switch to a smaller bit and keep drilling. Let your brow be your guide...

For the forearm I hog out almost all of the guts and bed sections of old fishing rods in the groove I cut out. I use epoxy with a lot of micro-balloons to keep weight to a minimum.

Laminates are harder to drill and tend not to track as straight when drilling, so be careful! Wall thickness of 1/4" at the skinniest point is what I am comfortable with... YMMV. I have cut them thinner. I have yet to drill through the side of a finished stock...

Not sure which stock you are looking at, but the average laminate can shed (puke?) at least 1/2# of guts.
art

Art,
I just put a couple holes in the buttstock of my mountain rifle. On the triger pull scale, my SPS stock weighs 1 1/2#; the wood mtn rifle stock weighs the same now, plus 4oz. for the recoil pad. Balance of the rifle is almost the same with both stocks. Gonna go a bit wider and deeper with my holes to see if I can shed the extra 4oz. I only put two 3/4" holes in, but feel better about taking a bit more out after reading your post.
Mike

If you have a friend who is a serious woodworker, try to get him to lend you his Forstner bits.

These bits have a razor sharp rim which allows them to cut straight even if the edge of the bit is partially over a void (like overlapping holes to reduce weight!) and regardless of how the grain twists and turns. You can also start them on even a severe angle, and they will continue to go straight.

They are a joy to use (the so-called "sawtooth Forstner bits" act mostly the same, but the edges of the holes are rough & ragged, not polished and smooth like real Forstner bits). This won't matter inside a buttstock of course.

Here is a picture of a good set at www.leevalley.com :

These bits have to be used with a drill press, and they are rather expensive.

However, they were designed to make overlapping holes (to make mortise joints) -- you won't go back to spade bits, twist drills, or even brad-point twist drills after you have used one.

You may need an extension to go full depth on a buttstock.

John (woodworker/cabinet maker on the side...

I'd love lighten up by a few oz. a Remington APR I have but when I remove the screws for the recoil pad it will still not come off?? It seems to be glued or epoxied or something??? Anyone figure that out yet?? Thanks, 163bc

jpb
You make several good points about Forstners. The reasons for my choice of screwpoint auger bits are many. I use Forstners to start the holes and until I run out of shank length. I have never foound shank extensions I could like.

A very sharp auger bit will cut clean, fast and deep. They mostly cut straight, but not as straight as the Forstner. That is why I stop and measure often. While I have never drilled through the side of a stock I have decided to lay some epoxy-soaked fiberglass cloth on one side of a hole before... maybe more than once!

I do most of my stock boring on a big wood lathe with tremendous speed control through a 3-phase motor and an inverter. My drill press is not as user-friendly as my 600# or so lathe (Harrison Union Graduate on steel pads).

The biggest issue with Forstners is the lack of cutting speed and the need to constantly stop to clean the cuttings out. But either will work well as long as their limits are understood.
art

Hi Art

You sure got it right about the Forstner's lack of cutting speed! I would look for something faster if i was doing this for pay! Just a hobby for me.

I know what you mean about problems with extensions too. I have bought 3 or 4 in various lengths over the years, but I got only one (about 6") that would run true. I wish I get could other lengths in the same brand, but the one I have is only marked "West Germany" so I have no idea who made it.

I only have a floor model drill press to use, but I can sure appreciate a big lathe's rigidity and speed control.

Thanks for the insight on other ways to skin this particular cat!

john

The best way to use a Forstner bit on a buttstock is with a drill press.
If the hole through the middle of the table is big enough, you can sometimes hang the stock under the table and run the recoil pad screws through a strip of lattice and the X-slots on the press table, then tighten the stock up square to the bit.

If not, srew the butt to a strip of 1/2x2 and clamp that to the table. Swing the table out of the way of the drill, and use a C-clamp to position the stock under the bit. Draw a pencil line between the two screws to center it up. Set the stop on the drill bit so you make them all the same depth. You can always go back and remove more. Drill about 5 or 6 overlapping 3/4 inch holes in the space of 3 adjoining holes (9/4", or 2.25 inche overall).

Lee
Nice reading suggestions from someone that has clearly never done it. Please save the protests, okay?
art

I've had Lee24 on "ignore" for a long time, having read too many of his/her posts which were clearly the result of one minute spent on Google. However, Art's post got me curious, so I did read Lee24's post.

I can't imagine Lee24's idea working, or if it did work (on a very soft wood stock), you are just a little pressure away from disaster. We are talking about a lot of pressure to make those Forstner's cut in endgrain dense walnut, or glue-filled laminates fer Christ sakes!

Forstner's take quite a bit of pressure to cut, and relying on a couple of small buttplate screws in tension is crazy.

... back on "ignore" for Lee24.

John

Agree with the pressure factor on the Forstner bits. Only drilled two 3/4" holes in my buttstock, with it padded and chucked in my vise, using a 1/2" drill. It took a fair amount of presure and time, which was OK, as I didn't have enough opportunity to get off track.

Beauty of the screw end auger bits is the help they give dragging the bit in. Would of course turn from asset to debit pretty quick if they went sideways...

+1 on that! Don't ask how I know! (but in my defense, I was just a teenager when I learned the hard way).

John

Art, would a pilot hole help keep the screw end auger's running straight?

Am considering lightening a stock at this very moment, but will probably just use an end mill.