Just for clarification, I believe the one on the right was called copper point expanding. I shot my first deer at 15 with a long branch number 4 mk1 303 with the 180 gr KKSP.. also my first moose. It was very accurate. particularly with those bullets. around 1 1/2 inch with the peep sight. Others were more like 2 1/2.. Miss those days and hunts.