I finally found some brass. Loaded 12.7 grains Lil Gun (prvi brass wouldn't hold 13 without some work to keep from spilling), federal 205 and 40-grain VMax. Shooting 5 in about 3/4" at 2800 fps from my Browning Low Wall. I was looking in an older Hodgdon Annual Manual and it showed the 13-grain load to be 28,000 CUP, so should be mild pressure. great round.