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Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 403
Campfire Member
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OP
Campfire Member
Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 403 |
Is there any real difference in the DESIRABILITY of pre-64 M70's by period of manufacture such as pre-war guns, immediate post-war guns, 1950's, or 1960's? If there is, what makes the one more desirable over another? If not by period of mfr, is there any feature change or modification that makes one preferred over another? I realize a lot of this can be subjective and I understand there's a lot less of the pre-war guns around simply because of their age, modifications, usage, etc but were there any quality considerations, features, or something else that makes one "better"? Not trying to create a lot of flaming among the members, just curious. Thanks yooper
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Joined: Jan 2004
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Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
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Pre-wars were made better than post-war M70's but they are not easily mounted with a scope. The Transition guns IMHO have the quality of the pre-wars but are drilled and tapped for a scope.
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Joined: Mar 2010
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Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 1,070 |
Yes there is quite a difference for us model 70 snobs. Pre wars were the ultimate in quality, no short cuts. They had far better wood than guns in the 50's. Twenty line checking and a bulbous pistol grip. Transitional models are nearly as well finished but have the advantage of drilled for scope and a safety that was scope friendly. Eighteen line checkering by this time but still a bulbous grip and good wood. Buy 1949 the desirable cloverleaf tang was gone, for cost cutting reasons, and the safety we all came to admire arrived. The bulbous grip was sawn flat again for cost cutting reasons. Then in 1953 the front sight was no longer integral with the barrel but was soldered on for more cost savings. 1959 saw plastic butt plates, smaller checkering, round bolt shroud and sometimes inferior wood, all cost cutting procedures. As time went on fit and finish suffered. For me personally, 1952 was the last year I liked the model enough to buy. All gun manufactures were having difficulty in securing decent wood in the 1950's. Only Winchester sent a letter out apologizing for the poor quality and promising to improve when better supply was available.
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Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 48,387 Likes: 45
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 48,387 Likes: 45 |
Pre-wars were made better than post-war M70's but they are not easily mounted with a scope. The Transition guns IMHO have the quality of the pre-wars but are drilled and tapped for a scope. I was hoping you would answer the OP's question..
I try to stick with the basics, they do so well. Nothing fancy mind you, just plain jane will get it done with style. You want to see an animal drop right now? Shoot him in the ear hole. BSA MAGA
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Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 48,387 Likes: 45
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 48,387 Likes: 45 |
Yes there is quite a difference for us model 70 snobs. Pre wars were the ultimate in quality, no short cuts. They had far better wood than guns in the 50's. Twenty line checking and a bulbous pistol grip. Transitional models are nearly as well finished but have the advantage of drilled for scope and a safety that was scope friendly. Eighteen line checkering by this time but still a bulbous grip and good wood. Buy 1949 the desirable cloverleaf tang was gone, for cost cutting reasons, and the safety we all came to admire arrived. The bulbous grip was sawn flat again for cost cutting reasons. Then in 1953 the front sight was no longer integral with the barrel but was soldered on for more cost savings. 1959 saw plastic butt plates, smaller checkering, round bolt shroud and sometimes inferior wood, all cost cutting procedures. As time went on fit and finish suffered. For me personally, 1952 was the last year I liked the model enough to buy. All gun manufactures were having difficulty in securing decent wood in the 1950's. Only Winchester sent a letter out apologizing for the poor quality and promising to improve when better supply was available. My favorites were made after 1955: This is when the good fwt's came into play. I also love the 338 win mag and those weren't available until 1959. Based on stuvwxyz's post, he's chit out of luck if he only buys rifles built before 1952. I'm glad guys like him exist because that means there's one less guy out there buying the ones I like...
I try to stick with the basics, they do so well. Nothing fancy mind you, just plain jane will get it done with style. You want to see an animal drop right now? Shoot him in the ear hole. BSA MAGA
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Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 1,742
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
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Posts: 1,742 |
Aside from mid 50s SG Featherweights I prefer transition guns. It's hard to find pre war guns anymore that aren't beat up even for collector $$ so I don't have any currently.
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Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 13,000
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 13,000 |
I've had shooter-grade pre-wars, transitions and 50's guns. All of them are noticeably better finished than guns from the 60's. Of all of them, I liked the transitions the most but I wouldn't pass up a good 50's gun. My current pre-64 is a '52 standard .270 and it's as smooth in action as the '47 transition 30-06's I've had.
The FWT's I've had have all been '56-58 guns and they were nicely finished, a tick below the transitions but not too much of a tick.
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Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 8,189
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 8,189 |
Yes there is quite a difference for us model 70 snobs. Pre wars were the ultimate in quality, no short cuts. They had far better wood than guns in the 50's. Twenty line checking and a bulbous pistol grip. Transitional models are nearly as well finished but have the advantage of drilled for scope and a safety that was scope friendly. Eighteen line checkering by this time but still a bulbous grip and good wood. Buy 1949 the desirable cloverleaf tang was gone, for cost cutting reasons, and the safety we all came to admire arrived. The bulbous grip was sawn flat again for cost cutting reasons. Then in 1953 the front sight was no longer integral with the barrel but was soldered on for more cost savings. 1959 saw plastic butt plates, smaller checkering, round bolt shroud and sometimes inferior wood, all cost cutting procedures. As time went on fit and finish suffered. For me personally, 1952 was the last year I liked the model enough to buy. All gun manufactures were having difficulty in securing decent wood in the 1950's. Only Winchester sent a letter out apologizing for the poor quality and promising to improve when better supply was available. I like your answer stuvwxyz. I have some of each era, but I still like the pre '54s the most. donsm70
Life Member...Safari Club International Life Member...Rocky Mountain Elk Foundation Life Member...Keystone Country Elk Alliance Life Member...National Rifle Association
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Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 1,070
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 1,070 |
Yes there is quite a difference for us model 70 snobs. Pre wars were the ultimate in quality, no short cuts. They had far better wood than guns in the 50's. Twenty line checking and a bulbous pistol grip. Transitional models are nearly as well finished but have the advantage of drilled for scope and a safety that was scope friendly. Eighteen line checkering by this time but still a bulbous grip and good wood. Buy 1949 the desirable cloverleaf tang was gone, for cost cutting reasons, and the safety we all came to admire arrived. The bulbous grip was sawn flat again for cost cutting reasons. Then in 1953 the front sight was no longer integral with the barrel but was soldered on for more cost savings. 1959 saw plastic butt plates, smaller checkering, round bolt shroud and sometimes inferior wood, all cost cutting procedures. As time went on fit and finish suffered. For me personally, 1952 was the last year I liked the model enough to buy. All gun manufactures were having difficulty in securing decent wood in the 1950's. Only Winchester sent a letter out apologizing for the poor quality and promising to improve when better supply was available. My favorites were made after 1955: This is when the good fwt's came into play. I also love the 338 win mag and those weren't available until 1959. Based on stuvwxyz's post, he's chit out of luck if he only buys rifles built before 1952. I'm glad guys like him exist because that means there's one less guy out there buying the ones I like... Some people like redheads some like blonds. I have had a few featherweights over the decades. I even had a featherweight 338 Win Mag. From what I hear it was the only one known. Of course I rebored a 264 Win featherweight barrel and rechambered it. You did not need to open the bolt to know if it went off. I even possess a 1950 vintage 338 now. Again I took a worn out 30-06 standard weight barrel and rebored and rechambered. I shot a lot of elk and deer with a 338. A great round. I even have a 1959 featherweight 06 that I am about to put on gunbroker soon. Well I will let you have the featherweights and you can pass the pre wars to me. REGARDS Steve
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Joined: May 2012
Posts: 2,253
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: May 2012
Posts: 2,253 |
Mr GSP, has my favorite std, pre 64, Transition early enough to have 30GOV'T 06 , Metalwork and bolt just seems smoother yet its factory drilled for modern base. Im looking for a cloverleaf tang, uncut std stock for a National Match gun that saw very few rounds down it, it will be my last pre 64 'project gun. very best WinPoor
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Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 1,070
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 1,070 |
Winchesterpoor, the cloverleaf tang stocks are so hard to find. Uncut is the catch. I have 2 spare cloverleaf stocks I have picked up over the years but alas they are both cut.
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Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 48,387 Likes: 45
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 48,387 Likes: 45 |
Winchesterpoor, the cloverleaf tang stocks are so hard to find. Uncut is the catch. I have 2 spare cloverleaf stocks I have picked up over the years but alas they are both cut. My friend had a very nice transition rifle with a clover leaf tang. He offered it to me for $800.00. It was drilled and tapped and had been refinished and reblued, but was beautifully done. I still wish I would have bought it, even though at the time I had 5 06's... .
I try to stick with the basics, they do so well. Nothing fancy mind you, just plain jane will get it done with style. You want to see an animal drop right now? Shoot him in the ear hole. BSA MAGA
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Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 3,168
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 3,168 |
Winchesterpoor, the cloverleaf tang stocks are so hard to find. Uncut is the catch. I have 2 spare cloverleaf stocks I have picked up over the years but alas they are both cut. My friend had a very nice transition rifle with a clover leaf tang. He offered it to me for $800.00. It was drilled and tapped and had been refinished and reblued, but was beautifully done. I still wish I would have bought it, even though at the time I had 5 06's... . That's what I want for the start of a 35 Whelen!
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Joined: May 2012
Posts: 2,253
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: May 2012
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Winchesterpoor, the cloverleaf tang stocks are so hard to find. Uncut is the catch. I have 2 spare cloverleaf stocks I have picked up over the years but alas they are both cut. Mr STUVWXYZ, Let me know what you need for a nice one and I will just have to put a repro pad on it,I have no problem with refinished wood when its done nice with the deep winchester red, they usually look like they should have when they left Winchester! I can live with a pad too, my only real dislike is 4 holes in the side of the receiver for a G&H type mount. Being cut I will have no problem adding pillars and a nice bed job. She should drive 165 gr nails then! . If you will let one go PM your needs. very best WinPoor
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