Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Long Range Hunting Is ther a node here?

I got a 4" 5 shot group at 1048 yards doing most all that silly stuff with a factory rifle And as y'all say 3/4" 5 shot groups @ 219 yards all day loooong.

I don't think you should give up.

Ringman,
You need to keep your components the same or as much as possible. The ONLY variation needs to be your powder levels. From what I've seen you're not consistent with the equipment, and or pulling shots.
Like Rick said, adjust your powders and when you get signs of pressure stop!!!!

Then you need to look at your target....these guys are truing to help you but it doesn't seem to be getting through. It is pretty frustrating at first I will admit. Stay the course and keep it simple....

Good groups by the way guys....I recently [bleep] a 7 shot group with my 6mm that I can cover with the base of the shell.....I need to measure it.

You do realize that nothing you've posted supports your contention that weighing charges to the nearest .01 grain makes a difference?

I've never read or seen anything to support that. Don't you think that if weighing charges that precisely mattered, then all the competitive benchrest shooters would be doing it? How is it that they're not, and you're the only one who's ever reaped the benefits of your technique?

And aren't you the same guy who was touting the fact that you weighed your H-1000 to the nearest 0.02 grain? Only to find out that a single kernel of H-1000 weighs .04 grains?

Need to fine tune that vertical stringing...

DF

My Gempro is less accurate than both my Redding and RCBS beam scales. Just saying....

With all this chatter, you guys must not have anything to do in Sept. We`re all hand loaders.....IME, All hand loaders can do some funny things.....in this case,does not mean it`s wrong.

No one said it's "wrong," but axtell says it makes a difference, and it doesn't.

A kernel of H-1000 weights ~0.02gr, my scale defines to 0.02gr so there can be an error of up to +/- 0.04grs. This is as close as I can get with the equipment I have, so why not, its about managing the variables.
A nice tight 3 shot group looks good but what will it do at long range? I seen nice tighties like that fall apart at 1000yds, not always mind you.
Is using a Lee powder dipper to get good results the way to go?

You need better equipment.

Back in college chemistry, we had scales in Quantitative Analysis with glass door we had to close to get a reading. Air movement in the room would throw them off...

DF

A little science here:

A 30-06 with H-4350 and a 168gr TSX-BT

58.00gr 57148 psi 2786fps
58.02gr 57211 psi 2787fps
58.10gr 57463 psi 2791fps

Ok, now reduce the COL 0.040"
58.00gr 58706 psi 2804fps

My contention is that small variances in powder weight and different lots, bullet weight, case volume, COL, primer brands and different batches of same, neck tension and all that goes with it make a cumulative difference.

So the question might be for any individual were do you sign off on the process?

In my experience I took a factory rifle that would print ~14" at 1000yds and brought it down to 4" for 5 shots. It can do better but I have not been able to lower my ES enough yet.

Now we're getting somewhere. Calculate the difference in pressure and velocity resulting from a .01 grain variation in powder. Then compare that to the difference in pressure and velocity due to small variations in the variables you listed plus others such as changing barrel and chamber temperatures from one shot to the next.

Let us know what you find out.

Translation: You can weigh your charges to the individual kernel of powder and it will not make your muzzle velocities identical. There is absolutely nothing you can do to make shot to shot muzzle velocity identical.

Even if it was possible to do so, there would be no guarantee that your rifle would shoot in one hole at long range or even group with zero vertical. Barrel harmonics have more to do with good groups and zero vertical than does a constant velocity.

If the bullet is coming out of the muzzle at the exact same velocity every time, but at the WRONG TIME DURING BARREL MOVEMENT, your groups and vertical will suck.









Kinda tough to hit targets this size if you have a bunch of vertical in your load. The Audette eliminates vertical.






Seems to have worked at 1150

Agree, there will always be variances. The challenge is to mitigate those variances as best as possible. This is my goal in hand loading for long range.
So, in practice (barring mechanical issues) the group of cartridges that generate the same pressure every time and exit the barrel on a 'node' will be the most consistent. This will show up on the chronograph (low ES) and be translated to the target (small groups).
I am not arguing the Audette method doesn't have merit, its just that I like to have science to explain things.

rcamuglia.....nice shooting!

I hope you understand that weighing to the thousandth is an exercise in futility. If the load is in the node, upward slope barrel movement will counteract small variances in muzzle velocity and make all the POI as similar as possible.

Thanks!

Reloading can be like jerking off, some are in it for the stroking, some for the come shot.

A shooter will reap more benefit from this handloading step than trying to weigh charges to the thousandth...

Yep and checking for concentricity.

DF

What exactly does Neck turning offer - Better bullet alignment?
What models brands work for the frugal recreational shooter.