Home Forums Hunting & Shooting General Big Game Extreme Long Range Shots?

Doc, (and smokepole), you are correct, sort of.

The long range "hunting" that I have done is limited to shooting gophers ( ground squirrels) at hundreds of yards away on the open prairie. I can only surmise that the skills involved in shooting a gopher in the head at 400 yards is not too different than hitting an elk in the chest at 700. But I'll never know. Because I treat gophers as pests, and targets of opportunity. Their fate is to be poisoned otherwise. I have way too much respect for an elk to take the same approach with them. And because I think we have a moral responsibility to the game animals we hunt.

I have not been influenced by television hunting shows, because I have not had a television in my house for several years. But I have been hunting elk and deer too often with people who watch TV and fancied themselves as long range "hunters". That experience has been entirely negative. In my experience, my companions were focused on technology, and equipment, shooting, and not on hunting skills. Any animal that they saw was an opportunity to shoot, not an opportunity to hunt. And several animals paid for their attitude of entitlement to run away gut shot, or with a jaw dangling, or a leg swinging. Those shooters did not have the skill to follow the tracks of the wounded critter, or even to find the exact spot where the far distant animal was standing with any consistency.

Ironically, these same sad excuses for hunters were not giving themselves all the advantages they imagined with their specialized equipment. Unable to make a shot on a game animal that trotted across an opening in front of them at under 100 yards, because they were so focused on their long range obsession that they couldn't find it in their 16X scope or swing their bipod encumbered 26" heavy barrel rifle in time to make the shot. But there is never any real harm done by not taking a shot.

We all have the great good fortune to live in countries where we do not have anyone looking over our shoulder when we hunt. But the game laws in North America are only the absolute minimum of behaviour that the public requires. Yes, I am guilty of moralizing, and of value judgements. I would be happier if more of us chose to hunt with our responsibilities in mind, not just our rights. I am guilty of believing that the animals we hunt deserve our respect and also our best behaviour. Amoral behaviour and lack of judgment is not doing our hunting fraternity any good.

Well said sir!

Smokepole,

I do not care if you shoot deer out of towers or at long range. I am not ranting against it, saying it should be outlawed, or it is a crime against humanity.

You seem to care an awful lot that I consider shooting animals at long range a tremendous display of marksmanship, not hunting prowess.

What demonstrates more shooting skill, shooting an animal at 1000 yards or 50?

What demonstrates more hunting skill, getting within 1000 yards of an animal, or 50?

I say it takes zero hunting skill to get within 1000 yards. If that hurts your feelings, tough sh!+, not BS.

That is why long range hunting is an oxymoron.

Just like the term prairie dog hunting, there is no hunting involved, it is prairie dog shooting. But you probably do not understand that either, or it hurts your sensibilities.

Once again, I am done responding to you.

I say if a guy has the skill and right tools, go for it. Everyone has different tastes and opinions. Some guys love archery,some handguns, some black powder, what ever floats your boat.

Heck I remember a time when 300-400 yards was a long shot. Now with modern scopes and range finders it is cake for most guys. That and guys shoot a lot more these days then say back in the 60s,70s and 80s. How many of us can remember our dads and his friends having a box of ammo that was several years old. Those boxes are considered collectors items now. That and the fact they grew up coming out of the depression era and ww 2. They always said ammo and guns were hard to get in those days, so they didn't waste anything.

But what pizzes me off the most is how tv shows have turned hunting into an enterprise. A billion dollar business. For Petes sake, to go try to shoot hogs today is going to cost me 250 bucks apiece for me and the kid. Then add gas, food and want ever else. And, we might not even see anything.

However I look at it as time spent with the boy, as he is 15 now and will be doing his thing shortly. It will be nice to make memories while we can.

You and me both, pal. The best shot I never made was at maybe the biggest bull caribou I've ever seen at 261 laser ranged yards. The rifle was zeroed at 225. No rest, heavy brush within 100 yards of the animal, near dark, cross-hairs all over the place. The boy and I came back to the camper grinning like fools after a very fine stalk from a half mile away. A fine time was had by all!

The last caribou I shot was at 433 laser yards, with a rest (snow machine windshield) and very much sub-MOA .30-06 zeroed for 300 yards. I'll shoot that thing as far as my Leupold 800si will read. With a good rest. And other considerations.

IMO, anything beyond 300 yards (all my other guns are zeroed for 200) is "long range". One must stay within one's capabilities, the rifle, and those of the conditions. All of which may vary.

I personally will not push much past 500- about the range the si will read an animal. Even with a range finder that will read beyond that, it is shooting (IMO), not hunting. Heck- I consider anything past "point blank" of the firearm sight in to be shooting, rather than hunting. But I shoot beyond that to eat, sometimes. I'm prepared to do that, to some extent.

If the bastids will hold still for a 30 yard shot, that's my menu!

Thank you for that but I don’t partake in either. The longest shot I’ve taken at a big game animal was 400 yards, and every elk I’ve killed has been with a muzzleloader or bow. The difference between you and me is, I don’t denigrate the way others choose to hunt by saying they’re “not hunting."




No, I really don’t care what you think. I just care what you post on a public forum about hunting, and if you post something I disagree with I’ll comment on it. I hope you don’t mind.



Do you realize that you could substitute “200 yards” for “1,000 yards” here and what you’re saying would be just as true? So tell me, is a 200 yard shot “not hunting?” I’m sure you (and lots of others who say long range is not hunting) think a 200 yard shot is hunting, because it’s something within your capabilities, and something you’ve probably done. But it’s still hypocrisy.





No, it doesn’t hurt my feelings, it’s just wrong, so I commented on it. And I see that you're now qualifying your remarks by saying 1,000 yards, where you previously used the broad brush of "long range," which is what I commented on.

The thing is, the distance at which an animal can detect you and react depends entirely on the animal and the situation. I’ve been on late-season pronghorn hunts where they’ve been chased around for a month or two. In those situations, if they see you at 600 yards, they’re moving. In some situations, it’s probably more “ethical” and shows more “respect” for the animal to have practiced your shooting enough so that you can make that shot on undisturbed animals, rather than risk sneaking in closer, spooking the animals, and getting a closer shot on alerted animals, which don't tend to stand around broadside. The best hunter is the most versatile hunter.

And by the way, this past August I hunted animals that could spot hunters at over a mile, and would spook at that distance. We spent a lot of time belly crawling at over a mile away.

Now, if you want to say "sneaking in to 50 yards is more difficult, and more of a challenge than taking a 500-yard shot," I'd agree with that under most conditions. That doesn't mean the 500-yard shot is "not hunting."



LOL, talk about oxymorons!

Have a nice day.

C&B, Thanks for taking the time to write that out, I can't say I find much to disagree with. Slob hunters like the ones you describe below are a minority for sure, but all too common at short range and long range. They are really a disgrace. I count myself lucky that I've never hunted with anyone like you describe below. And I agree that as hunters it's our responsibility to call out unethical practices.

Which is why I try to draw such sharp lines between "unethical," "not really hunting," and "not how I like to hunt."

As far as long-range hunting, I think it comes in for a lot of unfair criticism because it's an easy target (sorry) and also because most hunters don't shoot long range so it's an "us and them" thing. I hunt mostly in the early primitive weapons seasons (bow and muzzleloader) and I see the same things happening. A guy with a bow who tells me "I just got a shot, but missed" and I ask him how far. His reply, "not sure, I think about 60 yards." Lots of animals are wounded but not recovered during archery season, but archers get a pass because they're "really hunting" and "sh** happens." Or hearing seven shots in quick succession, and then seeing the guy who shot, with a muzzleloader and a .44 revolver (illegal), and nothing to show for it. Or the idiot who shot a 14 year-old bowhunter in the chest and killed him here last season with a muzzleloader.

To me, the whole thing comes down to limiting yourself to the shots you can make, and that applies equally to all weapons at all ranges.

And yes, the merchandising of long-range hunting gear (or any gear for that matter) on TV shows makes me want to puke also.

"The idea you killed a game animal at spitting distance is no big deal now-a-days with sent blockers and Hecs clothing."

Bullshit.

I'm prepared to kill as far as my Leupold 800si will read an animal, but no farther. Conditions pending... More than 300 yards is mere technology. My last 2 caribou kills, a couple minutes apart, were at @ 290 estimated, and a ranged 433, with a sub MOA rifle zeroed to 300 yards. Easy-peasy, but the "hunting" was all in running the country (snowmachine) and finding the 'bou... .not in a stalk. And yes, I had a helluva good time... The killing was the least/worst of it. But I gotta say, I was satisfied with the skill of it.

It is far more challenging, and satisfying to me (YMMV), to get within "spitting distance", especially in open country, than to "rangify" my kills.

But I like to eat....

Me too. Sometimes, it's not all about "the stalk," it's about putting meat on the ground.

Have you seen the Canadian hunter proficiency tests? It's been a couple years sonce I last viewed them, but as I recall, only about 30% of "hunters" can make a killing shot on a whitetail at 100 yards, first time.

Somehow, I don't think that's limited to Canadians.....

I just want to know what skills are required to get within 1000 yards of an elk (seems that yardage has come up several times). Not shooting skills, the hunting skills needed. mtmuley

Real men bowhunt...haha although as of late I hear more and more folks talking about practicing and shooting out to 100 yds.

Go figure...?

I want to know what skills are "required" to follow a Hunting Guide around the woods? He's hunting, you're just the shooter.

I want to know what "skills" are required to shoot a cougar out of a tree? The dogs were hunting.... again, you're just the shooter.

I know it takes tremendous "skill" to sit in a tree over a trash can full of donuts and "hunt" bears.

I don't LIKE any of those scenarios..... and I'd prefer to never participate in those practices. But, I'm not gonna stoop so low as to drag folks who do through the mud, or tell them they weren't hunting.

Hey, just asked a simple question about the topic at hand. mtmuley

castnblast,



When I started on my journey to be a good rifleman thirty years ago, I had a 28" heavy barrel 7-.300 Weatherby. The first time I took it hunting I didn't take a shot at a walking deer about 30 yards away because there was no bench rest. I started doing lots of offhand shooting with that rifle. I would the not hesitate to take a 200 yard shot offhand at a deer's head. I could hit running dear in the chest with ease. It's not the long barrel, it is the guy holding it.

CRS,

You lost the logical argument with Smokepole so you're leaving?

Those who can do and those who can't complain. My son-in-law practices at 100 yards a lot. One time he came to where I was digging a ditch for some wiring. He got ready to shot at something. I looked and said, "That's at least fifty yards away." He corrected me and said, "It is fifty-five." He shot one shot and hit a cap from a one gallon milk jug. A couple years ago he got a coyote at 89 yards. You have to know your equipment and ability. I don't bow hunt. I tried it fifty years ago and didn't like it.

I'm not entering any discussion -aka-argument, just expressing MY feelings & opinions.

dogshooter, I totally agree.
I've been a hunter as long as I can remember.

I have no desire to 'shoot' a lion out of a tree NOR a bear eating bait. Anyone else can it IS legal just not for me.


Jerry

Not many skills required to do that. Non-hunters do it every day, and some don't even know they're within 1,000 yards.

But then again, IMHO, it's not very difficult to get within 100 yards of elk in timber. You have good cover and quiet footing, so all you have to worry about is wind. I can't count the number of times I've been that close or closer, but couldn't get a shot. Last time I went elk hunting as a matter of fact it happened twice. Getting within 200 is a breeze compared to the skills required to get within, say 30.

But we're not talking about just getting close, we're talking about hunting. Getting within range is only part of the equation, and sometimes it's the easy part. If you ask what skills are required to hunt and kill an elk at 1,000 yards, you get a different answer.

And if you ask which is more difficult, killing an elk at 1,000 yards or at 100 yards, that would be interesting to ponder. I'd wager that very few if any participating in this thread have the skills to reliably kill an elk at 1,000 yards.

And almost all who've been hunting elk for any length of time can say they've killed one at 100 or less.

Does shooting bunnies and jacks with a scope sighted rifle count as moving target practice, because if does, then I do.....