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Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 238
Campfire Member
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OP
Campfire Member
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 238 |
Swat arrives, determines that there is an active shooter, & waits 3 hrs to act. One official said: "It was too dangerous to go in, right away".
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Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 18,215
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 18,215 |
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Joined: Jan 2012
Posts: 26,529 Likes: 3
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Jan 2012
Posts: 26,529 Likes: 3 |
30 hostages. Glad I wasn't charged with making that decision.
FJB & FJT
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Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 29,786
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 29,786 |
Swat arrives, determines that there is an active shooter, & waits 3 hrs to act. One official said: "It was too dangerous to go in, right away. Sack the lot of them and put them on lolly pop duty at the local school...same thing with those that want a military career with guaranteed no danger.
These are my opinions, feel free to disagree.
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Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 4,263
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 4,263 |
That sheriff dude had to be a little warm wearing all that stuff around here. Can't imagine he would last more than a minute or two in a fight.
I'm better when I move.
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Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 11,694
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 11,694 |
30 hostages. Glad I wasn't charged with making that decision. This...
Every normal man must be tempted, at times, to spit on his hands, hoist the black flag, and begin slitting throats.
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Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 4,263
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 4,263 |
30 hostages. Glad I wasn't charged with making that decision. I thought that it was protocol to go in as soon as the perp started to kill.
I'm better when I move.
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Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 115,424 Likes: 13
Campfire Sage
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Campfire Sage
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 115,424 Likes: 13 |
It is SOP to move forward with an Active Shooter situation but every situation can change minute to minute.
I don't know the details of this particular situation but it sounds like the shooting began, stopped, and started again.
Dave
Trump being classless,tasteless and clueless as usual. Sorry, trump is a no tax payin pile of shiit. My young wife decided to play the field and had moved several dudes into my house
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Joined: Dec 2013
Posts: 14,810 Likes: 5
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Dec 2013
Posts: 14,810 Likes: 5 |
It would seem that police procedures need an update like airlines have learned since 9/11. The people are not in to high jacking or hostage taking. They aim to kill. The old routine of setting up a perimeter and getting the guy on the phone won't accomplish much and in lots of cases, is likely to be a distraction so one guy can negotiate while his buddies kill people.
If Hans Gruber could figure out the SWAT hostage routine thirty years ago, I expect real terrorists have planned for it today.
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Joined: Oct 2013
Posts: 8,490
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Oct 2013
Posts: 8,490 |
The terrorist want to make sure that the news people have time to get there.
Writing here is Prohibited by the authorities.
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Joined: Jan 2012
Posts: 26,529 Likes: 3
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Jan 2012
Posts: 26,529 Likes: 3 |
30 hostages. Glad I wasn't charged with making that decision. I thought that it was protocol to go in as soon as the perp started to kill. No idea, but I reiterate: DAMN glad it wasn't on me. I would presume[as flave stated] every situation is different?
FJB & FJT
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Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 43,761
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 43,761 |
Hard to imagine sitting outside for hours while listening to shots being fired inside. Heck, it's hard to imagine sitting outside for minutes listening to shots being fired...
“ The Savage 99 Pocket Reference”. All models and variations of 1895’s, 1899’s and 99’s covered. Also dates, checkering, engraving.. Find at www.savagelevers.com
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Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 115,424 Likes: 13
Campfire Sage
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Campfire Sage
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 115,424 Likes: 13 |
Hard to imagine sitting outside for hours while listening to shots being fired inside. Heck, it's hard to imagine sitting outside for minutes listening to shots being fired... If I stop shooting, am I an Active Shooter? Dave
Trump being classless,tasteless and clueless as usual. Sorry, trump is a no tax payin pile of shiit. My young wife decided to play the field and had moved several dudes into my house
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Joined: Oct 2013
Posts: 8,490
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Oct 2013
Posts: 8,490 |
Would swat be able to know of the hundreds of text messages being sent from that location?
Not to read them, but to know hundreds were being sent during those three hours, thus knowing of survivors.
Writing here is Prohibited by the authorities.
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Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 57,487
Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 57,487 |
That sheriff dude had to be a little warm wearing all that stuff around here. Can't imagine he would last more than a minute or two in a fight. LOL. Fire gear ain't cool, and doesn't breathe at all. In our heat I"m up for a fighting a structure fire for about 15 minutes max... of exertion...
We can keep Larry Root and all his idiotic blabber and user names on here, but we can't get Ralph back..... Whiskey Tango Foxtrot, over....
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Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 1,813
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 1,813 |
I have no clue with police or SWAT Business but it seemed EXTREMELY odd to me too.
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Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 43,761
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 43,761 |
Hard to imagine sitting outside for hours while listening to shots being fired inside. Heck, it's hard to imagine sitting outside for minutes listening to shots being fired... If I stop shooting, am I an Active Shooter? Dave I have no idea of what LEO's define as an active shooter nowadays. Here is what is being reported as the timeline, and considering it's from the MSM I expect serious problems with it but it's the best I see. http://www.cnn.com/2016/06/12/us/orlando-shooting-timeline/2:02am: shooting starts 2:22am: shooter calls 911 and pledges support to ISIS 3:58am: Police post message on twitter saying shooting at Pulse, stay away from area 5am'ish: Police fired off dummy explosives to distract shooter, used armored vehicle to smash door and allow some folks to escape, cops shoot suspect in doorway. One policeman shot but saved by kevlar helmet. Cops started arriving on the scene within minutes, by 5am they had almost 100. Reports suggest they had scores within the first half hour. Apparently there was some communication by the shooter with folks outside, but the cops are not saying whether the shooting continued during the wait or not.
“ The Savage 99 Pocket Reference”. All models and variations of 1895’s, 1899’s and 99’s covered. Also dates, checkering, engraving.. Find at www.savagelevers.com
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Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 42,620
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 42,620 |
The Chief gave a pretty good narrative of why it went down how it did and it made sense to me. Terr exchanged gunfire with the off duty cop at the door then went inside, two more cops arrived and went in, exchanging gunfire with the Terr who retreated into the bathroom (where he killed more), then the shooting stopped. SWAT called in and a plan was formulated involving breaching a cement wall with explosives. The whole time the Terr was in contact w a negotiator and there was no shooting. Things were getting nowhere, so the Chief made the call to go in. Explosive charge failed to fully breech so the Bearcat "RV" finished the job and the Terr died in a hail of gunfire. There was also a danger of IEDs so that had to get sorted as well.
Last edited by jorgeI; 06/13/16.
A good principle to guide me through life: “This is all I have come to expect, standard lackluster performance. Trust nothing, believe no one and realize it will only get worse…”
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Joined: Dec 2013
Posts: 14,810 Likes: 5
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Dec 2013
Posts: 14,810 Likes: 5 |
Imagine how many people bled out in three hours.
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Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 115,424 Likes: 13
Campfire Sage
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Campfire Sage
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 115,424 Likes: 13 |
That reports tells us nothing.
Travis
Trump being classless,tasteless and clueless as usual. Sorry, trump is a no tax payin pile of shiit. My young wife decided to play the field and had moved several dudes into my house
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