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Campfire Sage
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Campfire Sage
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I was speaking of .38 Special target wadcutters. Back in the day, cops routinely shot these at the range, often provided for them. As suggested by the other poster, this was later frowned upon, and for good reason. The difference is extreme between felt recoil of these and .357 Magnum loads. By 1980 bigger metro departments were qualifying with what they carried on duty. By then things had already changed. It was this change, by the way, that found the flaws in the S&W K-Frame .357 Magnums, which were never intended to consume a regular diet of Magnums. The idea was to practice with .38 Special, and even carry defensive loads in .38, but also be equipped with Magnums in case a situation called for it, such as a road block.
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
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I was speaking of .38 Special target wadcutters. Back in the day, cops routinely shot these at the range, often provided for them. As suggested by the other poster, this was later frowned upon, and for good reason. The difference is extreme between felt recoil of these and .357 Magnum loads. By 1980 bigger metro departments were qualifying with what they carried on duty. By then things had already changed. It was this change, by the way, that found the flaws in the S&W K-Frame .357 Magnums, which were never intended to consume a regular diet of Magnums. The idea was to practice with .38 Special, and even carry defensive loads in .38, but also be equipped with Magnums in case a situation called for it, such as a road block. Split forcing cones, and cracked frames at the barrel threads on the underside where the crane sat. Even departments that used .38 Special +P's would eventually crack frames if they were shot enough. Colt had the same issue with +P's. The K frame was perfect for .38 Special and you can even say that for .38 Special +P, but it really is marginal for .357 magnum. They really should be shot about 80/20 special/magnum. Still, warts and all the M19 is one of my favorite handguns of all time.
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Campfire Sage
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Campfire Sage
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Still, warts and all the M19 is one of my favorite handguns of all time. Sure. That and the 13.
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Joined: Jun 2016
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Campfire Member
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Campfire Member
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I was speaking of .38 Special target wadcutters. Back in the day, cops routinely shot these at the range, often provided for them. As suggested by the other poster, this was later frowned upon, and for good reason. The difference is extreme between felt recoil of these and .357 Magnum loads. By 1980 bigger metro departments were qualifying with what they carried on duty. By then things had already changed. It was this change, by the way, that found the flaws in the S&W K-Frame .357 Magnums, which were never intended to consume a regular diet of Magnums. The idea was to practice with .38 Special, and even carry defensive loads in .38, but also be equipped with Magnums in case a situation called for it, such as a road block. Split forcing cones, and cracked frames at the barrel threads on the underside where the crane sat. Even departments that used .38 Special +P's would eventually crack frames if they were shot enough. Colt had the same issue with +P's. The K frame was perfect for .38 Special and you can even say that for .38 Special +P, but it really is marginal for .357 magnum. They really should be shot about 80/20 special/magnum. Still, warts and all the M19 is one of my favorite handguns of all time. So, are you guys saying it took from 1957 to 1980 to find "flaws" with the Model 19? You are getting your cause and effect all messed up. Funny how the cracked forcing cones started showing up at the same time the hot 125gr Magnum loads showed up. While S&W suggested a mix of .38 Special and .357 Magnum loads to reduce wear and tear on the Model 19, the forcing cone problem is not caused by normal 158gr .357 Magnum ammo. Don
NRA Certified Metallic Cartridge Reloading Instructor
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Campfire Sage
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So, are you guys saying it took from 1957 to 1980 to find "flaws" with the Model 19? You are getting your cause and effect all messed up. Funny how the cracked forcing cones started showing up at the same time the hot 125gr Magnum loads showed up. While S&W suggested a mix of .38 Special and .357 Magnum loads to reduce wear and tear on the Model 19, the forcing cone problem is not caused by normal 158gr .357 Magnum ammo.
Don
You're correct. The main culprit in the forcing cone problem was indeed the 125 grain round, not the original 158 grainers.
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Campfire Sage
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Campfire Sage
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There's nothing wrong with the Model 19 period.
Ever.
Travis
Trump being classless,tasteless and clueless as usual. Sorry, trump is a no tax payin pile of shiit. My young wife decided to play the field and had moved several dudes into my house
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Joined: Jun 2002
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Campfire Sage
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Campfire Sage
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There's nothing wrong with the Model 19 period.
Ever.
Travis Yep, used within design parameters. I've got one and like it a lot. I don't believe I've ever fired Magnums from it, though.
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Jun 2012
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There's nothing wrong with the Model 19 period.
Ever.
Travis Yes there is.....
The government plans these shootings by targeting kids from kindergarten that the government thinks they can control with drugs until the appropriate time--DerbyDude
Whatever. Tell the oompa loompa's hey for me. [/quote]. LtPPowell
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
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. Funny how the cracked forcing cones started showing up at the same time the hot 125gr Magnum loads showed up. While S&W suggested a mix of .38 Special and .357 Magnum loads to reduce wear and tear on the Model 19, the forcing cone problem is not caused by normal 158gr .357 Magnum ammo.
Don
Spot on! Could not agree more.
I got banned on another web site for a debate that happened on this site. That's a first
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Apr 2005
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There's nothing wrong with the Model 19 period.
Ever.
Travis Yep, used within design parameters. I've got one and like it a lot. I don't believe I've ever fired Magnums from it, though. I shoot nothing but 158 grain magnums in my model 19's and I love them
I got banned on another web site for a debate that happened on this site. That's a first
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Campfire Member
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Campfire Member
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There's nothing wrong with the Model 19 period.
Ever.
Travis Yes there is..... Uh, we're talking about the Smith and Wesson Model 19, not the Glock Model 19.  Don
NRA Certified Metallic Cartridge Reloading Instructor
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Jun 2012
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There's nothing wrong with the Model 19 period.
Ever.
Travis Yes there is..... Uh, we're talking about the Smith and Wesson Model 19, not the Glock Model 19. Don I know that stupid
The government plans these shootings by targeting kids from kindergarten that the government thinks they can control with drugs until the appropriate time--DerbyDude
Whatever. Tell the oompa loompa's hey for me. [/quote]. LtPPowell
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Joined: Aug 2007
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Campfire Sage
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Campfire Sage
Joined: Aug 2007
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There's nothing wrong with the Model 19 period.
Ever.
Travis Yes there is..... NO! Clark
Trump being classless,tasteless and clueless as usual. Sorry, trump is a no tax payin pile of shiit. My young wife decided to play the field and had moved several dudes into my house
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Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
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True that about those .357 125gr loads.
There is a lot of powder in those .357 125gr loads. Early factory .357 ammunition was a lot hotter than it is now.Winchester sold more .357 ammunition than anyone else. The Winchester Small Pistol Magnum primers are very hot. Since they all used their ball powders. In the older loading manuals, they would state- "if using the Win SPM primer, reduce your loads by 10%" at least. Which is a good idea with changing any primer, but they called out the Winchester SP magnum primer by name.
Primers burn a lot hotter than powder. The cylinder gap in revolvers introduced O2 to the burning of the load. There you have it.
Gun Shows are almost as comical as boat ramps in the Spring.
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Joined: Jun 2012
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 17,098 |
There's nothing wrong with the Model 19 period.
Ever.
Travis Yes there is..... NO! Clark YES!!!!
The government plans these shootings by targeting kids from kindergarten that the government thinks they can control with drugs until the appropriate time--DerbyDude
Whatever. Tell the oompa loompa's hey for me. [/quote]. LtPPowell
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Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
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Well, I prefer the .45 ACP...just because. Last handgun purchase, I went to buy a Glock 43 for everyday carry and came home with a Springfield XDS in .45 ACP. It just seemed better for what I think that I need.
Ben
Some days it takes most of the day for me to do practically nothing...
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
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Posts: 16,000 |
I was speaking of .38 Special target wadcutters. Back in the day, cops routinely shot these at the range, often provided for them. As suggested by the other poster, this was later frowned upon, and for good reason. The difference is extreme between felt recoil of these and .357 Magnum loads. By 1980 bigger metro departments were qualifying with what they carried on duty. By then things had already changed. It was this change, by the way, that found the flaws in the S&W K-Frame .357 Magnums, which were never intended to consume a regular diet of Magnums. The idea was to practice with .38 Special, and even carry defensive loads in .38, but also be equipped with Magnums in case a situation called for it, such as a road block. Split forcing cones, and cracked frames at the barrel threads on the underside where the crane sat. Even departments that used .38 Special +P's would eventually crack frames if they were shot enough. Colt had the same issue with +P's. The K frame was perfect for .38 Special and you can even say that for .38 Special +P, but it really is marginal for .357 magnum. They really should be shot about 80/20 special/magnum. Still, warts and all the M19 is one of my favorite handguns of all time. I have more than one of these. The first one was acquired in the mid 70's and i have fired thousands the good Lord only knows 38special out or it. In all that time maybe one box of 357magnum, and those were 158grain. Gun is still tight as a drum.
THE BIRTH PLACE OF GERONIMO
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Campfire Sage
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Campfire Sage
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I'll put this set of magnas right into your yambag! Clark
Trump being classless,tasteless and clueless as usual. Sorry, trump is a no tax payin pile of shiit. My young wife decided to play the field and had moved several dudes into my house
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Joined: Jun 2012
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 17,098 |
I'll put this set of magnas right into your yambag! Clark There are problems with magnas too Dave....
The government plans these shootings by targeting kids from kindergarten that the government thinks they can control with drugs until the appropriate time--DerbyDude
Whatever. Tell the oompa loompa's hey for me. [/quote]. LtPPowell
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Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 115,424
Campfire Sage
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Campfire Sage
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 115,424 |
Not for people that can shoot.
Dave
Trump being classless,tasteless and clueless as usual. Sorry, trump is a no tax payin pile of shiit. My young wife decided to play the field and had moved several dudes into my house
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