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Joined: Jul 2001
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Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 60,086 |
You're welcome!
Of course, the other side of all this is there apparently isn't much more demand for the .338 RCM than there was for .338-06's when first A-Square and Weatherby offered .338-06 factory rifles--probably because both .33's are sort of "tweener" rounds, not offering the sort of long-range ballistics many shooters want these days, or the bullet weight and caliber of even larger rounds. No doubt some of this is due to advances in bullet construction, making heavier bullets less necessary for deep penetration.
All .33 caliber rifle cartridges, whether British or American, were essentially a product of cup-and-core bullets. A .33 bullet weighing 250-300 grains at moderate velocities penetrated deeper and more reliably than 180-grain cup-and-cores from .300 magnums. But with today's bullets we don't really need to use a 250+ grain bullet to ensure performance on heavier game.
“Montana seems to me to be what a small boy would think Texas is like from hearing Texans.” John Steinbeck
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Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 6,662
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 6,662 |
Actually, my interest is drawn more to the handy carbines that both RCM's are offered in, I suspect they would be similar to the Remington 600 I had long ago and really liked. Plus I can still find the RCM in a port-side was my only real complaint with the 600. .338 would be nice, but as some fairly practical scribe has pointed out, I probably could kill anything I'll ever want with a 180 or 200 gr Partition from the .300.
Or I could buy an RAR Compact, but that would be just too practical.
Decisions, decisions, decisions.
'Four legs good, two legs baaaad." ---------------------------------------------- "Jimmy, some of it's magic, Some of it's tragic, But I had a good life all the way." (Jimmy Buffett)
SotG
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Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
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One of my upcoming columns (recently submitted) is about the balance between velocity and BC for longer-range shooting, and how to figure out where the balance point might be for certain kinds of hunting. I've long pondered that one and that article is one I look forward to! I, also, enjoyed the current article and look forward to the next one. We are fortunate to have so much of JB on these forums.
Nifty-250
"If you don't know where you're going, you may wind up somewhere else". Yogi Berra
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Joined: May 2012
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Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
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I love the REALLY short ones like the L46, CZ527, Zastava M85 etc. With a compact round like the 6.5 Grendel, 222 Rem etc they're a lot of fun!
Keen to lay hands on a Howa Mini for the same reason.
No huge fan of long actions but there's no substitute for cubic inches of course.
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Joined: Jul 2001
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Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 60,086 |
The Brno ZKW 465 is very good too, but it's essentially an earlier, more refined version of the CZ 527. One of its nice features is the .22 Hornet magazine is a little longer than the 527's, just enough to use plastic-tipped 40-grain bullets, which ups the downrange performance of the Hornet considerably.
However, actions like the 527, L46, etc., might actually be classified as "miniature" actions, rather than shortened versions of larger actions--the situation with the Remington 721 and 722, and the way most manufacturers of medium to big game rifles work these days, with two lengths of the same action.
Last edited by Mule Deer; 10/14/16. Reason: addition
“Montana seems to me to be what a small boy would think Texas is like from hearing Texans.” John Steinbeck
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Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
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Hey I've not had a 465 so I'll keep an eye out for one. Another one for the list!
I had a lovely L46, but regrettably it had been rebarreled to 223 Rem hich meant you could only load 50g HPs at the most. No matter, it was beautiful.
I was going to hang onto it and rebarrel to 17 Ackley or similar, but a mate took a shine to it and I gave it away...
Yes I DO regret it!
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Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 60,086
Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 60,086 |
The ZKW 465's I've seen, including mine, have double-set triggers and nice iron sights with multiple-leaf rears. Mine's a typical sporter with a Schnabel forend tip, but have seen a couple with full-length Mannlicher-style stocks. They take the same scope rings as CZ 527's with just a slight amount of modification. Pretty nifty little rifles, but you don't see them in the U.S. very often.
“Montana seems to me to be what a small boy would think Texas is like from hearing Texans.” John Steinbeck
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Joined: May 2014
Posts: 10,407
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: May 2014
Posts: 10,407 |
Very good read!
I've probably owned over a dozen 600/660 Remingtons and I liked the short over-all rifles, in the day, when they were new. I'm down to one - a 350 RM. I wish that It was a little longer but it works fine as is. I still have a few short action Remington 700's, 722, 783 and a 7. Almost all my new bolt action rifles have been longer actions, including Winchesters, Mausers, a Tikka, a Ruger or two and others. The main issue I have with the short bolt actions (and lever actions) is not having the ability to chase the leade. Short magazine length limits seating depth, which to me is the biggest short coming. I've noticed that many if not most of my long action rifle barrels are getting such that I load the bullets out further for accuracy (I don't want to re-barrel). The long actions are more forgiving and as a side benefit I think easier to get cartridges to feed.
In 50+ years of hunting I can count on one hand shots I've made on game over 200 yards. (Antelope and White Tail) I don't plan on doing it again. Shooting at long range at game animals is as foreign to me as voting Democrat and just as enjoyable.
I prefer classic. Semper Fi I used to run with the hare. Now I'm envious of the tortoise and I do my own stunts but rarely intentionally
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Joined: Sep 2006
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 18,005 |
Really interesting read, JB. Looking forward to the next article!
"I'm gonna have to science the schit out of this." Mark Watney, Sol 59, Mars
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Campfire Regular
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John can the enfield 30-06 be re barreled to take the new 6.5x300 weatherby cartridge?
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Joined: Jul 2001
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Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 60,086 |
I would bet it can, since many 1917 action have been used to make .375 H&H's, as well as rifles for other longer rounds. The other Weatherby rounds based on the .300 Wby. case all have overall cartridge lengths similar to the .375 H&H.
“Montana seems to me to be what a small boy would think Texas is like from hearing Texans.” John Steinbeck
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Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
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The 722 and 721 eventually became the short- and long-action Remington 700's, but the long action is much longer than required for the .30-06. Instead it was designed to handle "long magnums," initially the .300 H&H but eventually the .375 H&H, .300 Weatherby"
So if I understand correctly, my Remington 700 .270 can be rebarreled to 6.5-300 Weatherby or 26 Nosler?
Don't roll those bloodshot eyes at me.
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Joined: Jan 2010
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 32,130 |
It's too bad this article doesn't cover which LAs can safely fire 308WIN rounds. There seems to be a surge of interest in this topic.
If you put Taco Bell sauce in your ramen noodles it tastes just like poverty
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Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 60,086
Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 60,086 |
cdb,
Should be able to do exactly that. There'll probably be a little tweaking needed to get the 26 Nosler to feed perfectly, but not so much with the 6.5-.300 Wby.
“Montana seems to me to be what a small boy would think Texas is like from hearing Texans.” John Steinbeck
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Joined: Dec 2011
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Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Dec 2011
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Don't roll those bloodshot eyes at me.
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Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 120
Campfire Member
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Campfire Member
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 120 |
Thanks for a very informative article!
I'd like to add why I have become a big short action fan. Bolt throw. Not for the 0.2 seconds it saves me, but because I can keep my cheek weld throughout. I can empty the magazine with my eyes planted behind the scope the whole time. Hunting deer in hardwoods, it is nice to be able to immediately cycle another round while keeping my eyes on the fleeing deer. If an accurate follow up shot is needed, I'm on target.
Add to this the often lower recoil, more efficient cases of many short action cartridges and often lighter weight. There is nothing good hand loads in a short action can't do on this continent.
“Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch. Liberty is a well-armed lamb contesting the vote!” -Benjamin Franklin
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Joined: Feb 2009
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Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Feb 2009
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Quick follow up shots are the reason semi autos exist.... Fleeing deer around here in the woods are too fast for a follow up shot, except for the ones the hide behind the trees.....
I am the way, the truth, and the life: no one comes to the Father but by me. John 14:6
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Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 120
Campfire Member
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Campfire Member
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Posts: 120 |
I disagree. Have done it with a short bolt action. Works just as fast as a semi-auto. There's a second of recoil and re-training your sight picture no matter what you shoot. In that time, I have the boot cycled and my eyes are on target, same as my AR15 and AR10. Considering the weight of an AR10 and the fact that AR15-223!is illegal for deer in most states, I'll take my 1/2 MOA, 7.5# bolt action every time. I have no interest in the old semi's like the 7600, etc. my next choice would be a Marlin or Savage lever action.
“Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch. Liberty is a well-armed lamb contesting the vote!” -Benjamin Franklin
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Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
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I just don't know if I'd believe anyone who lives near Houston....😎😎😎
I am the way, the truth, and the life: no one comes to the Father but by me. John 14:6
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Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 33,690
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 33,690 |
Making rocket science of what it isn't. Really?
Conduct is the best proof of character.
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