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I got 12-15 comments in (reading, not posting) and had to stop. Uff-Da!!

I'll play...factor a 147ELD at 2700fps(Hornie Factory Load),if only to keep things "fair" for the H&H based .308".

The 165AB(Litz) at 3250fps and a 200yd zero,has a wind DISadvantage at the 50yd to as far as you dare compare. Despite the 550fps velocity headstart,the Creed's impact velocity catches the 300Winny at the 425yd line and continues to arrive faster,at ALL distances beyond that,to as far as you dare compare.

At the 600yd line and a like 200yd zero for both,the 300Winny drops a "whopping" 5-inches less,though it drifts 8-inches more and arrives with 100fps less impact velocity.

At the 750yd line and the same zero,the 300 is again 5" flatter in trajectory at 128" drop,but drifts over a foot more in the wind (14") and arrives the scene 175fps slower.

At the 1000yd line and the same zero,the 300 is dropping 11" more(302" total),drifts 33" more at 96" total and arrives the scene 282fps slower.

At the 1500yd line that Itty-Bitty Creed' drops "only" 212" less,drifts "only" 92" less and is prolly even still arriving faster. Hint.(grin)

'Course it gets uglier and uglier and uglier for the .532" belted long action,compared to the 264-250 Savage and it's sub 2.00" case length,the farther one gets from the muzzle.



Shooting 147ELD's at 2900fps in my 260AI and it's a straight up fhuqking Three Hunnert KILLER. Though I've not shot it much past the 2000yd line. Hint.



Could only muster about 33 Mils remaining on the erector,after a 250yd zero.



I've heard a VERY wise man say..."boolits matter farrrrrr more than headstamps". Hint.

'Course I've seen it too and prolly got/shoot it all.................(grin)











(Addendum: for yet another Drooling Dumbfhuqk)

URFUBAR,

Pardon citing a vanilla Hornady Factory Load as upsetting your Delusions and "cherry picking".

"Congratulations" on your being FORCED to Cherry Pick 300Winny Handloads,to contend a 22-250 case fueling a 147 grainer.

Funny fhuqking schit and I mean FUNNY!

Now dangle a pic of "your" 300...cite some "particulars" and muse a leetle sumptin' about arrangin' POA/POI intersections.

Do it look like this?!? Laughing!



Pass the S/A's and the Fixed Fhuqkers,as you "get" to look at the pics....you "lucky" kchunt.

Bless your heart.

Laughing!....................

Load the 300 Win mag with a 225gr. ELD match with a B.C. of .777 at 2800fps and compare that with the Creedmoor.

Cherry picking loads and bullets works both ways.

The only disadvantage the Win mag has is recoil and cost.







Addendum:

Well Bigstink,

I guess my point sailed right over your head, no surprise there.

I dont shoot a 300 mag anymore , been there done that.

I shoot an 8 twist 243, 260 Rem & 6.5-06, these are my long range rifles.

I like how you ignored my point that the 300mag's disadvantage is recoil and cost, and guess I should ad muzzle blast and barrel life.

My point was you can cite different numbers and play games with them.

Hard to beat horsepower if your long range game includes large heavy boned animals.

But as usual you will go on and on with your crazy talk and ruin another thread, oh well, have fun with that.

You become less relevant every time you do.

Yessir.

While we're talking long range cartridges, Nosler knocked it out of the park with their new line up, but botched their rifles so badly that its like they want them to fail.

for example they could look at the 6.5 Creedmoor and take a hint. The 6 creedmoor will also be a hit. but what about the 22-250? They would have to roll out a 22 creed to offer any decent factory ammo, as its forever plagued by twists that wont support them and people that dont know not to buy 75gr for their slow twists.


Nosler had the opportunity with a clean slate to use fast twists, proper throats and magazine lengths but they couldnt even get it half right.

So instead of stepping into 2016, they market them like its 1960..I figure you only get one chance at doing it right, now that they have rifles out there with 3.4" mags, factory offerings will forever suffer, and manufacturers will still be trying to gain back the huge amount of people that go the custom route because no one gets it right.

Of course this doesnt make a difference to the handloader..Just a rant while sitting here with my broken leg.

Stick: OK I get it...but no one mentioned wind; only trajectory which is what i addressed.

I have not run Creedmoor to 1000....I lack facilities.


That said I am not using 338 OR 300 RUM for anything...they both kick too much and the rifles are too heavy for me anymore.

Wow me! First time since, what? '98 I've seen the Stick come over to the 6.5 side. About time!

I still prefer the my 300 wm for things that weigh more than 600 lbs though.







I have a Creed in a Kimber on the way too.

Ya now that Stick has actually caught up with many of us and got on the 6.5 bandwagon we will have to listen to how great and smart he is.

I remember when he was touting the 257 Wby and Barnes 100gr. blue coated bullets as the greatest thing ever.

What a tool.

6.5 SAUM with a 140 Berger VLD or OTM Hybrid. A dose of H1000 that Mag Speeds at 3100 or faster and shoots well - Those numbers look pretty good.
6.5/47 with a 130 Berger and 38 grains of Varget does pretty fair when the numbers are ran too.
A SAUM in 6.5 at 3100 or more in a good rifle is a laser. GAP has brass and the 4S reamer has served many of us well. Getting ready to screw a Bartlein 24" contour 3 in an 8 twist on a 300 WSM Tikka T3 donor to see how it does. Unfortunately and because these things burn 60 grains or more of powder a brake makes the light guns more pleasurable to shoot. Awful loud though.
300 WM @ 2900 with a 210 Berger and the aforementioned SAUM w/100 yard zeroes at 500 yards.
SAUM 7 MOA. 300 WM 9 MOA both at 700' , 50 degrees, and 30" of mercury.
I enjoy shooting 6.5/47, 6.5/284, and 6.5 SAUM (SAUM weighs 17# w/brake) cause there isn't much recoil and it seems the caliber is very accurate and user friendly.
Several of my friends shoot the Creedmore and it does well too. Some shoot 130's and some 140's.
Not sure any of my minutiae means anything but hopefully is helpful .

Thanks,
Dave

I like 130gr JLK's at 3300fps with a .600+ G1 BC...

The 147gr ELDM's at 3150fps don't have any flies on them either. From what I've seen the .697 G1 they claim is spot on at SAUM velocities....

'sco1,

Nosler doesn't get anything right and is best at Fabrications and Delusions.

They fhuqked their piece of fhuqking schit rifles up sooooooo badly,that it's TRACT funny!

NOBODY can Reload beyond their twist rate...............(grin)















Bob,

I know of nobody who shoots even a smidge of Long Range,that ain't thinkin' WIND/WIND/WIND and roughly in that order. Trajectory is Physics and a simplistic push of a button,though wind is VooDoo and encompasses many elements. A coupla clicks on an erector is moot in ele,but slippin' atmospherics and retaining impact velocity are assuredly not.

I've shot more than a buncha .30's(understatement),though in fairness,nothing greater than 30-378 in case capacity. The 300 Ultra trumps it in case design and a viable receiver's standpoint,but I'd just as soon be gunnin' a 300Winny. That due the correlation of case length,in regards to COAL and the ability to nab a nice throat in conjunction. MUCH prefer 7 Whizzum to all of it and I've of course done 7mm Remmie,STW and the ilk more than a bunch.

Prolly don't have (3) Montucky 7 Whizzum's on accident and may have shot a 162'Max in at least one of 'em,at least once.(grin)

Most folks overlook the constant,that as bore diameter/recoil is reduced...actual USE increases.

Never been tough to cypher who shoots and who don't...............













'35,

I've only rebarreled (2) 264Win's to 257Wby,based solely upon projectile selection/performance of the time.

Have 260'd more than a smidge,suffered Grendel,flogged Creed',slummed Swede's and banged away 6.5-284 too...all while a 162A-Max soared like an Iggle.

It's tough for me to gun things that ain't been Invented yet.(grin)

While Boogers are too zooky for my tastes,Sierra's are a crapshoot at best,Nosler a fhuqking joke,Skinners are always reliable and JLK's rate their flight patterns. The Robustitude of Skinners steals that show,but the new kid on the block(Hornady),connects all of the dots in one fell swoop.

They dig beyond a Booger,Nosler don't rate conversation,SMK's are a cruel Terminal joke and the JLK supply pipeline can often derail. Hornie ELD's smack 'em all upside the head.

As to the .264/123 Skinner in particular...it won't fly with a .243/105 Hornie HPBT in like case capacity and gives up zero in Robustitude,though the Skinner will kick harder which is a Trump Card for some. The 105 do however make huge gains in logistics and pricing,which prolly don't suck,were I forced to guess and I am NOT. Hint.(grin)

The Montucky Creed' is THE Schnizzle. They got throating,COAL and twist rate correct. Feed ELD Factory Fodder and you've a minimal recoil BAD Bitch,that'll tidily CRUSH Myth's,Wives Tales and Drooling Dumbfhuqkery.

Might look like this.



Buck 'er back,live a leetle with a 6x MQ Fixed Fhuqker and it's prolly look like this.



The Montucky Chop,bein' farrrrrr more bang for the Buck,than an Ascent,Adirondack or similar.



I may be guessin'...but prolly ain't..................(grin)

















URFUBAR,

I'll feign my GREAT "surprise" that you went wayyyyyyyyy outta your road to refrain "your" 300's "particulars". Fortunately for you,Imagination and Pretend are free...you "lucky" kchunt. Congratulations.

Dangle some pics of that SINISTER 30 and all it's "attributes". LAUGHING!

I reckon it's farrrrrr from a "fluke",that all anyone can remember about you,is that you are a Whining Clueless Fhuqk. I'm also VERY "surprised" that you read my EVERY word and eye fhuqk my EVERY splendid pixel,you vicarious "hard charging" kchunt. Laughing!

In fairness,I've not shot a single 257Wby,though have shot out (5) spouts chambered same and welcome your "telling" me about that chambering too,mainly because you are doing "great". Someone who "knows" and "does" as "much" as you,is ALWAYS gonna be best served by asking questions,rather than attempting "answers". Hint.

Thank me later.

Funnier than fhuqk,when you amazingly STUPID Fhuqks,try to "tell" me stuff...so PLEASE continue,as I'm on the ropes.

Bless your heart.

Laughing!...................















'Tire,

In a 264ShamWow,I'd do no other than the 147ELD.

Have yet to see ANY brass from Hornady,that was worth nearly a fhuqk,though admittedly have not tasted their ShamWow offering.

I've had very good luck in 300Whizzum,favorite bein' a fluted #4 Hart at 24" S/A 700 based and wearin' DBM in one of them there MacaMillion stocks. Have had multriple other OEM offerings chambered same and while sound,that Hart broke fhuqking hearts.

Have had alotta 300Winny's,'course multiple 300H&H's,multiple 300Roy's,Ultra and aforementioned 30-378 too. Pass the 300Winny,due particulars cited and rest assured I'm talkin' 700 based,due that COAL latitude. Hint.

The Creed' squirtin' that 147 will open eyes.

Hint...................














'shooter,

The 130 .264 JLK is a phenom and a dastardly Wicked Bitch.

The 147 flies as indicated and the pile driving ass is a Show Stopper.

Hornady STEALS the fhuqking Show...........(yet again)

I get a little tired of all the raving about the .338 Lapua. The .338-378 I built in the 1980s significantly outperformed it, and is now available commercially from Wby.

"The Montucky Creed' is THE Schnizzle. They got throating,COAL and twist rate correct. Feed ELD Factory Fodder and you've a minimal recoil BAD Bitch,that'll tidily CRUSH Myth's,Wives Tales and Drooling Dumbfhuqkery."

I really think it is time I pick up one of the new Montana's in 6.5 creed. been thinking about it a lot and just happen to have a new fixed 6 SWFA for it!

Id bet you'll forget all about the 7 Mag if you did......

Perhaps. I mainly want a 7 mag as it was my first big game round and want to get another one in the stable.

To me the perfect LR cartridge is housed in a short action and flings high-BC bullets with (at the worst) manageable recoil and ideally light recoil. To that end I love my 7 WSM's. I'm currently building a 6.5 SAUM and have high hopes for it as well.

If I'm going long action, I'm going full-retard on it. To THAT end my other current build is a BBB (Big Braked Beast) in 338 EDGE. Would've gone Lapua but I wanted to repurpose a M700 action I had around anywayand a Lap is a shoehorn into a M700.

There's a lot of antiquated "info" out there. If you see someone mention "flatness", or MPBZ, in a long-range context (looking at YOU, Chuck Hawks!) run far away. Drift and impact speed are the parameters to look at IMHO.

With the great brass available the Creed certainly holds interest to me as a future explore, as does 6.5-284. However as long as the GAP/Hornady brass is serviceable the 6.5 SAUM will do everything the 6.5-284 does but with MUCH longer barrel life. I've got a bunch of the brass on hand, Bartlein just shipped the barrel, Manners should finish the stock "soon".... so I can soon see for myself if the Hornady/GAP brass is serviceable. Mixed reports out there.

What BS.

He did say he was going full retard.....

Some things never change.

Pat,
Those 147's I have not tried yet. Soon for sure.
My Hawk Hill Custom barrel is still picking up speed at 215 rounds. I need to exercise it more...seems like they settle down according to some of my friends who shoot the 6.5 SAUM around 300 rounds. I could turn the wick up some but this thing shoots under 2 1/2" at 765 yards (no wind) with 140 Hybrids @ 3065 (215 rounds logged)

The second batch of 4S brass is better around the primer pockets than the first batch again according to the friends who also shoot the 6.5 SAUM. I am currently running the 200 brass I have (first batch) on their second firing. 60.4 grains H1000 is not hot but the primers are going in pretty easy. Still just snug enough but not near as tight as they should be or at least that is my impression on this second firing.

Anxious to try the 147's. H1000 good for the 147's?

Thanks
Dave