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Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 15,394
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 15,394 |
Abuse....somebody needs a smack in the snot box ...imo
I work harder than a ugly stripper....
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Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 29,814 Likes: 7
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 29,814 Likes: 7 |
We are the lucky recipient of a not-much-over-$100 fine from our neighborhood ass'n for a matter that we feel is pretty unfair and subjective, relating to a somewhat-terse discussion wife had with association employees being construed as "abuse" on her part. I know the concept of cutting losses, paying the negligible fine and moving on with life, but this one has us a bit irritated and I'm wondering how we can stick to our principles.
They have scheduled a hearing before the elected board in which we can present our "case", and after which our fate will be decided. At present we stand to incur escalation of the fine, loss of ass'n privileges (presumably vehicle barcodes for the gate reader and perhaps access to amenities), and loss of good-status standing. I presume the board will determine where things go during or shortly after the hearing.
What is the general campfire sentiment on where to go with this sort of thing? Lawyer up (at what cost?)? Pay and live to fight another day? I'm willing to spend a bit of mad-money on this, but not much.
Thanks for any/all advice, to include "pay the fine, dummy...".
Okay...so what is the outcome if you do not pay a monetary fine to a private organisation. Further...what are your options for redress or overview of the matter?
These are my opinions, feel free to disagree.
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Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 27,091
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 27,091 |
Hoa is setup against the home owners. Pay up. Now move or suck it up. Will not be the last time you have problems with the HOA.
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Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 86,384 Likes: 39
Campfire Oracle
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Campfire Oracle
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 86,384 Likes: 39 |
I'm not complaining about the rules. I can't be convinced that the encounter was abusive. It went south when the office employee suggested that blame be placed on the USPS, instead of doing a couple minutes of investigation of billing records. So integrity, actual or perceived, isn't worth stressing over? If you agreed to live under a HOA, then abide by it, or expect problems if you don't. I've never understood why people complain about their HOA rules, as they had the choice to live there or not.
Pay the fine and move on with your life. Some things aren't worth stressing over. Sure it is, but as you know, this is petty BS. The HOA lady was clearly intimidated by your wife it seems. Some things are worthy of falling on your sword over, but don't think this is. It will piss you off to pay the fine, but that gets it out of the way. Otherwise have your wife let the HOA lady know what 'abuse' is!  BTW; miss AK yet?
If you take the time it takes, it takes less time.
--Pat Parelli
American by birth; Alaskan by choice.
--ironbender
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Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 67,842 Likes: 13
Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 67,842 Likes: 13 |
the only abuse I see so far, is 'fire members abusing vek for various imagined offenses to the tender sensibilities of the smart azzed and self righteous. 
Sam......
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Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 23,537 Likes: 2
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 23,537 Likes: 2 |
Have you thought blowing some buildings up?? Usually when [bleep] starts blowing up i.e. Swimming pool people start to get nervous...
Last edited by 79S; 01/14/17.
Then STFU. The rest of your statement is superflous bullshit with no real bearing on this discussion other than to massage your own ego. Suckin' on my titties like you wanted me.
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Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 4,319
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 4,319 |
I don't know how people live in a HOA. This is exactly why you shouldn't.
NRA Life Member
~Molɔ̀ːn Labé Skýla~
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Joined: May 2004
Posts: 56,276 Likes: 37
Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 56,276 Likes: 37 |
Get a copy of the covenants and read them.
Unless very specifically the Covenants allow a fine for "abuse" then it is not legal. Think you will find more than enough ammunition here to make their live miserable too.
Send a certified letter to the board requesting a copy of the specific bylaw authorizing fines for "abuse"
Trust me most HOA boards do not have a clue what they can do and not do.
Also check with state attorney general on any state laws that govern HOAs. Many states have very specific laws for HOAs to follow.
All states normally allow you to request a written copy of all board minutes, by laws, meetings etc.
If you think it is wrong, pay it and then sue in Small Claims Court and show the judge a copy of the by laws not authorizing that fine.
Consult a local real estate attorney that specializes in HOAs, not real estate closings, big difference. ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
I am..........disturbed.
Concerning the difference between man and the jackass: some observers hold that there isn't any. But this wrongs the jackass. -Twain
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Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 15,701 Likes: 4
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 15,701 Likes: 4 |
MY general sentiment is you gotta be an idiot to
A - live where there's anyone who can tell you what you can and can't do on your property, and
B - come on here looking for sympathy.
YMMV This. I have no sympathy for anyone who signed a contract that allows their neighbors to tell them how they should live on top of paying property taxes to the govt. You wanted to join an exclusive elitist club, you pay your dues.
![[Linked Image from i.pinimg.com]](https://i.pinimg.com/originals/98/b6/d8/98b6d863a5f722b551cd8e1440bd2bd4.jpg) Z
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Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 2,960
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 2,960 |
Almost all legal board actions must be done by registered letter. That means they must have a receipt, ask for that. In prep for the hearing, send a registered letter to them saying these things. 1. In order to prepare for the hearing you require the following 2. copy of the by laws/CCRs and specifically what CCR provisions are you being charged with violating 3. What CCR provision authorizes the fines for abuse 4. Notify them you will be bringing witness and a tape recorder for the meeting. They cannot stop unless the CCR specifically prevents it. 5. copies of Mail receipt for the 3 letters they sent 6. Request the meeting be postponed until 14 days AFTER they deliver the above items. Note: The By Laws and CCR must be on file at the County Register of deeds office in order to be legal. You can go online and download them while waiting for their response. Just look under your deed, as they must be attached except for updates since purchase and the subdivision name. The sub must file all changes to the Register of Deeds. Again, talk to the state Attorney General Office and ask what state laws govern HOAs. Most states have laws on HOAs specifically AND on corporations. An HOA is actually and incorporation and has specific laws governing their conduction and operations. HOAs can be beaten by their own rules as many rarely follow them. The board often consider themselves above the rules. Here is the link to the Washington laws on HOAs http://apps.leg.wa.gov/rcw/default.aspx?cite=64.38&full=true
Last edited by BountyHunter; 01/14/17.
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Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 15,701 Likes: 4
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 15,701 Likes: 4 |
Have you thought blowing some buildings up?? Usually when [bleep] starts blowing up i.e. Swimming pool people start to get nervous... I love that quote.  Blowing up may be a bit much in this case, but one can get someone's attention with the proper application of a jerry jug and a Zippo.
Z
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Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 69,822 Likes: 48
Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 69,822 Likes: 48 |
I just don't understand why some people PAY for more regulation and loss of freedom.
I simply can't/won't do it.
I'd live in a cave before I would do that.
Molɔ̀ːn Labé Skýla!
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Joined: May 2006
Posts: 3,945
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 3,945 |
MY general sentiment is you gotta be an idiot to
A - live where there's anyone who can tell you what you can and can't do on your property, and
B - come on here looking for sympathy.
YMMV We all live in a system like that....it's called public government.
Experience hath shewn, that even under the best forms of government those entrusted with power have, in time, and by slow operations, perverted it into tyranny.
Thomas Jefferson
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Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 115,424 Likes: 13
Campfire Sage
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Campfire Sage
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 115,424 Likes: 13 |
Four pages and nobody suggests fugking the president of the HOA's wife?
Or, if the president is a chick, fugk her. Take video.
This is a no brainer.
Dave
Trump being classless,tasteless and clueless as usual. Sorry, trump is a no tax payin pile of shiit. My young wife decided to play the field and had moved several dudes into my house
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Joined: May 2002
Posts: 2,841
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 2,841 |
HOA!? Sounds like a living hell.
"I'm from the government, and I'm here to help"
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Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 115,424 Likes: 13
Campfire Sage
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Campfire Sage
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 115,424 Likes: 13 |
PS-You don't need a lawyer to argue with an HOA board.
Dave
Trump being classless,tasteless and clueless as usual. Sorry, trump is a no tax payin pile of shiit. My young wife decided to play the field and had moved several dudes into my house
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Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 46,382 Likes: 19
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 46,382 Likes: 19 |
I wouldn't pay it. I wouldn't hire a lawyer either. Go to the hearing, state your case. This woman your wife spoke to has probably done the same kind of stuff before and people probably know it.
Ask for their written standard for "abuse" and tell them it's for your lawyer to review. Ask specifically how your wife violated it, and where the violation is documented. Ask who gets to determine what constitutes abuse, and how they make the determination. It should be the board who makes any determinations like that. Ask them how they came to their determination of abuse without interviewing half the people who were witnesses (your wife). Tell them you believe you're being harassed and retaliated against for questioning their judgment in the other matter and tell them you'll hire a lawyer and file a counter claim if they don't drop it.
They don't want to have to spend money on a lawyer to defend something like that, easiest route for them will be to drop it.
A wise man is frequently humbled.
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Joined: Feb 2013
Posts: 1,893
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Feb 2013
Posts: 1,893 |
If you want to live where a H O A is prepare to put up with stupid $hit. if not MOVE!!!!!!!!!!
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Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 115,424 Likes: 13
Campfire Sage
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Campfire Sage
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 115,424 Likes: 13 |
If you want to live where a H O A is prepare to put up with stupid $hit. if not MOVE!!!!!!!!!! At least he owns a home, unlike your unemployed, broke-dick ass. Clark
Trump being classless,tasteless and clueless as usual. Sorry, trump is a no tax payin pile of shiit. My young wife decided to play the field and had moved several dudes into my house
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Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 69,822 Likes: 48
Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 69,822 Likes: 48 |
If you want to live where a H O A is prepare to put up with stupid $hit. if not MOVE!!!!!!!!!! At least he owns a home, unlike your unemployed, broke-dick ass. Clark
Molɔ̀ːn Labé Skýla!
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