Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Savage Collectors Tale of Two EGs

All:

I was doing a little regular maintenance tonight. I had two EGs out at the same time. Both in 300. One was pre war (lighter colored one) and the other a post war 50s model. Anyways, I noticed some differences between the two.

One, was the thickness of the forearms. The pre war gun was much thinner.



Second, the shape of the shell indicator hole. The pre war gun was more circular than the post war.

Post war



Pre war

Wood differences. Condition of both rifles is excellent.

There's another difference that absolutely nobody ever seems to talk about. It's the transition of the front receiver bridge to the left side of the action. The transition on pre war 99s terminates in a nice little radius. The transition on post war 99s terminates in a V shaped configuration. The post war transition always looked a little sloppy to me. I've also noticed that the early slimmer forerms tend to split and crack. I think that's why Savage made the forearm more robust on later rifles. Nice 99s!

That's a very thin schnabel on the prewar EG. Don't think that's standard. But I like it.

I take it back, looked at a couple of my 1941's and the schnabel does look thinner. Gonna have to take some measurements.

What is the scope on the post war 99?

Yes whats the scope on the post war 99???????

Is than an L serries stith??????

Stuttering on the questions marks, sorry LOL

Johno

The scope is a Leupold Mountaineer. I have one on this gun and another on another EG in 250 not pictured. Also in Stiths.

Interesting info. I'll have to compare to my 1937 vintage 99EG, also in 300 Savage. I have a Lyman peep sight on mine. Unfortunately, someone had it drilled and tapped for scope mounts, spoiling an otherwise pristine rifle.

The Pioneer makes for a nice looking rig. I have a factory drilled EG with a fixed 4x Pioneer in Adjusto mounts. I might be handicapping myself a bit but it makes for a clean and interesting set up. Thanks for putting up pictures of your 99s.

PS - by fixed I really meant to say the the scope has no turret adjustment.

For factory drilled guns, I like the Leupold Westerner 8x. I have 3-4 of those as well. I am going to try to snag another off of EBay that is sitting on there right now. Another favorite is the Lyman Challenger or Wolverine. Though, getting 26mm vintage rings can be a challenge sometimes.

Jeff, great pics, thanks for posting. David

Here's a couple others, a 1935 99EG in 300 and an early 1950's 99EG in 300 (1950? 1952?).

Totally agree on significant differences on the cartridge counter and schnabel tip. My forearm thicknesses aren't significantly different though.

1945 99EG also has the more circular cartridge counter hole and thinner Schnabel. So maybe prewar and postwar may not be as correct as saying Utica and Chicopee Falls?

1940?? checkered 303EG [img:center][/img]

The pre war I have pictured is 388,xxx and is of course Utica. That is 1940.

Huge difference in wood color as well. But that happens with 15 +\- years difference between the two.

Interesting observation on the wood. I have read that WWII put a big stress on the availability of good walnut for making gun stocks. That might account for differences in wood color and density. I too prefer the Lyman Challanger and Wolverine scopes and think that their optics were a cut above Weaver. Not that I'm trashing Weaver or anything.

It does seem like most Chicopee Falls rifles were darker colored, but I've seen 99T's and 99R's from the 30's that are also darker. So I think individual lots of walnut and probably different batches of finish would come out different.

Heck, I've got a very clean late 1950's 99EG in 358 where the forearm is light like the Utica EG above, and the buttstock is dark like the Chicopee Falls. Just the wood came out different shades after finishing. (heavier schnabel like all the Chicopee Falls EG's

Assembly numbers on all the pieces?

I'll bet there are a lot more color mis-matched 99's kicking around than we're aware of. I seriously doubt that production planners at Savage took care to ensure all the butt stocks and fore ends stayed together out of the same tree.

P.S. Digging on those spiffy see-through mounts!

It was matching assembly codes when I checked.. 99% sure.

I personally couldn't abide by that, and would have to match the color up. BUT, wow, a 358 EG, how nice.

I would pay serious money to Mr. Peabody for a trip in the Wayback Machine to spend a couple days in Savage's stockmaking department. (And Harry Pope's barrel shop, and Niedner's shop, and Dr.Franklin Mann's rifle range, and in a scout plane circling over the Normandy beaches, and that certain college student who made some dumb career choices 43 years ago...)

This is sometimes where I learn the most. Look, listen & then handle. The details rise to the surface.
Handle frequently is my advice. 😀

I have noticed on several occasions the wood on pre war EG's being slimmer and trimmer.

I much prefer them to post war EG's

I have a pre war EG in 30-30. I also have two Salesman Samples in 300 and 303. They are basically EGs with a little extra stuff.

I also have a post war EGs in 358 and 250.

I have to give all of them a little cleaning soon. I will check them out.

But I basically agree with the above. The pre war guns were slimmer. I prefer them as well. That is why my favorite Savages, by far, are from the 1914-40 era.

I too don't think Savage gave much consideration to matching the butt stock and forearm. And frankly it doesn't make much sense thinking that they would have.

Speaking of factory mismatches there is my matching numbers EG in 358 with the F buttstock, serial # 9673xx. It's the bottom rifle in the pic.

David

So your .358 EG came with the fluted comb stock?

You know, over the years I could swear I've seen a few EG's with fluted buttstocks from the 50's but I never took any notes on them. Is the buttstock drilled out on that one like an F, David?

I like the flutes and suspect that Savage may have used the stocks on customer request, or if they were running short on EG stocks that day, or...

It's drilled out. The serial number indicates it was real near the end of EG production so maybe they were out of EG stocks and didn't want to make any more because they weren't going to make any more EG's. Maybe it was the last EG produced! And the next to the last EG got the last EG stock so they put it together with an F stock. I like the way it looks but it is a little muzzle heavy. The full serial # is 967357, anyone have an EG with a higher serial number?

And that's about as good of a theory as anything else.

I have been collecting Savage's for over 20 years. I love the rifles, shotguns, pump 22's. I feel great that Savage firearms have finally gotten the attention they deserve. For so many years it was just Winchester Rifles and Colt pistols. I have shot for targets, killed deer, and hand loaded for these great Savage 99's and 1899s and have so many great memories. I would be happy to share stories or hand load receipes.

Posting decent pictures of your Savages is always a good way to garner fame and admiration here.

Or notoriety depending on what you post!

I just looked at my two EG's. I have a 1948 EG, 516,4XX, 250-3000 with the thinner forend (it looks just like the picture of RAS's pre-war EG) and the circular cartridge counter. My 1951 EG, LBC-C, 617,6XX, 300 Savage has the thicker forend and oval cartridge counter. Both manufactured in Chicopee Falls.

The 1951 cartridge counter looks like it is steel. I think I read somewhere that some if them were steel and not brass. Is this correct? The 1948 cartridge counter is definitely brass.

Thanks to everyone for sharing their knowledge. I continue to learn a lot.

Good data, Golden28. Any chance you could post a pic or two? Maybe pushes back the change to 1950?

And, yeah, they did some steel cased color rotors in the very early 50's.

In reference to the steel cartridge rotors, I have a 1953 99R and a 1952 99EG with one. Someone on here mentioned that this was during or around the Korean War, which caused a shortage of brass. That certainly seems feasible to me, but who knows. I have seen people sell 99s with this feature and say it adds to the value of it. Not sure about that. Though, in the collecting world, anything odd and original from the factory, usually adds value.

RAS

Given that anything odd is, in fact, original from the factory. I think everyone needs to be careful in assuming that they know everything about their rifle from the day it left the factory and that it, for sure, had never been tampered with by any owner. There is a fair amount of disassembling and altering chronicled within this forum and I see no reason for things being any different in the past, at least for any 99 I've ever owned. I'm not passing judgement on this sort of activity (hell I like tinkering too) but only offering a cautionary comment on assuming that everything encountered is always factory original - and a little critical perspective is never a bad thing when encountering the "odds and ends" of 99s and in all things in life.

Yes, they used steel for a brief period. Some of them are case colored as well.

Mike, were some of the steel rotors not case colored, say blued or otherwise? The one's I've seen are so subdued I'd have a hard time telling exactly how they are finished.
Thanks.

There are plain ones. I've often wondered how they were treated to prevent rust. I may have one. Will post if it's notable.

Calhoun, here are the pictures you requested:

http://s1126.photobucket.com/user/novitch4Golden28ga/Library/

The 250 Savage is from 1948 and has the obviously thinner forend and more circular cartridge counter window when compared to the 1951 Savage 300 with the thicker forend and oval cartridge counter window. I think the pictures also show pretty well the steel cartridge counter on the 1951 versus brass on the 1948.

Good pics! Definite difference.






Thinking it's time to start gathering serial numbers and narrow the range down as much as possible.

To the top...

Change of thin forearm schnabel on EG's and roundish cartridge counter window, to a heavier schnabel and oblong cartridge counter window.

We have 516,xxx still having the thin schnabel. Anybody with higher number 500,000 serial number EG's can check to narrow it down?

Top to bottom, EG 308 #9432XX, EG 250-3000 #5353XX, EG 300 SAV 3677XX

the Middle one is the 250 sav.



Lee

The front sight used also changed over time:

It's alot of work going thru the safes figuring all this stuff out. Ain't got it in me.

Interesting. I have a 57 EG in 300 and has the same front ramp as your 38 and 46.