|
|
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 8,087
Campfire Outfitter
|
OP
Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 8,087 |
“Factio democratica delenda est"
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 48,024
Campfire 'Bwana
|
|
Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 48,024 |
He doesn't have a serial # to verify when it was made, but besides that it looks like the real deal and pretty mint... Price is a bit steep, but may be worth it to a collector...
I try to stick with the basics, they do so well. Nothing fancy mind you, just plain jane will get it done with style. You want to see an animal drop right now? Shoot him in the ear hole. BSA MAGA
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 1,935
Campfire Regular
|
|
Campfire Regular
Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 1,935 |
My thoughts are amateur at best.
Are you asking for thoughts on legitimacy, price, or both? Just wondering, because any comment I have on legitimacy would be straight out of Rule, and I suspect you have a copy. I don't feel qualified to comment on the price.
You thinking of investment, or planning to "pop the cherry?" Seems a bit pricey to shoot, but that is a straight up money decision that is up to you.
I was never a fan of the late guns, but if you want a .300 Win Mag., it is going to be a late gun.
I am a big fan of the .300 Win. Mag. One of my "go to" rifles is a .300, but the truth is bullet placement is what really matters.
Probably a waste of electrons, but you wanted thoughts. At least I broke the ice. Nope. - BSA beat me to even that.
Last edited by GunDoc7; 04/21/17.
Clinging to guns & religion since 1959
Keyboards make people braver than alcohol
Election Integrity is more important than Election Convenience
Washington Post: "Democracy Dies in Darkness"
More correct: "Killing Democracy Faster Than Darkness"
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 8,087
Campfire Outfitter
|
|
OP
Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 8,087 |
Legitimacy,
OP states "S/N is 5598XX The last two digits I keep to myself (and the buyer). Winchester's website indicates this to be a Model 70 61-62 build year. I found that data at page 30 of the PDF document displayed on the Winchesterguns.com website. Now either I can't read correctly or this contradicts information shown above regarding a 63 build year."
“Factio democratica delenda est"
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: May 2010
Posts: 7,348
Campfire Tracker
|
|
Campfire Tracker
Joined: May 2010
Posts: 7,348 |
Rifle was serialized in early Oct. 1962....
"When the going gets weird, the weird turn pro."
Hunter S. Thompson
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Apr 2011
Posts: 15,297
Campfire Ranger
|
|
Campfire Ranger
Joined: Apr 2011
Posts: 15,297 |
He doesn't have a serial # to verify when it was made, but besides that it looks like the real deal and pretty mint... Price is a bit steep, but may be worth it to a collector... I agree it's steep but I'll tell you what, as a hunter and lover of the P64, besides the 338 Alaskan I think the 300 Win Mags were pretty danged cool. I know if the serial was correct and that all matched up I'd be all over a rifle like this for 3000. I'd throw the original stock in a gun sock and put a good stock on it and hunt it. Collectors can sort my stuff out when I pass. I wanted one I'd the 300 Wins pretty bad for awhile but found a 300 Wby that was rechambered from a 58 H&H... it suits my 300 need.
Semper Fi
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Nov 2000
Posts: 2,509
Campfire Regular
|
|
Campfire Regular
Joined: Nov 2000
Posts: 2,509 |
Someone just HAD to post this.
It brings back too many bad memories.....the first Pre'64 Model 70 I owned was a 300 Win Mag bought in about '97 or '98....had no idea what I had and sold it. It even had a steel 4X Weaver in Weaver mounts....paid $565 CDN for it,...still have the tag the shop had on it.
Excuse me while I go and kick my butt.
"after the bullet leaves the barrel it doesn't care what headstamp was on the case"
"The 221 Fireball is what the Hornet could have been had it stayed in school"
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 3,238
Campfire Tracker
|
|
Campfire Tracker
Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 3,238 |
Hard to articulate exactly what it is, but something about the demeanor of the seller and facts he presents about the gun scream CON-MAN to me.
"Put none but Americans on guard tonight."
-George Washington
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 8,087
Campfire Outfitter
|
|
OP
Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 8,087 |
My inner voice is sending a similiar message.
“Factio democratica delenda est"
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 1,935
Campfire Regular
|
|
Campfire Regular
Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 1,935 |
I don't get that vibe, but I don't get a big positive vibe either.
But I think my inner voice is quiet because I'm not interested. If I was considering dropping $3500, or even a lot less, my inner voice might have something to say too!
I guess some depends on if you think the rifle was "created" or refinished.
I would need to get into Rule to be sure, but the smaller checkering patterns and the pad look right? (Experts jump in here, yes or no?) Location of the proof marks might say something. I think they went to 12 O'clock to somewhat random late in production. But I don't think this was consistent. (Nutty when you think about it. That whole location thing could have been nothing more than a new guy proofing and stamping. He didn't give a flip, or know any better, and no one was watching him. Now 55 years later we are discussing it like archeologists!)
With regard to a possibly "created" rifle, the .300 Win. Mag. barrel had to come from somewhere. The barrels changed in '64 when they were free floated, correct? So, it is probably a legit barrel. Detail of the barrel roll mark is something Rule could help with if you can get good pictures. Bluing wear due to running the bolt would be an indicator, which you can get a bit from pictures, but you really need the rifle in your hands, and even then you need some expertise as far as re-blue or touch up, in specific areas or possibly all over.
I think if it were me, I would be asking for detailed pics, and probably asking for some pics of the barrel markings out of the stock. Sound like you know your stuff (I don't know your level of expertise, so that phrase is not meant to say you don't.) Start talking about an examination period (which any reputable dealer would allow on a $3500 rifle), and maybe mention a "seasoned collector" buddy of yours. If this guy is a con, that would likely start to smoke him out.
It would be a lot easier if the seller was a trusted member here. But he isn't. Which, duh!, if you are truly interested in buying, is the reason for the original post!
Last edited by GunDoc7; 04/22/17.
Clinging to guns & religion since 1959
Keyboards make people braver than alcohol
Election Integrity is more important than Election Convenience
Washington Post: "Democracy Dies in Darkness"
More correct: "Killing Democracy Faster Than Darkness"
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2015
Posts: 423
Campfire Member
|
|
Campfire Member
Joined: Mar 2015
Posts: 423 |
Seller must mean never fired once it left the factory!
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 96,041
Campfire Oracle
|
|
Campfire Oracle
Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 96,041 |
Would need better and more detailed pics of the firearm.
Life Member SCI
Life Member DSC
Member New Mexico Shooting Sports Association
Take your responsibilities seriously, never yourself-Ken Howell
Proper bullet placement + sufficient penetration = quick, clean kill. Finn Aagard
Ken
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 23,024
Campfire Ranger
|
|
Campfire Ranger
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 23,024 |
Nyrifleman: The Rifle looks to be all original from what I can tell by the exceptionally POOR photos in the ad.
Sad it was stored for so long on its buttpad - that detracts some.
IF... you want a collector piece this may be a great gun - if you are interested then ask the seller SPECIFICALLY what the percentage of finish on both the metal, the bolt face and the wood ARE!
Check also to see if the original scope base screws are intact and get a written three day inspection guarantee.
Good luck if you decide to go for this one.
I won't comment on the price other than to say its higher than what I would pay or would ask for my quite similar Westerner-Alaskans if I were interested in selling them or buying another!
These are rather rare Rifles especially in this condition -IF that Rifle is worth that much money then I simply must adjust my on-line and hard copy inventories.
By the way that serial number puts date of manufacture right at/on October 1st 1962.
Hold into the wind
VarmintGuy
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 48,024
Campfire 'Bwana
|
|
Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 48,024 |
I don't get that vibe, but I don't get a big positive vibe either.
But I think my inner voice is quiet because I'm not interested. If I was considering dropping $3500, or even a lot less, my inner voice might have something to say too!
I guess some depends on if you think the rifle was "created" or refinished.
I would need to get into Rule to be sure, but the smaller checkering patterns and the pad look right? (Experts jump in here, yes or no?) Location of the proof marks might say something. I think they went to 12 O'clock to somewhat random late in production. But I don't think this was consistent. (Nutty when you think about it. That whole location thing could have been nothing more than a new guy proofing and stamping. He didn't give a flip, or know any better, and no one was watching him. Now 55 years later we are discussing it like archeologists!)
With regard to a possibly "created" rifle, the .300 Win. Mag. barrel had to come from somewhere. The barrels changed in '64 when they were free floated, correct? So, it is probably a legit barrel. Detail of the barrel roll mark is something Rule could help with if you can get good pictures. Bluing wear due to running the bolt would be an indicator, which you can get a bit from pictures, but you really need the rifle in your hands, and even then you need some expertise as far as re-blue or touch up, in specific areas or possibly all over.
I think if it were me, I would be asking for detailed pics, and probably asking for some pics of the barrel markings out of the stock. Sound like you know your stuff (I don't know your level of expertise, so that phrase is not meant to say you don't.) Start talking about an examination period (which any reputable dealer would allow on a $3500 rifle), and maybe mention a "seasoned collector" buddy of yours. If this guy is a con, that would likely start to smoke him out.
It would be a lot easier if the seller was a trusted member here. But he isn't. Which, duh!, if you are truly interested in buying, is the reason for the original post! Great post gundoc...
I try to stick with the basics, they do so well. Nothing fancy mind you, just plain jane will get it done with style. You want to see an animal drop right now? Shoot him in the ear hole. BSA MAGA
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 48,024
Campfire 'Bwana
|
|
Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 48,024 |
I need to say something here, since we are talking pre 64 300 Winchester magnums. I passed up the opportunity to own a real 300WM made in 1963. The good guy (here) that offered it to me had no idea how much it was worth. I guess he inherited it and asked if I'd be interested in buying it from him for "$500.00". I told him I'd love to buy it, but not for that price! ! ! ! ! !! I then told him what the rifle was really worth... 
I try to stick with the basics, they do so well. Nothing fancy mind you, just plain jane will get it done with style. You want to see an animal drop right now? Shoot him in the ear hole. BSA MAGA
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 1,935
Campfire Regular
|
|
Campfire Regular
Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 1,935 |
Good for you BSA. Your honor is worth more than a few thousand dollars.
In addition, that ought to earn you some good points in the Karma ledger.
Clinging to guns & religion since 1959
Keyboards make people braver than alcohol
Election Integrity is more important than Election Convenience
Washington Post: "Democracy Dies in Darkness"
More correct: "Killing Democracy Faster Than Darkness"
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 46,245
Campfire 'Bwana
|
|
Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 46,245 |
I'd rather spend that level of money on a nice non-bubba'd early to mid 50's Super Grade in another cartridge! 
Trump Won!
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 8,087
Campfire Outfitter
|
|
OP
Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 8,087 |
Gunner, about 20 years ago I was at a local gun show and a fellow was carrying around a super grade featherweight in 270.
He was asking $3,000 if I recall correctly.
My girlfriend at the time, who is my wife now, encouraged me to buy that rifle.
I really should listen to her more often.
“Factio democratica delenda est"
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 46,245
Campfire 'Bwana
|
|
Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 46,245 |
Oh damn!  I've a good habit of listening to mine, she's really money smart ;]
Trump Won!
|
|
|
|
Forums81
Topics1,191,387
Posts18,469,716
Members73,931
| |
Most Online11,491
Jul 7th, 2023
|
|
|
|
