Home Forums Reloading Big Game Rifles why do hunters get talked into ........

Trends -

Entrance of heavy marketing & product competition = product differentiation & high dollar custom and niche products.

Exit of older guy's who used to set up the new hunters with handed down gear, and the common sense that goes along with it.

Higher way, higher hour workers with more money to spend than time to get out and hunt who can afford higher dollar stuff like 1000 yd bench rest optics.

Trophy hunting business with big dollar hunts make a rifle a least cost alternative.

Combine all of these and you have many reasons why a high dollar market niche has evolved.

Doesn't matter if it's a guy who invests in a few guns and ends up with high dollar stuff after 20 years of upgrading or mr. big bucks who just goes after the double rifle stuff.

Is this a good thing - probably not - I can and have missed an elk with a 1200 dollar rifle that I could have missed with a 600 dollar rifle. Does give me less excusses (LOL), and puts a grin on the face of the old men in the tent who know it doesn't really make that big of a difference.

At the end of the day if more gun makers would produce rifles that are very accurate like Tikka - well then I don't think so many people would go high dollar. Can't say that for glass, but I can say that for rifles.

So I agree ya don't need high dollar things to kill more elk or whitetails, but that won't stop anyone from buying it.

Spot

TFF.
I think you have just coined the latest "campfireisim" The "Magoo rifle"

I like it... "The Magoo Rifle and Glass Co." Serving the cheap hunter since 2007!

[quote=.280Rem
I like it... "The Magoo Rifle and Glass Co." Serving the cheap hunter since 2007! [/quote]

I think there are a couple of things at work here. First, those that frequent sites like this are more than casual about their endeavors. They want performance and are always tuning things. The casual person will likely be happy with one rifle and never visit this site. That probably fits most of our hunting population in the US.

Second is a person's ability to pay. My first new in box was a Rem 600 6mm back in 1963 for about $99.95. I think I earned just short of a buck an hour back then working a gas station The most recent buys were a Shiloh Sharps for about 3.5 grand and a Swed 6.5 x 55 for about $125. Now I'm into quality and that Swed action is indeed sweet. No add or store clerk ever talks me into a purchase though. I will spend months researching the vicissitudes of various cartridges and components before I lock things down. Before I enter the store or make an order, I know exactly what I will be leaving with. That being, over about 45 years, I have traded away only 2 of my purchases. One a custom 270 with headspace, and the second a handgun dad did not want around the house with a sub teen brother when I left for the service. Really though, hunting and firearms has never been about need or economics. I could probably eat a little better had I never taken up the hobby. Both give me pleasure though and that's reason enough.

SPOT: GREAT post; +5 on that. (Who ever gets a +5?).The truth is too amusing! TFF.

Classic.............

simple question to every one is general.. smart ass reply from someone individually.. why insult the man's question??? just because his philosophy differs from yours??? The guy who asked the question isn't the dink here...

Read the bolded above...it wasn't just a question...it was him calling others out on their choices...you call people out...you might get a terse response...like mine. Read the entire thread...the "dink" vote was cast, but we'll note your vote as well.

Hey 280, isnt it funny when "we" get called out on something we maybe use or like and then when we turn the tables on "them", they go crying about it to their mommies.

Seems to me that srwshooter started things off by suggesting that others with different points of view "are just plain crazy". Not the best way to start a discussion but a great way to start an argument.

As I stated in an earlier post, I've never heard anyone say "you need a 1500.00 gun, 1000.00 scope and 150.00 set of rings". But there is nothing wrong with spending that kind of money, either. Like others (most?) here, I question srwshooter's assumptions.

It seems to me that people who buy top-dollar equipment generally fall into two camps, the inexperienced and the experienced. We don't need to deal with the experienced as they will buy what they want and need based on that experience and the knowledge that comes with it.

The inexperienced are much more likely to be talked into a purchase they might not make if they had more experience. IMHO they are often not trying to "buy success" so much as they are trying to "avoid failure", which is a completely different thing.

Case in point - when I bought my first centerfire rifle back in 1982, a Ruger, I paid extra for a model with iron sights. The dealer convinced me that if the scope broke it wouldn't be a hunt-ending event. It turns out I have never used the iron sights in the field - the one time that I might have needed to do so two broken ribs pretty much ended the hunt anyway. Was the dealer wrong? Nope. Was I a shmuck for paying extra? I don't think so. Two and a half decades later I believe I made the right decision and would make it again under the same circumstances. These days I just take a backup rifle on my hunts.

Smitty - good post - I think it all boils down to a web of respect among all of us. We all have our own experiences, tastes, and expectations. When we can share these amongst ourselves without denigrating each others' we are at our best and can learn a lot from each other. Best to all, John

I'm a member and / or lurk on quite a few other sites. Some gun sites, some not. Without exception, the gun / hunting sites are the only ones that get into these types of pissing contests.
Just an observation and not directed at anyone.

Here is why I by into the "buy good stuff camp."

Back in the late 80's may father and I scrimped and saved for over 3 years to go on a guided backcountry elk hunt trip in Idaho. I upgraded to a Vari-II 3-9 on my 30-06 just before the hunt. I had some experience elk hunting (archery only though) and knew it could be rough so I encouraged my father to do the same as he had a 1960s vintage Redfield. Well after a flight into Moose Creek and a 9 hour horseback ride to camp we were ready to hunt. The first day it rained a lot and my father's scope fogged up and his rifle was done for the whole trip. We each spent around $5000 on the hunt and his was impacted by a cheap scope. He lost an opportunity to get a bull by using the unfamiliar "camp" rifle. I connected on the last day after tracking a bull and jumping him out of his bed. The weather on that trip was cold, rainy or snowy. You and your equipment were always wet. In order for it to survive in that environment, it had better be good quality. BTW, My Leupy is still working to this day.

A buddy of mine lost an opportunity this past year at a decent GA buck. His cheap Tascoleaked during a rain shower. He was unable to get off a shot at the buck walking past at 30yds.

Cheap is cheap. If it works for you, I'm truely happy for you. I haven't seen one incident of where someone posted a picture of their rifle and was put down for it. I have seen where guys have posted pics and some of us are envious of their Leica or Swarovski but I am happy for them too. Be happy with what you have and don't begrudge someone who has something different.

RH

I think himmelrr made a good post. I've hunted with the Tascos, Bushnells, and Weavers and have taken a good deal of deer with them. Right now I have 2 Leupold's and a Nikon on my hunting rigs. I think it depends on how much you hunt and where you hunt. I hunt in eastern NC for 4 months (bow and gun) and hunt a week in WV. I drive 550 miles to hunt there. If I take one rifle/scope combo, I expect it to work all dang week. Not to say that the other scopes have let me down, but as I got a bit older and could afford better optics, it was my first priority. It's just a small example. Now think about himmelrr's post and saving up for an elk hunt! My feeling is get the best that you can afford for what you do. If you hunt a week out of the year because of length of seasons, work, etc. then dropping two months mortgage into a hunting rig probably isn't a good idea. If you hunt a long season and/or travel out of state, then you won't hurt yourself getting the most optics, firearsms, etc. that your budget can allow. Just my personal feelings on what I've experienced.

Coyote Hunter,
Another plan would be to have a second scope mounted in a set of rings and sighted in previous to the hunt. Chances are with Ruger rings if the scope was already sighted in all you would have to do is switch scopes and maybe take a sighter or two prior to the next hunt. It would be a lot easier than having a second rifle along.
whelennut

I work in the data protection industry where NSPOF (No Single Point of Failure) is a standard system design criteria. A single rifle with a busted stock, broken safety, busted ejector, or a myriad of other problems can effectively end a hunt.

Your suggestion is a good one for someone that only has a single rifle, like I did back in '82 and for the next couple years, but I've never found taking two rifles to be an issue. A few years ago I was mighty glad to have two rifles when I pulled one out and discovered I had brought a mis-matched rifle/ammo combo. My second rifle and ammo matched up just fine.

Taking two rifles also allows me to hunt with both of them, which I often do.

As I read this thread the "Law of diminishing returns" comes to mind. Just because a person's gear costs three times as much doesn't mean it is three times better. However because a person occupies a high station and commands a big salary doesn't mean they appreciate the finer things either. I have a brother in law
who hunts with an old semiauto Winchester that he won by buying a raffle ticket for a dollar thirty some years ago. The scope is the cheapest I have ever seen. He has no other rifle. Even though he is the vice-president of a big, fourth generation construction company and makes good money. He just likes to hunt deer on his Dad's place on opening weekend and he is done until next year.
I don't care what he hunts with but he seems pretty jealous of what I show up with, although he could afford it if he was interested.
A song goes something like this, " My gal is red hot, your gal ain't doodley squat"
whelennut

Well you can pay the price to have a red hot girl(time, wining ,dining etc.)or ya can pay a hooker $20 bucks again choice is all yours just how ya wanna get to the final destination

Some guys are "collectors" and some guys are shooters. The guys with the most guns and the most expensive guns aren't necessarily shooting them. I guess maybe they just have great imaginations of being the big hunter, rather than actually shooting their "stuff." I have much respect for the guys that shoot their rifles on a regular basis, and know what they can do with them under real hunting conditions, rather than those who keep their "beauties" under lock and key, just to be able to say they own status stuff. But this is America land of the free, whether they be "talkers" or doers.