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Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 1,943
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OP
Campfire Regular
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 1,943 |
The forum is slow these days, might as well kick the hornets nest.
I am working on loads for my 5th 308 Win. and was talking with a bud about it. We both kind of agreed it is overrated in terms of accuracy. I really like the chambering and think it is tied with the 270 Win for the best best NA hunting round for the average hunter. Not hard to get MOA groups, but I've never had a real smoker. For a tack driver, I'd bet on a 6.5 Creed any day.
The truth angers those whom it does not convince
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Joined: Jan 2023
Posts: 265
Campfire Member
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Campfire Member
Joined: Jan 2023
Posts: 265 |
if you're getting MOA and you're talking about hunting rifles, WTH is the problem with accuracy? Creedmore may be a tack driver, but I'll take a 308, 270, or 30-06 for hunting any day. Yep, you kicked the hornet's nest of the unrepentant old guy who despises Creedmores.
Show class, have pride, and display character. If you do, winning will take care of itself. Coach Bryant.
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Joined: Jun 2004
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 44,860 Likes: 4 |
The forum is slow these days, might as well kick the hornets nest.
I am working on loads for my 5th 308 Win. and was talking with a bud about it. We both kind of agreed it is overrated in terms of accuracy. I really like the chambering and think it is tied with the 270 Win for the best best NA hunting round for the average hunter. Not hard to get MOA groups, but I've never had a real smoker. For a tack driver, I'd bet on a 6.5 Creed any day. The Creedmoor has the advantage of better chamber/throat dimensions standardized by SAAMI. In particular, the SAAMI min spec throat diameter for the Creedmoor is a half thousandth over bullet diameter. The corresponding dimension for the 308 is two thousandths over bullet diameter.
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Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 17,246
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 17,246 |
All the homework has been done on the .308 for decades, regarding reamers, bullets, loads, rifle blueprints, etc. and that counts for a lot in some folks' eyes. Used to be that when a big name accuracy shop or tactical shop put up promotional pics of 10 round groups from their rifles, it was generally either going to be a .308 or a 6mmBR / 6mmPPC.
Now with even more aplomb
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Joined: Jun 2004
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 44,860 Likes: 4 |
if you're getting MOA and you're talking about hunting rifles, WTH is the problem with accuracy? Creedmore may be a tack driver, but I'll take a 308, 270, or 30-06 for hunting any day. Yep, you kicked the hornet's nest of the unrepentant old guy who despises Creedmores. Any particular reason?
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Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 44,860 Likes: 4
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 44,860 Likes: 4 |
All the homework has been done on the .308 for decades, regarding reamers, bullets, loads, rifle blueprints, etc. and that counts for a lot in some folks' eyes. Used to be that when a big name accuracy shop or tactical shop put up promotional pics of 10 round groups from their rifles, it was generally either going to be a .308 or a 6mmBR / 6mmPPC. And it's a solid bet their 308 chamber reamer didn't have a .310"+ throat diameter.
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Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 17,246
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 17,246 |
And it's a solid bet their 308 chamber reamer didn't have a .310"+ throat diameter. Bet you are right....
Now with even more aplomb
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Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 6,855 Likes: 1
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 6,855 Likes: 1 |
I have owned a number of 308s over the years and moved on to other more "interesting" cartridges but I finally found my way out of the wilderness and back to the 308 almost by accident. I was building a rifle in 6mm CM and at the last moment, decided to buy a suppressor. With that in mind, the only 20" Proof pre-fit barrel available was in 308 so the decision was made, 308 it was going to be. After shooting the 308 again after being away for year, I'm convinced it's the most well balanced short action cartridge available, it does everything well with little fanfare. It has become my go-to hunting rifle and don't see that changing.
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Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 9,555
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 9,555 |
The forum is slow these days, might as well kick the hornets nest.
I am working on loads for my 5th 308 Win. and was talking with a bud about it. We both kind of agreed it is overrated in terms of accuracy. I really like the chambering and think it is tied with the 270 Win for the best best NA hunting round for the average hunter. Not hard to get MOA groups, but I've never had a real smoker. For a tack driver, I'd bet on a 6.5 Creed any day. Holy smokes! Might as well take a picture of yourself whizzing in a box full of .222Rem brass while you're at it.
I can walk on water.......................but I do stagger a bit on alcohol.
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Joined: Jun 2001
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Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 10,784 Likes: 1 |
Love the 308 Winchester. Does everything I need!
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Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 17,275
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 17,275 |
The forum is slow these days, might as well kick the hornets nest.
I am working on loads for my 5th 308 Win. and was talking with a bud about it. We both kind of agreed it is overrated in terms of accuracy. I really like the chambering and think it is tied with the 270 Win for the best best NA hunting round for the average hunter. Not hard to get MOA groups, but I've never had a real smoker. For a tack driver, I'd bet on a 6.5 Creed any day. No argument here. I, like you will shoot whatever I damn well please..
"I have sworn upon the altar of God, eternal hostility against every form of tyranny over the mind of man." Thomas Jefferson
GeoW, The "Unwoke" ...Let's go Brandon!
"A Well Regulated Militia" Life Member
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Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 1,379
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 1,379 |
At least the OP didn't criticize the 30-06.
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Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 12,138 Likes: 1
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 12,138 Likes: 1 |
The forum is slow these days, might as well kick the hornets nest.
I am working on loads for my 5th 308 Win. and was talking with a bud about it. We both kind of agreed it is overrated in terms of accuracy. I really like the chambering and think it is tied with the 270 Win for the best best NA hunting round for the average hunter. Not hard to get MOA groups, but I've never had a real smoker. For a tack driver, I'd bet on a 6.5 Creed any day. The Creedmoor has the advantage of better chamber/throat dimensions standardized by SAAMI. In particular, the SAAMI min spec throat diameter for the Creedmoor is a half thousandth over bullet diameter. The corresponding dimension for the 308 is two thousandths over bullet diameter. This is the right answer. Cut a .308 Win with a .3085 diameter/.175 long/1 degree freebore in a good barrel and it will shoot to the limits of the shooter.
John Burns
I have all the sources. They can't stop the signal.
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Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 20,824
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 20,824 |
I have owned a bunch of 308's , a bunch of 270's , and a couple of 6.5 Creedmoor's , both the 270's and the Creedmoor's on average were more accurate than the 308's
Originally Posted by Judman PS, if you think Trump is “good” you’re way stupider than I thought! Haha
Sorry, trump is a no tax payin pile of shiit.
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Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 48,106 Likes: 8
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 48,106 Likes: 8 |
I have owned a bunch of 308's , a bunch of 270's , and a couple of 6.5 Creedmoor's , both the 270's and the Creedmoor's on average were more accurate than the 308's I agree with you and the OP. I've had many 308's, some have even been frustrating, where my 30-06's best them. The last 2 308's I'm keeping are very good shooters though. I'll be hanging on to them for a while. A couple months ago, I did a side by side comparison between one of my 6.5 creedmoor's and my latest 308 winchester. Tit for tat, the creedmoor kicked its azz.. I actually had high hopes for the 308 that day!!
I try to stick with the basics, they do so well. Nothing fancy mind you, just plain jane will get it done with style. You want to see an animal drop right now? Shoot him in the ear hole. BSA MAGA
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Joined: Mar 2018
Posts: 1,018
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Mar 2018
Posts: 1,018 |
My custom Schultz and Larsen heavy barrel model 54 target 308 Win is likely just as accurate as any 6.5 C. It's more accurate than me. My best 5 shot groups at 100 yds are in the 0.3" which is basically a ragged hole. It's better groups are easily repeatable. My local range has a 300 yd berm, so for a shorter range target gun I'm not looking for more accuracy and don't need the advantage of. 264" over .308"
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Joined: Mar 2018
Posts: 1,018
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Mar 2018
Posts: 1,018 |
Another thing that makes my Schultz a better short ranger is the old school 1:14 twist. It loves 155gr and 168gr, but won't stabilize more than 180’s
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Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 42,620 Likes: 1
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 42,620 Likes: 1 |
I think I'll quit right here.
A good principle to guide me through life: “This is all I have come to expect, standard lackluster performance. Trust nothing, believe no one and realize it will only get worse…”
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Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 1,943
Campfire Regular
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OP
Campfire Regular
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 1,943 |
Again, I like the 308 and it's been my main hunting cartridge for years. 2 Factory Rem 700's, a Tikka, a CVA, and 1 custom with a Douglas with a 'match' chamber.... I've never had one that was a real tack driver. Seen a lot of factory rifles in 6.5 Creed not need custom work to outshoot about any 308 Win I have seen. Still believe its rep as to accuracy is a bit overstated.
The truth angers those whom it does not convince
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Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 48,106 Likes: 8
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 48,106 Likes: 8 |
I think I'll quit right here. You are like me. All of your rifles shoot good. "I'll quit right here". Well, I can't stop right there. The most accurate 308win I've seen is one of my buddies. He's a member of the local SWAT. He asked if I'd shoot it, "to see what it could really do". Funny thing is it's an old Tikka that his dad gave him recently. "Dad never shot it, just stuck it in the closet about 10 or 15 years ago", according to my buddy. Anyway, a stainless T3 varmint. 5 shots on target: I did not take that target home and try to measure it, since it was my buddies rifle. This is as it was stapled to the backer board. My buddy took a pic with his phone that has a ballistic app that measures groups. It said ".110" or something like that. I told him it was fos and probably closer to 1/4". Because of my buddies great shooting Tikka, I had to pull mine out and start messing with it: Mine is also a T3, but a stainless lite. Not a damn thing wrong with these older T3's, after you replace the aluminum recoil lug and the bolt shroud. I also put this one in a new T3X stock, added a bolt stop from a 6.5 creedmoor and also run creedmoor mags, so I can get the bullets out close to the lands. It's a great shooter: Then my latest buy was a Winchester model 70 Heavy varmint model. Love the rifle and it was a damn good deal. I recently sold my AR10 308 target rifle, and found myself with almost 1,000 pcs of 308 win primed brass. Most primed with BR2's, so buying another 308 was the right thing to do. Now, to be fair, after shooting a roughly 3/4" group at 400 yards with it, I thought it was ready to take on the creedmoor, that is the backup to my competition rifle. Wind conditions sucked that day, so it was a great test. Not being partial to either one, to be fair, I set out to see which one prevailed as winner: The 6.5 Creedmoor: As you can see, both rifles were wearing identical scopes. None had an advantage in that department. That's why I left the competition rifle at home!! Here are the results from 2 very similar rifles: 6.5 CM: 308 Win: I have respect for the 308 win, but there's no denying how good the 6.5 creedmoor really is.
I try to stick with the basics, they do so well. Nothing fancy mind you, just plain jane will get it done with style. You want to see an animal drop right now? Shoot him in the ear hole. BSA MAGA
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