Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Long Range Hunting Rifle Cant

It is impossible for the reticle to be "level" and "canted" at the same time

If the reticle is level, but the bore centerline is not directly below it, the rifle is canted.

Totally incorrect, if the rifle is canted and the reticle is level all adjustments both vertical and horizontal will be correct.

The best case scenario for that situation is that a consistent left or right offset from point of aim can be maintained. If windage is set to perfect zero, it will be different at other distances.

Well that's interesting! My main long range rifle is set up with a small cant but my scope is set to level! It tracks perfectly true out past 1200 yds without dialing windage. Please tell me how exactly I achieved that if it's not possible.

There is a big difference between doing it and guessing about it! When set up properly the windage is zero problem at all. Perhaps share with the group how you have your long range rifle set up so we can figure out where your problem is

It's a simple geometry situation. I can only assume that the offset difference is lost in the background clutter of the wind and other factors in your situation. I shoot at 1000 yard several times a month and have 3300 rounds on my current .308 barrel in the last 18 months for what that's worth. Spin drift amounts to a solid .75 moa at 1000 yards, but of course you know that. Add in the wind, and it is never still for that distance and I'll repeat the offset I mention can easily be missed. Best of luck with your long range shooting. The more you learn the better it gets.

What you just described has nothing to do with what we were discussing but OK

When I make an adjustment for windage at 1000 yds it's based on spin drift and wind only. In dead calm I don't adjust at all. I only have 1800 rounds down range in the last 7 months. Our thousand yard steel is 12" square. I guess I'm lucky as hell to continually hammer the hell put of the steel without adjusting for the cant in the rifle.

At some point you shot with a canted "scope" and you computed that into your equations and now are passing it along as the same as cant in the rifle.. A canted rifle and a canted scooe are two different things. Next you will be putting the primer in the bullet end and the bullet in the primer pocket. Its rather important to keep things that are different where they belong rather than mixing them up and calling them the same. Best of luck to you in your shooting endeavors as well.

My observation was that this particular shooter, who happened to be a junior coach and seemed to be quite skilled:

Prone/Sitting - fairly vertical rifle/scope hold

Standing - the position seemed to have cant into it, to the left. He was shooting a March scope so he's well invested and not a casual plinker - made me wonder about the issues that MAY arise from that.

I used a lot of cant with my AR service rifle due to the short length of pull and near vertical grip compared to my M1. All is good , you just need to add some windage adjustments to the elevation corrections or the different stages.

Trystan, I have re-read my posts and have not interchanged any terminology.

One more try for the geometrically declined:

1. A canted rifle is a canted rifle whether the reticle is leveled or not.

2. Leveling the reticle will true up the windage and elevation adjustments back to vertical and horizontal. It will dramatically reduce the horizontal shifts and eliminate the vertical shifts.

3. Leveling the reticle WILL NOT place the line of sight vertically above the path of the bullet. There will be an offset based on the amount of cant.

4. Forcing a true windage zero with this line of sight misalignment will only be correct at that distance. Accepting the offset distance and paralleling it at all distances is another option.

5. If the geometry still does not make sense, I believe most hand held shooting ballistic apps should have inputs for sight offsets. With a level reticle over a canted rifle, that offset is what should be input. You can play around with the numbers and see if it matters for your "slight cant".

6. Based on the amount of cant, the ranges involved, and the resolution of the shooter/rifle system, these differences may not be noticed among the other variables.

Remember to load the pointy end first. It is rather important. :-)

"blackboard" for the win...

Addendum. Top view of LOS and bullet trajectory versus distance for uncanted and canted rifle, regardless of reticle orientation. As Mike said, if you zero the rifle with the initial windage offset the same at the zero range, then the windage offset will be constant with distance. If making trajectory adjustments using reticle or erector, then scope orientation matters.

great discussion

A Jordan masterpiece 😁 and is a good illustration of the problem

Good, informative discussion here, without too much of the usual thread disintegration.

I personally level everything to the earth at the point of initial scope installation. If it’s a gun I’m going to regularly dial and shoot out past about 400 yards (IMO, real world point where canting starts to result in meaningful dispersion, resulting in misses), I will also install an auxiliary bubble level on the scope to keep me level in the field. Especially when shooting angles on uneven terrain. Sometimes what appears level to the eye, isn’t.

Oh yeah. It’ll be worth millions some day.

Would a critic say it's derivative of prior work?

Certainly. But I can’t control market demand.

Just like Hunter’s huh? 😁