Home Forums Reloading Bullet Casting What size die do I need ?

I've got a bunch of unsized Hi-tek coated hard cast projectiles that I intend to use in my Winchester Model 92 44 mag
The coated projectiles vary in size up to 0.436.
I've slugged the bore and it comes out at 0.4297, not inclined to run 0.006 oversize projectiles down the bore I'm going to have to size them down.
I'm guessing the lee sizing kit in 0.430 is going to be too small ?
What sized die would you recommend ?
Thank you for your advice in advance.

What's your throat diameter?

Or do they seat, chamber and function fine in a fouled gun, assuming they are seated and crimped in a crimp groove?

If they do, I wouldn't be trying to "fix" them.

In the end it's hard to fine tune things if one is a slave to the commercial bullet industry. I'll guess, without knowing your throat diameter, and say that you'll find best results somewhere between .431 to .433 - and does Lee make a push through die in that diameter?* Gotta consider how tight/sloppy the chamber is too regarding function of a given bullet. You're messing with somewhat elevated pressures if things are on the fat side too.

One thing about sizing way oversize bullets to a smaller diameter is the force necessary to push them through a die - it's not a joyful experience. Another thing is squeezing the grooves closed (but that is only a consideration with lubed bullets). Does that much sizing (say .006" reduction) disrupt/compromise powder coating? Dunno, I'm not a PC-er.

*I'm out of touch with what Lee offers in push through die sizes. I have pieces of 7/8-14 all-thread and a lathe, and a phone with which to order specific diameter chucking reamers (they aren't expensive), and routinely make my own. I leave the die soft, no need for hardness as I'll probably never push enough lead bullets through it to wear it out.

That much sizing can affect the coating depending on how careful the coater was to ensure the bullets were perfectly clean and perfect adherence was obtained. Not being a fan of sizing bullets more than .004" I would recommend sizing no smaller than .432".

Rather than measuring your throat by doing a "pound slug" you can slip fit bullets or guage pins into the case mouths of fired cases. The pin/bullet should fit snugly in the case for the best measurement. One could use something like the closed jaws of needle nose pliers to open the mouth edge ever so slightly to reduce shaving or getting a false measurement.

Following with interest.

Size a few to 0.431" and see how they load and chamber. If they are sticky, check seating depth first to see if that changes anything. If not then size them to 0.430" and see what they do. You don't need over sized bullets with powder coat. You want them the same as the internal dimensions.

It's a lever action rifle.

I'd assumed coated bullets needed to be oversized, thank you for the advice.

Throat dimension is important no matter what kind of gun.

I also have a 44mag rifle .429+ bore. I size my bullets to .430 & they shoot great. .436 is way over size for a .430 bore. You want your bullet to be no more than .001 over bore.

+1 on .430 and would suggest you use a taper crimp die for cast to improve accuracy. Just straighten the case mouth to hold the bullets, do not roll crimp. I shoot a 444 with hard cast sized to groove diameter, shoots to 1" at 200 meters off the bench with a scope. The 444 is just a longer 44 Mag. I shoot the Lyman 210 and 240 SWCs with Unique.

I agree that I'd start with .430, but wouldn't be afraid to experiment to see what gave me the best accuracy. I had a 45 Colt that shout best with bullets sized the exact diameter of the slugged bore.

Did you try the largest bullet, crimped in the groove to see if it would function? I think the coating has some variance in it; enough to fill the eyelet of a jig hook....so long as it chambers and you can get the lever closed without too much effort, I wouldn't try to "fix" them.

I'd rather a bullet be closer to throat diameter than groove diameter, regardless of the variance.


4 45 Colts get bullets .005-.006 greater than their groove diameter. 2 Colt Anacondas and two 25-5's.

3 29-2 44's get bullets .004-.005 over groove.

The 25-2 gets bullets about .004 over groove.

Folks have been shooting .311 and larger bullets out of 30/30s, 308's and 30-06's for years.

Hollow based bullets were common as well, and it wasn't to fit the groove diameter of barrels.

Thank you for the advice.
Picked up 50 at 0.430 will load and try them this week.

Loaded 20 at 1700 fps, fired 3 before I checked the barrel, already started to show signs of lead fouling.

Given that far out of tolerance plus the PC thing I'd probably set my lead pot outside, fill it up with these castings, melt them down and start over. I'd run away for the first 20 minutes of this process. Baking off PC will be nasty.

OK,

Broken record time.....did you EVER try to load a dummy round with the fattest bullet to see if it chambered and functioned?

Its okay if the coating is peeled in the process, so long as it chambers and functions.

Jamming tight is obviously no good, chambering and tight is golden.....

Dummy rounds with the larger bullets won't chamber.

Not that I would be inclined to pull the trigger on a 6 thou oversized hard cast projectile

I'm not advocating that you do, but really it's not like lead bullets (even "hard cast, whatever that means) are as hard and unyielding as jacketed bullets. One of my shooting buddies shoots a Swiss single shot target rifle with a .32 (8mm) bore but its chamber is similar to a .38 Special cartridge and its throat is .35 caliber also. Accuracy with .32 lead bullets is atrocious but when used with .35 caliber lead bullets that fit the throat accuracy is astonishing, with zero leading and low enough pressure that the .38 Special brass he uses have been fired over 100 times now.

Okay.

Are there smaller ones that do chamber without undue effort? What do they measure?
That is the size die to get, maybe .001 less if it makes you more comfortable.