In some respects, Grizzly 566’s near record-breaking heft isn’t completely surprising. Male grizzly bears don’t reach their peak body size until age 14, van Manen pointed out.
Plus, a couple other grizzlies handled in 2023 had relatively high body fat percentages, he said. Ordinarily, by October, females reach 28% to 30% body fat and males are just a little bit fatter — it’s 32% or so of their fall body mass.
Boars are the fatter sex because they need extra reserves for when they emerge from the den. That’s breeding season: Males are more interested in getting to know female grizzlies than extensive eating, and they’re actually losing “quite a bit” of body mass in April and May, van Manen said.
Grizzly 566 figures to be set up well for ursine philandering come next spring.
“He had 41% body fat,” van Manen said. “It looks like the highest [body fat figure] we’ve had before was 43%.”
Were Yellowstone-region grizzlies as a population fatter than average in 2023?
Tough to say, van Manen said, though the rate of fat gain appeared “pretty much normal” this year, he said. The leanest time of year is the end of June, when grizzlies typically range from 15% to 20% body fat. Because dozens of grizzlies are captured across the ecosystem throughout each spring, summer and fall, comparing grizzly bear fat levels from one year to the next isn’t straightforward statistically.
Taking a longer view, however, the science on grizzly bear body fat is more clear. Grizzly fat accumulation rates have not changed over the decades, nor is there any correlation to population density, recent research has found.
That says a lot, van Manen said, about the remarkable plasticity of grizzly diets: Even as major food sources like whitebark pine, cutthroat trout and some ungulate populations have declined, bears are still packing it on.
“The way these animals are gaining fat from June through October hasn’t changed,” he said. “These are incredibly resourceful animals and they’re finding calories on the landscape.”
The GF was reading a partial article from the Billings gazette I believe (had to subscribe for the full article…) it said something about a grizzly sighting in the Missouri Breaks. They’re slowly moving east.
They are seeing them well east of the Pryor mountains as well. Give it ten years and they will be out to Miles Ciity.
Osky
I think once they get back on the plains and away from the exercise of mountain living you will see them much larger. Some black bears in MN have topped well over 800lbs, those grizzlies should have no problem getting beyond that.
Last edited by Osky; 11/27/23.
A woman's heart is the hardest rock the Almighty has put on this earth and I can find no sign on it.
There were at least 4 different grizzlies on an elk carcass that we found fall 2022. We set up a trail camera and caught these bears. At least one was as big as the Yellowstone bear in the article…
Brown and grizzly bears are classified as the same species even though there are notable differences between them.
Fast Facts
Size Up to 1,500 lbs Distribution Brown bears occur throughout Alaska except on islands south of Frederick Sound in southeast Alaska, west of Unimak in the Aleutian Chain, and Bering Sea islands. Diet Onmivorous Predators Other Brown bears Reproduction Twins are most common, but litter sizes can range from 1 to 4 Remarks Can be a wide range of colors Other names Brown and grizzly are both used in Alaska
Around 20 years ago a boar grizzly was snared and tranquilized by biologists along the Rocky Mountain Front, west of Great Falls. The portable scale the biologists had only went up to 800 pounds, and the bear bottomed it out--and that was in the spring, when he was not long out of his winter den. He would have weighed considerably more in the fall, possibly 1000+.
“Montana seems to me to be what a small boy would think Texas is like from hearing Texans.” John Steinbeck
I thought it was pretty routine for Grizzly Bears to get this big. Really tells how much I know about the species.
There was an 880 lb. Black bear shot in North Carolina in 1998. This Grizz is a pipsqueak in comparison.
That Black Bear fed on Soybeans, Corn besides whatever it scrounges in the woods.
Actually that particular bear was feeding on dead hogs from the local hog farm. They would dump the dead hogs in a bin and he would raid it at night. He was eating a hog every couple of days. He was right at 6 foot from nose to tail. I was told he had 12 inches of fat on his back. Killed by a shotgun slug and it was a cousin of Dolly Partons that killed him.
Around 20 years ago a boar grizzly was snared and tranquilized by biologists along the Rocky Mountain Front, west of Great Falls. The portable scale the biologists had only went up to 800 pounds, and the bear bottomed it out--and that was in the spring, when he was not long out of his winter den. He would have weighed considerably more in the fall, possibly 1000+.
No Grizzly on the lower 48 has ever weighed 1,000 lbs.
Around 20 years ago a boar grizzly was snared and tranquilized by biologists along the Rocky Mountain Front, west of Great Falls. The portable scale the biologists had only went up to 800 pounds, and the bear bottomed it out--and that was in the spring, when he was not long out of his winter den. He would have weighed considerably more in the fall, possibly 1000+.
I thought it was pretty routine for Grizzly Bears to get this big. Really tells how much I know about the species.
There was an 880 lb. Black bear shot in North Carolina in 1998. This Grizz is a pipsqueak in comparison.
That Black Bear fed on Soybeans, Corn besides whatever it scrounges in the woods.
Actually that particular bear was feeding on dead hogs from the local hog farm. They would dump the dead hogs in a bin and he would raid it at night. He was eating a hog every couple of days. He was right at 6 foot from nose to tail. I was told he had 12 inches of fat on his back. Killed by a shotgun slug and it was a cousin of Dolly Partons that killed him.
That makes sense and 12" of fat Holy Cow . The point I was trying to make is there is a lot of food for Black Bears to feed on in Eastern NC.
Yep. Lots of food, man made and natural plus thick pocosin swamps to hide in. They also really don’t hibernate at all. Just eat and grow big. 700lbs is not unusual down there.
Around 20 years ago a boar grizzly was snared and tranquilized by biologists along the Rocky Mountain Front, west of Great Falls. The portable scale the biologists had only went up to 800 pounds, and the bear bottomed it out--and that was in the spring, when he was not long out of his winter den. He would have weighed considerably more in the fall, possibly 1000+.
No Grizzly on the lower 48 has ever weighed 1,000 lbs.
EVER.
Would like to know how you're so absolutely certain?
The reason I ask is that the Montana Department of Fish, Wildlife and Parks has kept records of the heaviest game animals that have been officially weighed (and witnessed), and the heaviest "whole" grizzly in the state (not field-dressed, skinned, etc.) on a certified scale weighed 1102 pounds. And the record for many years went 1018.
“Montana seems to me to be what a small boy would think Texas is like from hearing Texans.” John Steinbeck
Salmonella - Your mounts are truly impressive, and I congratulate you on them, but it looks like you may owe John an apology. I personally like knowing there have been 1000 pound griz in the lower 48.
Salmonella - Your mounts are truly impressive, and I congratulate you on them, but it looks like you may owe John and apology. I personally like knowing there have been 1000 pound griz in the lower 48.
Just sayin' Rex
He makes stupid statements regularly. An apology? LOL
Salmonella - Your mounts are truly impressive, and I congratulate you on them, but it looks like you may owe John and apology. I personally like knowing there have been 1000 pound griz in the lower 48.
Just sayin' Rex
He makes stupid statements regularly. An apology? LOL
God, you're an as shole... Do you even do anything but post stupid remarks on the internet?
Around 20 years ago a boar grizzly was snared and tranquilized by biologists along the Rocky Mountain Front, west of Great Falls. The portable scale the biologists had only went up to 800 pounds, and the bear bottomed it out--and that was in the spring, when he was not long out of his winter den. He would have weighed considerably more in the fall, possibly 1000+.
No Grizzly on the lower 48 has ever weighed 1,000 lbs.
EVER.
Would like to know how you're so absolutely certain?
The reason I ask is that the Montana Department of Fish, Wildlife and Parks has kept records of the heaviest game animals that have been officially weighed (and witnessed), and the heaviest "whole" grizzly in the state (not field-dressed, skinned, etc.) on a certified scale weighed 1102 pounds. And the record for many years went 1018.
"Madel, who has been managing bears on the Front for 24 years, wonders if the bear he trapped this spring was sired by the largest male grizzly ever recorded in the Northern Rockies: an 8-foot, 800-plus pound bruin trapped in 2003 in the Blackleaf Wildlife Management Area northwest of Choteau."
Mule Deer, This quote is from the article that Whitetail in MT linked above. I don't know who is right or wrong and I'm too lazy to do any more digging on this subject. It would be interesting to find out for sure how big the largest grizz is/was around here.
Around 20 years ago a boar grizzly was snared and tranquilized by biologists along the Rocky Mountain Front, west of Great Falls. The portable scale the biologists had only went up to 800 pounds, and the bear bottomed it out--and that was in the spring, when he was not long out of his winter den. He would have weighed considerably more in the fall, possibly 1000+.
No Grizzly on the lower 48 has ever weighed 1,000 lbs.
EVER.
Would like to know how you're so absolutely certain?
The reason I ask is that the Montana Department of Fish, Wildlife and Parks has kept records of the heaviest game animals that have been officially weighed (and witnessed), and the heaviest "whole" grizzly in the state (not field-dressed, skinned, etc.) on a certified scale weighed 1102 pounds. And the record for many years went 1018.
"Madel, who has been managing bears on the Front for 24 years, wonders if the bear he trapped this spring was sired by the largest male grizzly ever recorded in the Northern Rockies: an 8-foot, 800-plus pound bruin trapped in 2003 in the Blackleaf Wildlife Management Area northwest of Choteau."
Mule Deer, This quote is from the article that Whitetail in MT linked above. I don't know who is right or wrong and I'm too lazy to do any more digging on this subject. It would be interesting to find out for sure how big the largest grizz is/was around here.
Around 20 years ago a boar grizzly was snared and tranquilized by biologists along the Rocky Mountain Front, west of Great Falls. The portable scale the biologists had only went up to 800 pounds, and the bear bottomed it out--and that was in the spring, when he was not long out of his winter den. He would have weighed considerably more in the fall, possibly 1000+.
No Grizzly on the lower 48 has ever weighed 1,000 lbs.
EVER.
Would like to know how you're so absolutely certain?
The reason I ask is that the Montana Department of Fish, Wildlife and Parks has kept records of the heaviest game animals that have been officially weighed (and witnessed), and the heaviest "whole" grizzly in the state (not field-dressed, skinned, etc.) on a certified scale weighed 1102 pounds. And the record for many years went 1018.
"Madel, who has been managing bears on the Front for 24 years, wonders if the bear he trapped this spring was sired by the largest male grizzly ever recorded in the Northern Rockies: an 8-foot, 800-plus pound bruin trapped in 2003 in the Blackleaf Wildlife Management Area northwest of Choteau."
Mule Deer, This quote is from the article that Whitetail in MT linked above. I don't know who is right or wrong and I'm too lazy to do any more digging on this subject. It would be interesting to find out for sure how big the largest grizz is/was around here.
There are likely several factors leading to conflicting numbers. "Biggest" could be referring to only weights of captured bears, or it could truly be the heaviest ever documented by any means. Then there's the time element as well as a reporter's ability to discern it all and accurately present what it is they're reporting.
Around 20 years ago a boar grizzly was snared and tranquilized by biologists along the Rocky Mountain Front, west of Great Falls. The portable scale the biologists had only went up to 800 pounds, and the bear bottomed it out--and that was in the spring, when he was not long out of his winter den. He would have weighed considerably more in the fall, possibly 1000+.
No Grizzly on the lower 48 has ever weighed 1,000 lbs.
EVER.
Sorry Harry. F&G caught one out of Choteau four years ago that weighed out at 1105
"...the left considers you vermin, and they'll kill you given the chance..." Bristoe
Thanks dassa. Sure wish they gave more details and documentation than just a number in the whole Grizzly column. I'm skeptical by nature so it's hard for me to believe. Especially in the age of the internet where fantastic tales are frequently disproven as b.s. Not saying the MT FWP is lying, just that my guard is up after seeing too many doctored photos and false news stories from the interwebs.
1100 lbs. isn't out of the realm of possibility though, so I guess it could be true.
Around 20 years ago a boar grizzly was snared and tranquilized by biologists along the Rocky Mountain Front, west of Great Falls. The portable scale the biologists had only went up to 800 pounds, and the bear bottomed it out--and that was in the spring, when he was not long out of his winter den. He would have weighed considerably more in the fall, possibly 1000+.
No Grizzly on the lower 48 has ever weighed 1,000 lbs.
EVER.
Sorry Harry. F&G caught one out of Choteau four years ago that weighed out at 1105
ingwe; Good evening my cyber friend, I hope all is as well as can be in your world tonight.
I'm not sure whether or not I'm more surprised at the weight or that it was in Choteau!!
It's been a long long time since we've driven through Choteau, but isn't it out of the mountains by a little bit?
We went up from your town then through there and up through Baab and into Waterton NP in Alberta.
Baab was interesting enough on it's own without a half ton grizzly...
I just saw where the article that Whitetail in MT linked and from which I quoted was published in 2007. If my math teacher didn't fail me that's 16 years ago. So not surprising that bigger bears have been documented since then.
The thought of running into a half ton of grizz in the woods around here makes me pee a little. Sounds like the big ones are up around Choteau though, so maybe I'm safe. Let 'em run around Letterman's place.
I'd hate to run into one while archery hunting elk. Imagine one sneaking up on you while doing a cow call. I'd probably never try that again and I'd do more than pee a little.
Ecc 10:2 The heart of the wise inclines to the right, but that of a fool to the left.
A Nation which leaves God behind is soon left behind.
"The Lord never asked anyone to be a tax collector, lowyer, or Redskins fan".
I just saw where the article that Whitetail in MT linked and from which I quoted was published in 2007. If my math teacher didn't fail me that's 16 years ago. So not surprising that bigger bears have been documented since then.
The thought of running into a half ton of grizz in the woods around here makes me pee a little. Sounds like the big ones are up around Choteau though, so maybe I'm safe. Let 'em run around Letterman's place.
They are not all around Choteau, the greater Yellowstone area is home of large bears. Mine was 7 foot with a 22 5/16” skull. It takes 24” to make the record book. My dad killed one the year before that went 9 feet squared. There are plenty of hunters in Alaska that don’t get bears that big…
A big Griz I photographer in Tom Miner Basin, north of YNP fall 2022. It is about 35 yards away. He was digging up and crunching ground squirrels, I was on foot, out of the truck, but in retrospect, I won't do that again.He never knew I was there. You could hear the crunches when he found one~~
A big Griz I photographer in Tom Miner Basin, north of YNP fall 2022. It is about 35 yards away. He was digging up and crunching ground squirrels, I was on foot, out of the truck, but in retrospect, I won't do that again.He never knew I was there. You could hear the crunches when he found one~~
Your tale leaves me wondering if possibly that Griz really just didn't care that you were there more so than 'didn't know' you were there.
You're aware that posting photos of trophy Montana Grizzlies you've hunted means you're older than dirt since there ain't been no open season for over 30 years?
Here's mine..
He just cracked 7ft and I didn't have no scale with me to properly weigh his azz but he didn't weigh no 1000 pounds.
After wrestling him around to get him skinned I'd guess he weighed a lot closer to half that..
A big Griz I photographer in Tom Miner Basin, north of YNP fall 2022. It is about 35 yards away. He was digging up and crunching ground squirrels, I was on foot, out of the truck, but in retrospect, I won't do that again.He never knew I was there. You could hear the crunches when he found one~~
Your tale leaves me wondering if possibly that Griz really just didn't care that you were there more so than 'didn't know' you were there.
Great pic, nice opportunity.
His nose is very pointed, his ears are on top of his head. I'd say that's not a very big bear.
A big Griz I photographer in Tom Miner Basin, north of YNP fall 2022. It is about 35 yards away. He was digging up and crunching ground squirrels, I was on foot, out of the truck, but in retrospect, I won't do that again.He never knew I was there. You could hear the crunches when he found one~~
Your tale leaves me wondering if possibly that Griz really just didn't care that you were there more so than 'didn't know' you were there.
Great pic, nice opportunity.
His nose is very pointed, his ears are on top of his head. I'd say that's not a very big bear.
He was right at 6 foot from nose to tail. I was told he had 12 inches of fat on his back.
I recall reading that bear fat/grease was an important commodity on both sides of the 18th Century Frontier. The Indians in particular would smear it on as bug repellant in the summertime. As a result they stunk different than did unwashed White folks.
"...if the gentlemen of Virginia shall send us a dozen of their sons, we would take great care in their education, instruct them in all we know, and make men of them." Canasatego 1744
[Sorry Harry. F&G caught one out of Choteau four years ago that weighed out at 1105
ingwe; Good evening my cyber friend, I hope all is as well as can be in your world tonight.
I'm not sure whether or not I'm more surprised at the weight or that it was in Choteau!!
It's been a long long time since we've driven through Choteau, but isn't it out of the mountains by a little bit?
We went up from your town then through there and up through Baab and into Waterton NP in Alberta.
Baab was interesting enough on it's own without a half ton grizzly...
All the best.
Dwayne[/quote]
Hi Dwayne,
Yes, Choteau is out of the mountains, but grizzlies regularly show up around the little town, and sometimes in it, usually by following the Teton River. My friend Bill McRae, the well-known wildlife photographer and hunting writer, purchased a house near the west edge of Choteau, right on the Teton, around 25 years ago. (He'd lived in a nearby but even smaller town for many years, but right in the middle of town.) He saw grizzlies going up and down the river every year. (Bill's also one of those long-time Montana hunters who legally tagged a grizzly years ago, but has also hunted them in Alaska.)
Of course the Rocky Mountain Front is ranching country, and the bears take some livestock every year, which is partly why they can get so big. Another friend up there has a ranch about 10 miles west of Conrad, in the foothills. Grizzlies regularly show up in the yard, and a few years ago the Montana Fish, Wildlife and Parks killed a big boar on the place, which had taken up residence to munch on both cows and, especially, sheep. (My friend called it "the .300 Weatherby injection....)
There are quite a few places in Montana where grizzlies regularly roam between the mountains and the valleys, usually by following streams. Another is north of Missoula, in the Mission Valley west of the Mission Mountains, which like the Choteau area is also very good upland-bird hunting. Every few years some pheasant hunter would get charged by a grizzly while hunting the brushy country along the valley streams. Several hunters were mauled, and several bears were shotgunned up close with birdshot.
I lived in Missoula for 11 years in the late 70s and early 80s, and hunted that area pretty regularly, but tended to stay out of the really thick stuff. One year my first Labrador and I were working the brush along a stream when Gillis came running back to me with his tail between his legs, taking quick, wide-eyed glances behind him. I followed his backtrail maybe 50 feet, staying out in the open, and yep, there were fresh bear tracks with claw-tip marks well in front of the pads.
This was on a farm not far off the main state highway through the valley, where parents regularly had to drive their kids to meet the school bus, because grizzlies were roaming the gravel roads between the farms.
Best, John
“Montana seems to me to be what a small boy would think Texas is like from hearing Texans.” John Steinbeck
Mule Deer; Good morning to you sir, thanks for the additional info.
That's interesting but not surprising when I think about how far some of the tagged ones travel here.
If I ever get my computer back from the shop, I'll throw up some photos of the fresh grizzly tracks in the snow we ran across this year just a wee bit north of here.
I've got to admit it made my pulse quicken a tad knowing what had to be still hungry grizzly bears were hunting the same whitetail I was.
Speaking of, we've got 3 days left and there's an uncut tag, so I'll be off now.
just listened to a podcast about GNP's Night of Grizzly in '67
interesting perspective on attitudes toward Grizzlies up until then.
glad I didn't listen to it before I went hiking up there
Read that as a kid. Still remember it. Awful night.
When a country is well governed, poverty and a mean condition are something to be ashamed of. When a country is ill governed, riches and honors are something to be ashamed of . Confucius
[Sorry Harry. F&G caught one out of Choteau four years ago that weighed out at 1105
ingwe; Good evening my cyber friend, I hope all is as well as can be in your world tonight.
I'm not sure whether or not I'm more surprised at the weight or that it was in Choteau!!
It's been a long long time since we've driven through Choteau, but isn't it out of the mountains by a little bit?
We went up from your town then through there and up through Baab and into Waterton NP in Alberta.
Baab was interesting enough on it's own without a half ton grizzly...
All the best.
Dwayne
Hi Dwayne,
Yes, Choteau is out of the mountains, but grizzlies regularly show up around the little town, and sometimes in it, usually by following the Teton River. My friend Bill McRae, the well-known wildlife photographer and hunting writer, purchased a house near the west edge of Choteau, right on the Teton, around 25 years ago. (He'd lived in a nearby but even smaller town for many years, but right in the middle of town.) He saw grizzlies going up and down the river every year. (Bill's also one of those long-time Montana hunters who legally tagged a grizzly years ago, but has also hunted them in Alaska.)
Of course the Rocky Mountain Front is ranching country, and the bears take some livestock every year, which is partly why they can get so big. Another friend up there has a ranch about 10 miles west of Conrad, in the foothills. Grizzlies regularly show up in the yard, and a few years ago the Montana Fish, Wildlife and Parks killed a big boar on the place, which had taken up residence to munch on both cows and, especially, sheep. (My friend called it "the .300 Weatherby injection....)
There are quite a few places in Montana where grizzlies regularly roam between the mountains and the valleys, usually by following streams. Another is north of Missoula, in the Mission Valley west of the Mission Mountains, which like the Choteau area is also very good upland-bird hunting. Every few years some pheasant hunter would get charged by a grizzly while hunting the brushy country along the valley streams. Several hunters were mauled, and several bears were shotgunned up close with birdshot.
I lived in Missoula for 11 years in the late 70s and early 80s, and hunted that area pretty regularly, but tended to stay out of the really thick stuff. One year my first Labrador and I were working the brush along a stream when Gillis came running back to me with his tail between his legs, taking quick, wide-eyed glances behind him. I followed his backtrail maybe 50 feet, staying out in the open, and yep, there were fresh bear tracks with claw-tip marks well in front of the pads.
This was on a farm not far off the main state highway through the valley, where parents regularly had to drive their kids to meet the school bus, because grizzlies were roaming the gravel roads between the farms.
Best, John[/quote]
Both the Northern Cheyenne and the Crow history tell of being careful summer camping along the Bighorn, Rosebud, Tongue, and Powder watersheds in Montana due to having a lot of trouble with grizzlies along there for the wild plums and other favored foods. The Tongue was said to be the worse. It’s noted by the early trappers as well. Those days will come again sooner than one thinks. The bears are nearly back east that far.
Osky
A woman's heart is the hardest rock the Almighty has put on this earth and I can find no sign on it.
Around 20 years ago a boar grizzly was snared and tranquilized by biologists along the Rocky Mountain Front, west of Great Falls. The portable scale the biologists had only went up to 800 pounds, and the bear bottomed it out--and that was in the spring, when he was not long out of his winter den. He would have weighed considerably more in the fall, possibly 1000+.
No Grizzly on the lower 48 has ever weighed 1,000 lbs.
Thanks dassa. Sure wish they gave more details and documentation than just a number in the whole Grizzly column. I'm skeptical by nature so it's hard for me to believe. Especially in the age of the internet where fantastic tales are frequently disproven as b.s. Not saying the MT FWP is lying, just that my guard is up after seeing too many doctored photos and false news stories from the interwebs.
1100 lbs. isn't out of the realm of possibility though, so I guess it could be true.
You might want to read how big game weight records are accepted by the Montana Fish, Wildlife & Parks Department:
"This section provides a listing of some of the largest weights on record for the various Montana big game species. As such, the standards require verification and the use of a certified scale. Whole weight is either from a live animal or a dead and uncut animal; dressed weight is an animal with head, skin and feet attached and the complete viscera removed.
Future records should include sex, date killed, location taken, hunter name, and observer names for the scale weight."
All of this is right there on the MT FWP website, next to the list of heaviest weights.
“Montana seems to me to be what a small boy would think Texas is like from hearing Texans.” John Steinbeck
Salmonella - Your mounts are truly impressive, and I congratulate you on them, but it looks like you may owe John and apology. I personally like knowing there have been 1000 pound griz in the lower 48.
Just sayin' Rex
He makes stupid statements regularly. An apology? LOL
God, you're an as shole... Do you even do anything but post stupid remarks on the internet?
A big Griz I photographer in Tom Miner Basin, north of YNP fall 2022. It is about 35 yards away. He was digging up and crunching ground squirrels, I was on foot, out of the truck, but in retrospect, I won't do that again.He never knew I was there. You could hear the crunches when he found one~~
Around 20 years ago a boar grizzly was snared and tranquilized by biologists along the Rocky Mountain Front, west of Great Falls. The portable scale the biologists had only went up to 800 pounds, and the bear bottomed it out--and that was in the spring, when he was not long out of his winter den. He would have weighed considerably more in the fall, possibly 1000+.
No Grizzly on the lower 48 has ever weighed 1,000 lbs.
Salmonella - Your mounts are truly impressive, and I congratulate you on them, but it looks like you may owe John and apology. I personally like knowing there have been 1000 pound griz in the lower 48.
Just sayin' Rex
He makes stupid statements regularly. An apology? LOL
God, you're an as shole... Do you even do anything but post stupid remarks on the internet?
Lmao. You’re a clown dude
If Sal is a clown.... you are an idiot.....
Originally Posted by Judman PS, if you think Trump is “good” you’re way stupider than I thought! Haha
This bear was killed West of Lincoln and called the Blackfoot river drainage home.... same area the lady bike rider was drug from a tent a mauled a couple years ago... it has become a grizzly hot spot lately. I was stopped along the creek one day having lunch and a rancher pulled up and said a few hours earlier a sow with cubs was seen in the exact spot I was standing. It added a new dimension to my lunch break for sure. The bears seem to love the brushy creek bottoms.
Originally Posted by Judman PS, if you think Trump is “good” you’re way stupider than I thought! Haha
You might want to read how big game weight records are accepted by the Montana Fish, Wildlife & Parks Department:
"This section provides a listing of some of the largest weights on record for the various Montana big game species. As such, the standards require verification and the use of a certified scale. Whole weight is either from a live animal or a dead and uncut animal; dressed weight is an animal with head, skin and feet attached and the complete viscera removed.
Future records should include sex, date killed, location taken, hunter name, and observer names for the scale weight."
All of this is right there on the MT FWP website, next to the list of heaviest weights.
I do believe MT records only include score/date/location/(hunter/owner).
Fish go by weight, seldom are big game species killed in a location where they can be transported to a certified scale intact.
Interesting and related 2016 story c/p from the Great Fals Tribune
Famous Grizzlies of Montana
Scarface
Scarface, or No. 211 as researchers called him, was a 25-year-old icon in Yellowstone National Park. His nickname, which came from extensive scarring on the right side of his head, was well known in Yellowstone by biologists and photographers.
First collared after being captured when he was 3, he was recaptured 16 times. In his prime, he weighed about 600 pounds, about as big as they get in Yellowstone, according to Kerry Gunther, bear management biologist in Yellowstone.
He was shot and killed in late November 2015 north of Gardiner. The incident is still under investigation.
Most grizzlies in the Yellowstone ecosystem die at an average age of 11. When last captured in 2015, the aging Scarface weighed in at only 338. Fewer than 5 percent of male bears born in the Greater Yellowstone Ecosystem survive to 25 years. Loma bear
The Loma Bear reminded 21st Century Montanans that grizzlies once occupied the state’s prairies.
On June 30, 2009, the grizzly that traveled 177 miles, as the Teton River flows, from the Rocky Mountain Front to Loma, was captured on a Marias River farm, a mile and a half from the Missouri River, where explorers Lewis and Clark chronicled run-ins with fearsome prairie bears as they passed through in the early 1800s.
It was the first time that Montana bear managers had seen a bear that far east of the Rocky Mount Front.
The bear was relocated to the Flathead National Forest, west of the Continental Divide, but the Loma Bear, as it became known, preferred the plains.
In August 2009, a biologist picked up a signal from the bear’s radio collar. The bear had crossed the Divide, coming out of the mountains near East Glacier. The bear was northeast of Browning, in open grassland, and headed toward Alberta.
That’s the last time authorities knew where the bear was until it showed up again in Chouteau County on July 12, 2010. When it was trapped, the radio collar was no longer on its neck.
The bear was euthanized after it killed chickens, the second time it had fed on domestic animals. Gertie the Grizzly
One of the best-remembered and most photographed bears in Glacier history was Gertie, a honey-colored grizzly that used to beg morsels from tourists below the Garden Wall on Going-to-the Sun Road during the 1940s. She learned to sit on her haunches and beg, as traffic passed on either side. Gertie was the epitome of the cute bum bear, a Yogi prototype, and her photo appeared in many publications, including National Geographic. When Gertie had cubs, she would bring them along and they quickly learned the benefits of the mooching routine. Gertie’s begging days came to an end in 1949 after several minor biting and scratching incidents. Despite being the photogenic host of the park, she was trapped and moved, returning once before being trapped and moved again — never to return. Lincoln bear
The Lincoln Ranger District is home to the mount of one of Montana’s most famous grizzlies, which at 12 years old was struck and killed by a truck in October of 2007.
The grizzly weighed 830 pounds — among the biggest bears ever documented in the continental United States. That’s about 250 pounds heavier than the average adult male grizzly in the lower 48.
The bear began its life east of the Divide, on the Rocky Mountain Front near Choteau. It traveled the Blackfoot River Valley, including the Lincoln area, since at least 2004.
The bear was hit by a vehicle once before the fatal collision, and also survived being shot. Geifer Creek bear
The Geifer Creek grizzly is one of Montana’s most mischievous grizzlies. From 1975 to 1977, the bear damaged dozens of homes and cabins in the Middle Fork and North Fork of the Flathead.
On hot pursuit by wildlife officials armed with snares, steel traps, tranquilizer guns and scoped rifles, they would always arrive too late to the scene of the crime — only to find a window or door pushed in and a huge mess in the cabin.
He was eventually killed by a hunter in Canada. Ethyl
She was quite the sightseer in her older years.
Ethyl, a 20-year-old sow, logged 2,800 miles in fewer than three years, crossing interstate highways, and major city boundaries, including residential backyards — and never got into any trouble with humans.
In her early years, Ethyl hung around Lake Blaine, between Bigfork and the Swan Mountains. After her first capture in 2006, she was relocated but returned in 2012 to the same apple orchard that got her in trouble once before. She was recollared and relocated to a more remote drainage.
That’s when she got wanderlust – and never got in trouble again.
She discovered the Bob Marshall Wilderness and took a few hikes on the Rocky Mountain Front between Lincoln and Augusta. She checked out the Mission Mountains and the Jocko Lakes area.
She then headed to Idaho along the Interstate 90 corridor, passing Arlee as she traveled. She moved north of Wallace, Idaho, past Kellogg and made it nearly to Coeur d’Alene before apparently denning somewhere in the Panhandle.
By April 2014, she was back in Montana along I-90, past Superior and headed right for Missoula where she turned south through the Blue Mountain Recreation Area on her way to Lolo (where she walked right through the town) and eventually Florence.
She headed to Coeur d’Alene again, then back to Missoula en route to the Bob, right past her old stomping grounds at Lake Blaine. She checked out the sites in Glacier National Park before moving west toward Eureka, where she lost her collar on Oct. 17, 2013.
Other notables
•Two Toes roamed Swan Valley in the 1890s killing a small fortune in livestock before being hunted down.
• Old Terror the pig killer Around 1900, lived in the the Cabinet Mountains. Hunters reported firing 40 shots at the grizzly at close range. Newspaper reports said the bear survived because of its “supernatural toughness.”
.The Falls Creek Male He became a legendary cattle killer in the late 1980s and 1990s, credited with about one cow, yearling or calf killed a year. Biologists maintain that the grizzly didn’t kill nearly as much livestock as reported, but did add to its notoriety by eluding capture until 2001.
They left out the story of the Grizzly living behind the Dairy Queen in Bigfork... gives a new twist to dumpster diving...
Years ago one of my customers was Pahaska Tepee on the east edge of Yellowstone. They told me they had to warn guest as they left the bar late at night to walk back to their cabins to watch out as they had bears patrolling around the place looking for food.
Then one afternoon I was driving into Buffalo Bill boy scout camp on the N. Fork of the Shoshone and encountered a sow with cubs... thought that is cool... well around the next bend was a couple hundred boy scouts and their tent camp... told the camp administrator and he went into a semi rage, he wasn't too fond of the bears...
Another time up at Crandall, Wy by Sunlight basin I had to replace a commercial dishwasher in the kitchen of a dude ranch, apparently a grizz got into the kitchen and they shot at it and missed it with a 12 gauge and killed the dishmachine...
Originally Posted by Judman PS, if you think Trump is “good” you’re way stupider than I thought! Haha
You might want to read how big game weight records are accepted by the Montana Fish, Wildlife & Parks Department:
"This section provides a listing of some of the largest weights on record for the various Montana big game species. As such, the standards require verification and the use of a certified scale. Whole weight is either from a live animal or a dead and uncut animal; dressed weight is an animal with head, skin and feet attached and the complete viscera removed.
Future records should include sex, date killed, location taken, hunter name, and observer names for the scale weight."
All of this is right there on the MT FWP website, next to the list of heaviest weights.
I do believe MT records only include score/date/location/(hunter/owner).
Fish go by weight, seldom are big game species killed in a location where they can be transported to a certified scale intact.
You don't know what you're talking about. The record Montana grizzly bear weights from the past several years have been recorded from tranquilized bears that were trapped, using official, scales and witnessed by several people.
“Montana seems to me to be what a small boy would think Texas is like from hearing Texans.” John Steinbeck
Bear sizes seem to be crazy variable. I am assuming how long they’re sleeping each winter and of course food availability/nutrition has a lot to do with it.
Here is a late August interior boar from the far north (so obviously a different dynamic than in Montana but I think my point is clear). Biologists checking him in estimated him at 15+ years old and ‘a GOOD bear in his prime’, I believe is how they phrased it. He missed B&C by less than an inch. I am told the bears in this area are underground for roughly 6 months of the year, which I assume limits their growth to some extent. He didn’t have as much fat on his back as I had figured he would, but I am no bear expert.
My tape had him right at 6 foot nose to tail and while there wasn’t a weight scale anywhere in sight, my best guess is that he weighed no more than 300-350(ish) lbs.
Bear sizes seem to be crazy variable. I am assuming how long they’re sleeping each winter and of course food availability/nutrition has a lot to do with it.
Here is a late August interior boar from the far north (so obviously a different dynamic than in Montana but I think my point is clear). Biologists checking him in estimated him at 15+ years old and ‘a GOOD bear in his prime’, I believe is how they phrased it. He missed B&C by less than an inch. I am told the bears in this area are underground for roughly 6 months of the year, which I assume limits their growth to some extent. He didn’t have as much fat on his back as I had figured he would, but I am no bear expert.
My tape had him right at 6 foot nose to tail and while there wasn’t a weight scale anywhere in sight, my best guess is that he weighed no more than 300-350(ish) lbs.
Tinman, you aren't doing it right! bear stories require a very large amount of exaggeration, it's a tradition.... your bear looks to me to be 500lbs at least and I am sure you killed him as he charged you!.....
Originally Posted by Judman PS, if you think Trump is “good” you’re way stupider than I thought! Haha
Around 20 years ago a boar grizzly was snared and tranquilized by biologists along the Rocky Mountain Front, west of Great Falls. The portable scale the biologists had only went up to 800 pounds, and the bear bottomed it out--and that was in the spring, when he was not long out of his winter den. He would have weighed considerably more in the fall, possibly 1000+.
No Grizzly on the lower 48 has ever weighed 1,000 lbs.
EVER.
I'd not put a bet on that. Some bears feeding on bison below the Great Falls of MT that Lewis and Clark encountered might have gone that heavy due to the abundance of food.
Ethyl, a 20-year-old sow, logged 2,800 miles in fewer than three years, crossing interstate highways, and major city boundaries, including residential backyards — and never got into any trouble with humans.
In her early years, Ethyl hung around Lake Blaine, between Bigfork and the Swan Mountains. After her first capture in 2006, she was relocated but returned in 2012 to the same apple orchard that got her in trouble once before. She was recollared and relocated to a more remote drainage.
That’s when she got wanderlust – and never got in trouble again.
She discovered the Bob Marshall Wilderness and took a few hikes on the Rocky Mountain Front between Lincoln and Augusta. She checked out the Mission Mountains and the Jocko Lakes area.
She then headed to Idaho along the Interstate 90 corridor, passing Arlee as she traveled. She moved north of Wallace, Idaho, past Kellogg and made it nearly to Coeur d’Alene before apparently denning somewhere in the Panhandle.
By April 2014, she was back in Montana along I-90, past Superior and headed right for Missoula where she turned south through the Blue Mountain Recreation Area on her way to Lolo (where she walked right through the town) and eventually Florence.
She headed to Coeur d’Alene again, then back to Missoula en route to the Bob, right past her old stomping grounds at Lake Blaine. She checked out the sites in Glacier National Park before moving west toward Eureka, where she lost her collar on Oct. 17,
I wonder if this was the one hanging out on the Stevensville High School lawn and the golf course. It was about that same time period.
As far as I know that bear never got into any trouble in the Bitterroot.
Bear sizes seem to be crazy variable. I am assuming how long they’re sleeping each winter and of course food availability/nutrition has a lot to do with it.
Here is a late August interior boar from the far north (so obviously a different dynamic than in Montana but I think my point is clear). Biologists checking him in estimated him at 15+ years old and ‘a GOOD bear in his prime’, I believe is how they phrased it. He missed B&C by less than an inch. I am told the bears in this area are underground for roughly 6 months of the year, which I assume limits their growth to some extent. He didn’t have as much fat on his back as I had figured he would, but I am no bear expert.
My tape had him right at 6 foot nose to tail and while there wasn’t a weight scale anywhere in sight, my best guess is that he weighed no more than 300-350(ish) lbs.
Tinman, you aren't doing it right! bear stories require a very large amount of exaggeration, it's a tradition.... your bear looks to me to be 500lbs at least and I am sure you killed him as he charged you!.....
Well I do suspect he is the same bear that bluff charged me a few days earlier about 1/2 mile away….
I will add a few points to my earlier post about you not knowing what you're talking about concerning Montana grizzlies:
As noted the vast majority that have been weighed in recent years have been trapped and tranquilized. This is partly because the last Montana hunting season took place in the early 1990s, and since then the population has not only increased but expanded to over half the state. Consequently the Montana Department of Fish, Wildlife and Parks is constantly monitoring bears, primarily to prevent bear/human conflicts--but also get a better handle on numbers, which is pertinent to reopening a hunting season.
I have known two of those FWP grizzly biologists, including the guy who headed the team which trapped and weighed the spring bear that bottomed out the portable 800-pound scale they used. His team primarily used horses in the backcountry in those days, and baited snares to catch bears.
But today more and more bears are showing up not just on ranches to eat livestock, but even in towns to raid garbage containers, partly because there isn't any hunting season. Unless they really become pests they're tolerated--though some are moved, usually in "culvert traps," a section of steel culvert mounted on a trailer, but sometimes by helicopter. But sometimes they just keep coming back, so are "euthanized," either by shooting, or injection after they're trapped.
So no, they're not killed by hunting in remote areas far from a suitable scale. Instead the scale is either in the hands of the biologists, or in a nearby town after a bear is culvert-trapped--which also makes it easy to transport the bear to a certified scale.
The grizzly biologist I mentioned earlier (who has since retired) was the one who weighed the bear that bottomed out the 800-pound scale, which indicated they needed larger-capacity scales. Incidentally, that bear had never been trapped by biologists before, probably because he was born before the last hunting seasons ended and had learned to avoid people.
“Montana seems to me to be what a small boy would think Texas is like from hearing Texans.” John Steinbeck
I will add a few points to my earlier post about you not knowing what you're talking about concerning Montana grizzlies:
As noted the vast majority that have been weighed in recent years have been trapped and tranquilized. This is partly because the last Montana hunting season took place in the early 1990s, and since then the population has not only increased but expanded to over half the state. Consequently the Montana Department of Fish, Wildlife and Parks is constantly monitoring bears, primarily to prevent bear/human conflicts--but also get a better handle on numbers, which is pertinent to reopening a hunting season.
I have known two of those FWP grizzly biologists, including the guy who headed the team which trapped and weighed the spring bear that bottomed out the portable 800-pound scale they used. His team primarily used horses in the backcountry in those days, and baited snares to catch bears.
But today more and more bears are showing up not just on ranches to eat livestock, but even in towns to raid garbage containers, partly because there isn't any hunting season. Unless they really become pests they're tolerated--though some are moved, usually in "culvert traps," a section of steel culvert mounted on a trailer, but sometimes by helicopter. But sometimes they just keep coming back, so are "euthanized," either by shooting, or injection after they're trapped.
So no, they're not killed by hunting in remote areas far from a suitable scale. Instead the scale is either in the hands of the biologists, or in a nearby town after a bear is culvert-trapped--which also makes it easy to transport the bear to a certified scale.
The grizzly biologist I mentioned earlier (who has since retired) was the one who weighed the bear that bottomed out the 800-pound scale, which indicated they needed larger-capacity scales. Incidentally, that bear had never been trapped by biologists before, probably because he was born before the last hunting seasons ended and had learned to avoid people.
I'm going to have to assume you are referring to me stating Montana doesn't include weight with their records of big game species?
The only link for records they have I am aware of is this one..
Tinman makes a good point about bear size, nutrition etc.... Years ago I worked at a shop with about 6 other guys, they were all hunters, deer & elk. None of them hunted bears. Well I wanted a bear and we had a spring season so every spring I went bear hunting. My co-workers humored me, but pretty much thought I was wasting my time. None of them had ever killed a bear. The first 2 years I would spot a bear or two , but could never get a shot. The third year I finally got a chance, I spotted a bear just as it went into a lone stand of tree's, so I hustled over and waited and when he came out the other side, I shot him at about 50 yds. I was very happy I finally got my bear. It wasn't very large, maybe 150 lbs ? anyhow back then we had to take the hide and skull to fish & Game, they tagged the hide , extracted a tooth and tested the meat. Naturally I took the hide to work to show my skeptical co-workers, I stretched the hide out and it was all they could do to keep from laughing. Finally somebody said, that's not very big! I didn't care, it was my first bear after a few years of trying. Well F&G sent me info from the tooth they extracted and told me it was a 7 year old bear and in it's prime.... I suspect 6 months denned up and climbing around the Montana mountains for a living made for a relatively small size bear? My second Mt. bear was a beautiful blond bear, about the same size and the F&G test results said it was also a 7 year old bear!
Edited to clarify, these were black bear, not grizzlies
Last edited by irfubar; 11/28/23.
Originally Posted by Judman PS, if you think Trump is “good” you’re way stupider than I thought! Haha
The coastal sow brown bear with 2 cubs that was on my deck at night a few years ago probably went 250 plus or minus. I was surprised she wasn't bigger. But she was plenty big enough at 5 feet that I didn't open the sliding glass door to take a picture, which reflected off the glass and didn't turn out. Even tho the deck light was on.
Her cub gave me a laugh. I had had a bird feeder in the corner of the deck, with the gate fastened back to form a triangle so the Lab would not bother the birds which soon learned they could safely feed with his nose inches away. I'd taken it down a few days before and cleaned up the spilled seed, but there were maybe 6 sunflower seeds on the deck, The cub was laying on his side, face jammed against the gate pickets, with it's tongue stretched out as far as it could go trying to get those last few seeds.
But there's only so much I'll do for a pic.
The one - a few years later- that came across the lawn just behind her cubs was no bigger - maybe smaller. The cubs were trying to go nosies with my Lab. The sow was telling her brats to get the hell back in the woods and was very, very carefully in not making eye contact with me. I was clutching my garden trowel and backing up, just behind the Lab. Our little procession as I backed 180 degrees around the house to a door was maybe 45 feet, front to back. That girl impressed me favorably!
The sow grizzly with 2 cubs on the Noatak that came by me at 3 yards was long legged and bigger bodied. Her head was about even with my chin. I'd guess she went 350 max, but that could have been my eyes wide open.
All good bears! But, as said, they vary widely in size, for any number of reasons.
I think hereditary traits are at play in bear sizes of course, hibernating habits too but continual food sources are the primary. In over 35 years in my far northern MN bear camp we have taken some beauties and have a very good population.
There is an area towards northwestern MN west of me where the heavy forest/bog country meets farm land and they have a lot more bears, a much faster growth rate, and overall many more heavy bears. It’s incredible what those bears can do to corn, sunflower, and soybean fields. The guys I know guiding there do very well.
These are black bears of course but I’m sure the same metrics come in play for the grizzlies. It’s interesting to me that the grizzly bears are somewhat stockier than the blacks here, or the ones from out east in those mountains. The longest I’ve seen here was 7’11” nose to tail. Our bears that top 300lbs, scale weighed, are 6’2” or better. The 300lb mark is achieved by year 11, sooner by 3 years in that agriculture area.
It’s great seeing all the grizzlies posted here and the guys reporting the lengths and weights. Sorry if I stepped on your topic Sal… but anything “bear” I greatly enjoy.
A side note.. I have pics from a camera of a black bear going 48” at the shoulder/back, simply huge. The researchers up here I’ve done work with knew the bear from their dealings with him at the bear sanctuary in Orr MN. They told me they had that bear in the 875lb range. They deduced that I don’t know how. Point is any animal population can have that odd giant but that’s what they are, an oddball.
Osky
A woman's heart is the hardest rock the Almighty has put on this earth and I can find no sign on it.
Tinman makes a good point about bear size, nutrition etc.... Years ago I worked at a shop with about 6 other guys, they were all hunters, deer & elk. None of them hunted bears. Well I wanted a bear and we had a spring season so every spring I went bear hunting. My co-workers humored me, but pretty much thought I was wasting my time. None of them had ever killed a bear. The first 2 years I would spot a bear or two , but could never get a shot. The third year I finally got a chance, I spotted a bear just as it went into a lone stand of tree's, so I hustled over and waited and when he came out the other side, I shot him at about 50 yds. I was very happy I finally got my bear. It wasn't very large, maybe 150 lbs ? anyhow back then we had to take the hide and skull to fish & Game, they tagged the hide , extracted a tooth and tested the meat. Naturally I took the hide to work to show my skeptical co-workers, I stretched the hide out and it was all they could do to keep from laughing. Finally somebody said, that's not very big! I didn't care, it was my first bear after a few years of trying. Well F&G sent me info from the tooth they extracted and told me it was a 7 year old bear and in it's prime.... I suspect 6 months denned up and climbing around the Montana mountains for a living made for a relatively small size bear? My second Mt. bear was a beautiful blond bear, about the same size and the F&G test results said it was also a 7 year old bear!
Edited to clarify, these were black bear, not grizzlies
I helped out a friend at his bear operation one spring in Idaho up against the Montana border. Horse operation of course. Had a client shoot a boar that the state aged at 17 years old. That boar looked nice and prime other than some grey hair and it was not 300 lbs nor was it 6’ long. Mountain blacks just don’t get the size. Sounds like you did very well.
Osky
A woman's heart is the hardest rock the Almighty has put on this earth and I can find no sign on it.
Tinman makes a good point about bear size, nutrition etc.... Years ago I worked at a shop with about 6 other guys, they were all hunters, deer & elk. None of them hunted bears. Well I wanted a bear and we had a spring season so every spring I went bear hunting. My co-workers humored me, but pretty much thought I was wasting my time. None of them had ever killed a bear. The first 2 years I would spot a bear or two , but could never get a shot. The third year I finally got a chance, I spotted a bear just as it went into a lone stand of tree's, so I hustled over and waited and when he came out the other side, I shot him at about 50 yds. I was very happy I finally got my bear. It wasn't very large, maybe 150 lbs ? anyhow back then we had to take the hide and skull to fish & Game, they tagged the hide , extracted a tooth and tested the meat. Naturally I took the hide to work to show my skeptical co-workers, I stretched the hide out and it was all they could do to keep from laughing. Finally somebody said, that's not very big! I didn't care, it was my first bear after a few years of trying. Well F&G sent me info from the tooth they extracted and told me it was a 7 year old bear and in it's prime.... I suspect 6 months denned up and climbing around the Montana mountains for a living made for a relatively small size bear? My second Mt. bear was a beautiful blond bear, about the same size and the F&G test results said it was also a 7 year old bear!
Edited to clarify, these were black bear, not grizzlies
I helped out a friend at his bear operation one spring in Idaho up against the Montana border. Horse operation of course. Had a client shoot a boar that the state aged at 17 years old. That boar looked nice and prime other than some grey hair and it was not 300 lbs nor was it 6’ long. Mountain blacks just don’t get the size. Sounds like you did very well.
Osky
Thank you Osky. I don't think Sal will mind our little diversion on his bear thread... and bear threads are fun as they should be
Originally Posted by Judman PS, if you think Trump is “good” you’re way stupider than I thought! Haha
I think I have told this story here before? but bear stories get better with age, no? I was on top of a mountain deep in the Bob Marshall wilderness hunting elk. We rode up to the tree line in elevation and were glassing, when I saw this thing slowly emerge from what was a 2000' cliff. As it came into view it was a very large grizzly. I pointed it out to the outfitter and he said , wow, that's a big bear.... problem being he was on the trail we just rode up and intended to return the same way.... We decided to eat our lunch and watch which way he goes.... he was about 300 yds away. He finally noticed us glassing him... instead of scurrying away as a good bear should do, he gave us that beady eyed stare they are known for! and started our way! the outfitter said he could be on us in a matter of seconds , grab your lunch , mount up and chamber a round! So we rode away over the ridge into the next basin.... as we rode through this alpine basin I noted several of the scrub pines had fresh piles of broken limbs at the base. I rode up to them and noticed fresh claw marks, the bear had raked the limbs off! thing is, sitting on the back of an average size horse I could barely reach the top of the claw marks! Since wee couldn't return the way we came we had to ride around the backside of the mountain, it was a long ride and we got into camp late at night.
Originally Posted by Judman PS, if you think Trump is “good” you’re way stupider than I thought! Haha
A friend once had to shoot a charging brown bear on Memorial Day weekend, just after season had ended. He, I, and an experienced guide went back up to skin it out. The guide estimated the bear at about 1,000 lbs, the hide squared 9'2", and the tooth section showed the bear to be 31 years old, at the time the second oldest on record. 4 30-06 rounds at about 30 yards had put him down, two of them fatal lung placement. The first round broke his left shoulder, turning him broadside . I guess the other round thru the guts would have proved fatal eventually too.
He still had 4" of fat on his hind quarters, less along the back, and a mouthful of missing, abscessed, and loose teeth. I easily pulled one of the "solid" ones out with my fingers.
Died in a run-off stream, so the 4"-of-hair hide was water soaked, draining all the way the 8 miles back-pack out, and hour's drive home, where it still weighed 180 lbs on my bathroom scale.
We took turns with the pack... with help getting it on, and up.
Back when I was doing some seasonal work for USFWS outside of Lincoln, we were having dinner one night at the local steakhouse. I had noticed the bear barrel trap outside and had heard that they were trying to trap a problem griz.
After several beers, the bar tender said they’d give me a free beer if I helped them bait the cage. My drunken butt of course naively climbed in the barrel trap to put the bait in the back.
Of course my [bleep] co-workers dropped the gate, pointed and laughed at me. They gave me my beer and I sat in that stupid trap for an hour with the smelly bait until they finally let me out.
Back when I was doing some seasonal work for USFWS outside of Lincoln, we were having dinner one night at the local steakhouse. I had noticed the bear barrel trap outside and had heard that they were trying to trap a problem griz.
After several beers, the bar tender said they’d give me a free beer if I helped them bait the cage. My drunken butt of course naively climbed in the barrel trap to put the bait in the back.
Of course my [bleep] co-workers dropped the gate, pointed and laughed at me. They gave me my beer and I sat in that stupid trap for an hour with the smelly bait until they finally let me out.
What a bunch of asses…😀.
Look at the brite side... at least they didn't drive you out into the hills to release you, honk the horn then drive off....
Originally Posted by Judman PS, if you think Trump is “good” you’re way stupider than I thought! Haha
Somebody here mentioned the grizzlies the Lewis and Clark expedition encountered, especially the big bison-eating bears around the Great Falls of the Missouri--and mentioned it was too bad they couldn't have weighed one. But I seem to remember they did, at least in parts--due to having several Lewis and Clark references in my library, including the eight-volume Reuben Gold Thwaites edition of their journals.
While L&C was primarily a military expedition, they were also tasked with several other jobs, including the natural history of the region--and had accurate instruments for weighing and measuring various animals. Will check and see if I can find the references.
“Montana seems to me to be what a small boy would think Texas is like from hearing Texans.” John Steinbeck
Just did a Google search and found one of the 8-volume set for $385.00--which isn't bad.
Eileen bought mine as a present around 20 years ago. Can't remember if birthday or Christmas present. (It might have been both, since I was born in December.) It has been a great and frequently used reference ever since.
“Montana seems to me to be what a small boy would think Texas is like from hearing Texans.” John Steinbeck
Found this August 5, 1805 quote from Lewis's journal:
"the Fieldses killed 2 large bear this evening one of them measured nine feet from the extremity of the nose to that of his tail, this is the largest bear except one that I have seen."
If they'd skinned the bear and laid the hide out flat it might well have measured even longer--and Lewis also an even larger bear! This was at the mouth of the Milk River, near present-day Fort Peck, Montana--which is the northeastern corner, on the plains. No doubt the bear had been eating plenty of buffalo.
Haven't found any mention of Lewis and Clark weighing grizzlies yet, but am not done looking.
“Montana seems to me to be what a small boy would think Texas is like from hearing Texans.” John Steinbeck
I think I have told this story here before? but bear stories get better with age, no? I was on top of a mountain deep in the Bob Marshall wilderness hunting elk. We rode up to the tree line in elevation and were glassing, when I saw this thing slowly emerge from what was a 2000' cliff. As it came into view it was a very large grizzly. I pointed it out to the outfitter and he said , wow, that's a big bear.... problem being he was on the trail we just rode up and intended to return the same way.... We decided to eat our lunch and watch which way he goes.... he was about 300 yds away. He finally noticed us glassing him... instead of scurrying away as a good bear should do, he gave us that beady eyed stare they are known for! and started our way! the outfitter said he could be on us in a matter of seconds , grab your lunch , mount up and chamber a round! So we rode away over the ridge into the next basin.... as we rode through this alpine basin I noted several of the scrub pines had fresh piles of broken limbs at the base. I rode up to them and noticed fresh claw marks, the bear had raked the limbs off! thing is, sitting on the back of an average size horse I could barely reach the top of the claw marks! Since wee couldn't return the way we came we had to ride around the backside of the mountain, it was a long ride and we got into camp late at night.
Nice story. Thanks
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A Nation which leaves God behind is soon left behind.
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Found this August 5, 1805 quote from Lewis's journal:
"the Fieldses killed 2 large bear this evening one of them measured nine feet from the extremity of the nose to that of his tail, this is the largest bear except one that I have seen."
If they'd skinned the bear and laid the hide out flat it might well have measured even longer--and Lewis also an even larger bear! This was at the mouth of the Milk River, near present-day Fort Peck, Montana--which is the northeastern corner, on the plains. No doubt the bear had been eating plenty of buffalo.
Haven't found any mention of Lewis and Clark weighing grizzlies yet, but am not done looking.
I think your search might be in vain. I found an entry on 5 May 1805 where Lewis said, "we had no means of weighing" a bear.
JeffA, I enjoyed reading about those various bears. I think I met one of Gertie's decendants in the early '90s, at the bridge leading in to the Camass Creek entrance. It was a yearling cub, very light blond except for chocolate colored snout and paws; no other bear in sight. An idiot tourist with a camera was about twenty feet from it. I strongly warned him about the likelyhood mama was close by, ready to chomp and mangle him; he just acted like I was the fool! I didn't hear of anyone getting mauled there, so assume he remained in the gene pool. About 9 years later our office assistant and her husband saw a grown griz with the same color about two miles from that spot.
In the late '80s biologists were studying bears, both species, both sides of the border around the NW corner of Glacier National Park, and had gotten quite good at estimating weights by track size and body condition before weighing them.they saw one large male several times, saw his tracks often, but were never successful in trying to trap him. Their estimate was ~1000 lbs. One day a biologist was watching a large black bear which they had trapped two days earlier, which weighed 440 lbs. While watching it the big grizzly rushed it, chomped it's head, and commenced feeding on it. He said it looked like the grizzly had nearly the whole head in it's mouth.
Sad ending for that bear, as it had never caused any trouble. An outfitter had a camp in the area (S.E. B.C.); he had been warned twice to keep his camp cleaner. One evening he and two clients crossed the border, illegally, went to Polebridge and drank excessively. When they returned, the bear was in camp; he gut-shot it, never informed BC conservation, leaving a wounded huge predator wandering the woods during hunting season. About a week later he again went to Polebridge, got drunk, and told the story. This was reported, the story corroberated by clients, and the outfitter forfeited his outfitting license and his rights to the hunting area, for which he had paid over $1,000,000 Canadian. At least the penalty went well.
Found this August 5, 1805 quote from Lewis's journal:
"the Fieldses killed 2 large bear this evening one of them measured nine feet from the extremity of the nose to that of his tail, this is the largest bear except one that I have seen."
If they'd skinned the bear and laid the hide out flat it might well have measured even longer--and Lewis also an even larger bear! This was at the mouth of the Milk River, near present-day Fort Peck, Montana--which is the northeastern corner, on the plains. No doubt the bear had been eating plenty of buffalo.
Haven't found any mention of Lewis and Clark weighing grizzlies yet, but am not done looking.
I think your search might be in vain. I found an entry on 5 May 1805 where Lewis said, "we had no means of weighing" a bear.
Found this August 5, 1805 quote from Lewis's journal:
"the Fieldses killed 2 large bear this evening one of them measured nine feet from the extremity of the nose to that of his tail, this is the largest bear except one that I have seen."
If they'd skinned the bear and laid the hide out flat it might well have measured even longer--and Lewis also an even larger bear! This was at the mouth of the Milk River, near present-day Fort Peck, Montana--which is the northeastern corner, on the plains. No doubt the bear had been eating plenty of buffalo.
Haven't found any mention of Lewis and Clark weighing grizzlies yet, but am not done looking.
I think your search might be in vain. I found an entry on 5 May 1805 where Lewis said, "we had no means of weighing" a bear.
Interesting thread. The mention of grizzlies in the Choteau area really perked me up. My grandson and I hunted the last two seasons north of Choteau on Hutterite colonies and have been spending quite bit of time there. A young Hutterite man has kind of adopted us and takes us out frequently. The Hutterites up there never stop talking about the bears and I never realized what an issue they are for them.
A couple days before our first trip up there last year, a pheasant hunter got too close to a grizzly and ended up shooting it with bird shot. The wounded bear was killed after the encounter but I'm not sure on the details. I did see pics of the dead bear - one with it hanging in a Hutterite barn and dozens of Hutterites all around as if some kind of ritual/ceremony was going on. I believe FWP was involved with this incident so am not sure how the Hutterites ended up with the carcass. We hunted whitetails in the same location as the bear encounter but didn't have any issues.
We saw plenty of bear sign everywhere we went - as mentioned above, they hang out in the brushy river bottoms, and tree lines on the edges of the fields. We were repeatedly told to not go into the trees/brush alone or near dark. This photo was taken earlier this fall when we had our first snow - what I assume is a rancher checking on cows, feed, etc. They obviously don't stay in the thick stuff all the time.
I had quite a few bear pics (mostly grizzly and one black) from a year ago but can't find them, unfortunately.
dassa; Good evening sir, I hope the day went acceptably for you and you're well, warm and dry tonight.
Regarding the question of how much fat one can expect from an "average bear", I'll throw out a small sampling of our relatively small for species BC black bears.
Over the years we helped friends and family process their game here as we are set up for it and without looking at the notes, I want to say we've done about a dozen black bears.
All male, all fall bears.
The heaviest was one that went a couple pounds either way of 200lb hanging carcass weight and had the most body fat of any we processed in terms of both thickness on the butt and back and how far forward it extended.
There as a lot of internal fat as well, but none of that was saved, just the carcass fat.
One of the friends helping cut it up took home the fat and made two large coffee cans of lard from it. Again hopefully someone can correct me but I don't think those Maxwell House cans would be quite a gallon, though perhaps not far off?
Anyways from a fairly small sampling - again of fall black bears - I'd go out on a limb and suggest that the grizzly that made 4 gallons of lard would be at least twice as big as the one we did.
Hope that made some sense and was useful even though there's admittedly gaps in my math and method.
All the best.
Dwayne
Edit to add; His wife reported it was absolutely the best pastry lard she'd ever used and they were quite sad when those two cans ran out.
It's been years since we've shot a bear to process so I'm going off of memory from at least a dozen years back.
Last edited by BC30cal; 11/29/23. Reason: more thoughts arrived later...
dassa; Good evening sir, I hope the day went acceptably for you and you're well, warm and dry tonight.
Regarding the question of how much fat one can expect from an "average bear", I'll throw out a small sampling of our relatively small for species BC black bears.
Over the years we helped friends and family process their game here as we are set up for it and without looking at the notes, I want to say we've done about a dozen black bears.
All male, all fall bears.
The heaviest was one that went a couple pounds either way of 200lb hanging carcass weight and had the most body fat of any we processed in terms of both thickness on the butt and back and how far forward it extended.
There as a lot of internal fat as well, but none of that was saved, just the carcass fat.
One of the friends helping cut it up took home the fat and made two large coffee cans of lard from it. Again hopefully someone can correct me but I don't think those Maxwell House cans would be quite a gallon, though perhaps not far off?
Anyways from a fairly small sampling - again of fall black bears - I'd go out on a limb and suggest that the grizzly that made 4 gallons of lard would be at least twice as big as the one we did.
Hope that made some sense and was useful even though there's admittedly gaps in my math and method.
Another thought that came to me is that bears seem to vary the most in flavor of any other meat we've processed.
The ones that came out of orchards or vineyards had meat that smelled almost sweet and tasted somewhat that way too. Was wonderful table fare.
The ones that smelled off - for lack of a better way to describe it - were definitely that too and ended up as sausage or something heavily spiced.
The last spring bear I shot was in early spring and was rail thin. It was one that we just couldn't eat and it was given to a friend to process for dog food.
The last problem neighborhood bear ended up as cooked cat food for our ancient tabby before she finally went onto her reward for rodent control on our rural place for two decades.
Bear needs to be cooked enough to kill possible trichinosis of course, so a meat thermometer is a good idea with it I'd think.
A good friend used to guide for both black bears and grizzly on the north BC coast back before they ended the grizzly hunt here. He reported that a few clients did eat grizzly meat and he tried it from a few bears.
His opinion was that if a coastal bear, grizzly or black, ate much fish, it was better to not try to eat it. He was quite firm about that opinion, almost animated now that I recall the conversation.
Another thought that came to me is that bears seem to vary the most in flavor of any other meat we've processed.
The ones that came out of orchards or vineyards had meat that smelled almost sweet and tasted somewhat that way too. Was wonderful table fare.
The ones that smelled off - for lack of a better way to describe it - were definitely that too and ended up as sausage or something heavily spiced.
The last spring bear I shot was in early spring and was rail thin. It was one that we just couldn't eat and it was given to a friend to process for dog food.
The last problem neighborhood bear ended up as cooked cat food for our ancient tabby before she finally went onto her reward for rodent control on our rural place for two decades.
Bear needs to be cooked enough to kill possible trichinosis of course, so a meat thermometer is a good idea with it I'd think.
A good friend used to guide for both black bears and grizzly on the north BC coast back before they ended the grizzly hunt here. He reported that a few clients did eat grizzly meat and he tried it from a few bears.
His opinion was that if a coastal bear, grizzly or black, ate much fish, it was better to not try to eat it. He was quite firm about that opinion, almost animated now that I recall the conversation.
All the best once more.
Dwayne
Solid info Dwayne....as per your normal.
I believe I have read that bears fresh out of the den often have a 'toxin' for lack of a better way to describe it in their blood/muscle, so that may explain the off taste of that early spring bear. Just a guess. If so, I presume that toxin fades away quickly as the bear moves around, starts eating and gets all of his systems running and back to normal.
As far as fish eating bears...that is my (limited) experience too. I shot a small boar in Idaho on the South Fork of the Salmon that had been gorging on dead salmon. I took a backstrap and promptly threw it out at home. Thankfully Idaho doesn't require bear meat to be salvaged. I've eaten two grizzlies that were full of berries, and both were perfectly fine tasting.
T Inman; Good evening my cyber friend, I hope you're finer than frog's hair tonight and keeping warm, well and dry too.
Thanks for the kind words and additional information.
It makes sense that anything coming out of hibernation might have toxins or at least internal chemicals to purge.
We wondered about that, but again as mentioned it was super thin and as you know that's never something we want to see when we peel the hide off of anything.
Indeed, buddy was pretty firm about "fish bears". There might/could have been some colorful adjectives attached to the description of the flavor too T, you know, for emphasis....
Thanks again and all the best.
Dwayne
Edit to add;
Here in BC, we have a requirement to remove "all edible portions" of a bear, which is further described as the four quarters but not including organ meat.
The hunter is required to take said portions home, but then it's perfectly legal to take it to the landfill if it proves to be inedible.
When that rule came into effect, I'd suggest we lost a few of the older bear hunters who'd tried to eat one too many off tasting ones, but most of that generation are no longer hunting.
Last edited by BC30cal; 11/29/23. Reason: more thoughts arrived later...
That has been my general experience with bear lard as well: If from a bear that tastes good, it's great stuff for pie crusts, or any other use of lard.
The big problem with bear-meat flavor here is when they've been consistently eating gutpiles, which in Montana tends to be after the firearms big game season starts in the fall. Though sometimes they can also get into livestock carcasses in spring, though that isn't as common consistent as "gutpile season" in fall.
John
“Montana seems to me to be what a small boy would think Texas is like from hearing Texans.” John Steinbeck
Mule Deer; Good morning John, I hope the coffee is on and the fire it lit down your way and all is well as can be with you both.
Thanks for the additional info, I appreciate it.
After the last few tough winters combined with too many large predators, we don't seem to have enough ungulates being killed to make for a steady food supply for bears.
I'm guessing that's why so many are down in the valleys becoming a nuisance, but again that's a guess.
We're always leery of eating the "locals" as they raid garbage cans and such, so might have been dining on the neighbor's diaper pail, which happened this summer.
Thanks again for your input in this interesting thread.
All the best to you both as we head into the winter season.
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