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Joined: Sep 2014
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Sep 2014
Posts: 21,816 Likes: 2 |
No mention of Cynthia Parker?
Captured as a child, had kids, rescued as an adult. Went back to the Comanche at her first chance.
Parents who say they have good kids..Usually don't!
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Joined: Dec 2009
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Dec 2009
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Herman Lehmann was his name. Quite the fellow around these parts. Still talked about. His other compatriot, Adolph Korn (most bloodthirsty Comanche he ever knew! đ¤Ł), is buried in the Gooch cemetery in Mason Tx. I will go on and recommend this book highly. It doesnât seem to have as much of the "artistic license" that many of the other books like "The Boy Captives" contain. At least several of the accounts in the Lehmann book were contemporarily cross referenced with opposing combatants. Like Ranger James Gillett. My favorite part is when he walks in on a Comanche camp one night about a year after fleeing the Apaches. By this time the Comanches were being hunted all over Comancheria and had abundant reason to hate White folks ( and vice versa). They didnât kill him, they took him in. Yes. He was basically nekked as a jaybird. And waltzed right in.
Founder Ancient Order of the 1895 Winchester
"Come, shall we go and kill us venison? And yet it irks me the poor dappled fools, Being native burghers of this desert city, Should in their own confines with forked heads Have their round haunches gored."
WS
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Joined: May 2004
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Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 56,153 Likes: 12 |
I don't think Comanches got much chance against Apaches.
I am..........disturbed.
Concerning the difference between man and the jackass: some observers hold that there isn't any. But this wrongs the jackass. -Twain
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Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 1,800
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 1,800 |
Interesting video. Learned a few things.
Its not always easy to do the right thing, But it is always the right thing to do.
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Joined: Apr 2011
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Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Apr 2011
Posts: 69,260 Likes: 10 |
Herman Lehmann was his name. Quite the fellow around these parts. Still talked about. His other compatriot, Adolph Korn (most bloodthirsty Comanche he ever knew! đ¤Ł), is buried in the Gooch cemetery in Mason Tx. I will go on and recommend this book highly. It doesnât seem to have as much of the "artistic license" that many of the other books like "The Boy Captives" contain. At least several of the accounts in the Lehmann book were contemporarily cross referenced with opposing combatants. Like Ranger James Gillett. Yep! Iâd recommend it too. I really liked it.
"Allways speak the truth and you will never have to remember what you said before..." Sam Houston Texans, "We say Grace, We Say Mam, If You Don't Like it, We Don't Give a Damn!"
~MolÉĚËn LabĂŠ SkĂ˝la~
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Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 37,909 Likes: 2
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 37,909 Likes: 2 |
No mention of Cynthia Parker?
Captured as a child, had kids, rescued as an adult. Went back to the Comanche at her first chance. Nope, there was another German guy who did that, Kaywoodie probâly remembers his name. Poor Cynthia Anne was recaptured 1860, Charles Goodnight who had been schooled in woodcraft by an elderly Caddo, scouted for the Ranging Company that caught her (Baylor?). Her husband Peta Nocona was killed in that attack. Cynthia Anne was captured along with her infant daughter Topsannah, tried several times to escape. When the infant died of a fever itâs said Cynthia died of a broken heart. Thatâs a popular version, such things ainât always true.
"...if the gentlemen of Virginia shall send us a dozen of their sons, we would take great care in their education, instruct them in all we know, and make men of them." Canasatego 1744
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Joined: Apr 2011
Posts: 69,260 Likes: 10
Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Apr 2011
Posts: 69,260 Likes: 10 |
No mention of Cynthia Parker?
Captured as a child, had kids, rescued as an adult. Went back to the Comanche at her first chance. You mean the mother of Chief Quanah Parker ? And No. She NEVER returned to the Comanches.
"Allways speak the truth and you will never have to remember what you said before..." Sam Houston Texans, "We say Grace, We Say Mam, If You Don't Like it, We Don't Give a Damn!"
~MolÉĚËn LabĂŠ SkĂ˝la~
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Joined: Dec 2009
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 31,619 Likes: 4 |
No mention of Cynthia Parker?
Captured as a child, had kids, rescued as an adult. Went back to the Comanche at her first chance. Nope, there was another German guy who did that, Kaywoodie probâly remembers his name. Poor Cynthia Anne was recaptured 1860, Charles Goodnight who had been schooled in woodcraft by an elderly Caddo, scouted for the Ranging Company that caught her (Baylor?). Her husband Peta Nocona was killed in that attack. Cynthia Anne was captured along with her infant daughter Topsannah, tried several times to escape. When the infant died of a fever itâs said Cynthia died of a broken heart. Thatâs a popular version, such things ainât always true. Rudolph Fischer
Founder Ancient Order of the 1895 Winchester
"Come, shall we go and kill us venison? And yet it irks me the poor dappled fools, Being native burghers of this desert city, Should in their own confines with forked heads Have their round haunches gored."
WS
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Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 31,619 Likes: 4
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 31,619 Likes: 4 |
The story of Temple Friend and the Legion Creek massacreis a damn good one too! In Llano county around the Oxford community.
Founder Ancient Order of the 1895 Winchester
"Come, shall we go and kill us venison? And yet it irks me the poor dappled fools, Being native burghers of this desert city, Should in their own confines with forked heads Have their round haunches gored."
WS
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Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 10,018 Likes: 1
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 10,018 Likes: 1 |
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Joined: Sep 2014
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Sep 2014
Posts: 21,816 Likes: 2 |
OK Tejas boys, thanks for the correction.
Now I gotta try to remember the right version!
Parents who say they have good kids..Usually don't!
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Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 31,619 Likes: 4
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 31,619 Likes: 4 |
Anyone interested in this stuff, here is another book I recommend on the subject. Written by a descendant of Adolph Korn that I mentioned earlier. Author born and raised in Mason County Tx. He goes into pretty good detail concerning the German-Comanche treaty of 1847 and other aspects of those folks. Also good info on the other captives taken from the area.
Founder Ancient Order of the 1895 Winchester
"Come, shall we go and kill us venison? And yet it irks me the poor dappled fools, Being native burghers of this desert city, Should in their own confines with forked heads Have their round haunches gored."
WS
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Joined: Apr 2011
Posts: 12,145 Likes: 3
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Apr 2011
Posts: 12,145 Likes: 3 |
"... What type of wood was the lance shaft made from? Assuming straight grained and riven. Not sure what would grow that long and straight on the plains? ..."
Probably "bois d'arc" - pro. bow-dark French for "wood of the bow". Cut it, bark it and hang it to dry with a weight on the end. Stuff is just like iron, well, almost.
Back in the day, if you needed to mark a fence corner or property line, you did it with bois d'arc posts. Impervious to rot. If allowed to cure, you can't drive a staple into it. AKA osage orange, or hedge apple We have plenty of Osage Orange around here. But nothing that would rive out a straight section that long. Maybe they grow taller, straighter out your way. Wow...
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Joined: Dec 2009
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 31,619 Likes: 4 |
"... What type of wood was the lance shaft made from? Assuming straight grained and riven. Not sure what would grow that long and straight on the plains? ..."
Probably "bois d'arc" - pro. bow-dark French for "wood of the bow". Cut it, bark it and hang it to dry with a weight on the end. Stuff is just like iron, well, almost.
Back in the day, if you needed to mark a fence corner or property line, you did it with bois d'arc posts. Impervious to rot. If allowed to cure, you can't drive a staple into it. AKA osage orange, or hedge apple We have plenty of Osage Orange around here. But nothing that would rive out a straight section that long. Maybe they grow taller, straighter out your way. Wow... To make a bow you take a trunk and split staves off of it. Doesnât have to be a large trunk. Just one that can be split. Which is much easier said than done.
Founder Ancient Order of the 1895 Winchester
"Come, shall we go and kill us venison? And yet it irks me the poor dappled fools, Being native burghers of this desert city, Should in their own confines with forked heads Have their round haunches gored."
WS
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Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 31,619 Likes: 4
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 31,619 Likes: 4 |
Bois dâarc also makes excellent house piers. As demonstrated here at the old home place south of Bastrop Tx. at Hillâs Prairie. My great grandfather and grandmother Norment circa 1925.
Founder Ancient Order of the 1895 Winchester
"Come, shall we go and kill us venison? And yet it irks me the poor dappled fools, Being native burghers of this desert city, Should in their own confines with forked heads Have their round haunches gored."
WS
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Joined: Sep 2009
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Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 11,286 Likes: 2 |
Indians in western Pennsylvania and the Ohio River valley also captured and raised white children. I understand that it was their belief that a child that died could be replaced by another. Many of these kids stayed with the tribe, even when the opportunity to return to white society was given.
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Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Apr 2011
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... To make a bow you take a trunk and split staves off of it. Doesnât have to be a large trunk. Just one that can be split. Which is much easier said than done. "Somewhere" I have a piece of osage orange that a nephew split out for me. Excellent for making bows because (around here) the wood always grows in a natural curve. Very few straight sections. Hence the surprise when somewhere up above mentioned a 14 ft lance.
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Joined: Dec 2009
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 31,619 Likes: 4 |
I do not believe the lances were made of bois dâarc. I believe they were more commonly fabricated out of something like a sotol stalk. At least down here. And lots of river cane used in southeast.
Donât have a clue as to what was used elsewhere. But I imaging it was something else just as light and handy.
Founder Ancient Order of the 1895 Winchester
"Come, shall we go and kill us venison? And yet it irks me the poor dappled fools, Being native burghers of this desert city, Should in their own confines with forked heads Have their round haunches gored."
WS
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Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 48,098 Likes: 8
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 48,098 Likes: 8 |
It's well known that both tribes kept slaves and treated them cruelly. The black slaves owned by whites had it pretty soft in comparison. Yep, the injuns were pretty "savage". Hence the name. Just think what happened when they got a little Irish blood mixed in. Watch the fu ck out!!!!!
I try to stick with the basics, they do so well. Nothing fancy mind you, just plain jane will get it done with style. You want to see an animal drop right now? Shoot him in the ear hole. BSA MAGA
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Campfire Oracle
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Campfire Oracle
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 79,321 Likes: 2 |
Anyone interested in this stuff, here is another book I recommend on the subject. Written by a descendant of Adolph Korn that I mentioned earlier. Author born and raised in Mason County Tx. He goes into pretty good detail concerning the German-Comanche treaty of 1847 and other aspects of those folks. Also good info on the other captives taken from the area. I downloaded it on my Kindle yesterday and have been reading it.
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