Home Forums Hunting & Shooting AR and Tactical Rifles How many rounds will a $400 AR-15 last?

Aw, yes remember the Daewoo's?

Ever tried a Robinson?

Had one early on.

Seems these are the basis for the current SIGs.

Until recently, I wasn't sure the piston AR thing was all ironed out, now there seem to be a few good choices.

That said, DI guns run just fine.

I'd still like to snag a folder though.

biggest weakness on Robinson I had led to locking lug battering. Gas block was not anchored good enough. Went down the road. My folding stock AKs are still going great.

He's not wrong.

AND - if that's the case, you're likely in a space where you can "collect" another upper if needed. Me? I'll be looking for certain lowers...

All good insights.

My wife always comments when watching westerns or shoot 'em up movies, "Why didn't they pick up the bad guys' guns? Either as a back up to their guns or to throw in the river so no more bad guys will get them?"

When I was a young man the SNCOs from Special Forces at Bragg would tell me, "LT, you have to have the ability to pick up any weapon on the battle field and run it until someone on the wrong side of the fight dies to give you their better weapon."

That's led to a life of buy-sell-trade just to get familiar with the pros and cons of different weapon systems.

Hope the day doesn't come where I have to use that knowledge, but I see it in the future.

As they say, "Pray if you want, but there came a point where David had to pick up a stone and deal with Goliath."

It's funny, they talk about how you can't expect any bolt to last 5000 rounds without having to change extractors or springs, or whatever, and how this bolt actually held up pretty well...but then he complains about the gas seal problems (to which the "Asian guy" says a new gas tube and set of rings would fix right up). Changing an extractor at this point is considered S.O.P. (even on the Gucci guns), yet this extractor is fine, and somehow having to change rings and a gas tube is not really acceptable...

And the barrel... He complains about an accuracy loss after several thousand rounds (full auto) and proclaims it "done". No cleaning, and no investigation into any other possible reasons for this accuracy loss. Perhaps something had gotten loose or out of whack, who knows. And the "Asian guy" looks down the bore, and by golly, it don't look bad....

And at the end, after the gun is "done", it's still shooting! Only the occasional hiccup, which was deemed easily fixable. And while accuracy was way down (for whatever reason), I bet you could still get good hits with it at normal combat ranges! But... this gun was deemed utterly unacceptable for anyone who is "serious about shooting". Holy crap. And he lets slip the little chuckle when talking about someone who doesn't have much money to spend on a rifle. What a snobby ass wipe.

These guys make a lot of money off YouTube. And yes, I find most of them a little snobby.

Lucky Gunner, in their testing considered a barrel "done" when it started to keyhole. To me, that's a more objective measure of "done".

As for a bolt lasting 5k rounds, Army rates life of a bolt body at 30K rounds in the rife gassedM16a1/a2. I'm not sure what it is in the carbine gassed M4.

The article of the Vegas Machine gun shoot guys claimed they typically got 60K to 100K rounds out of a bolt body, and sometime even more.

What part are you referring to when you say ‘bolt body’? Are you talking about the bolt or the bolt carrier?

Just the bolt itself, excluding the extractor, ejector, associated springs and gas rings.

Some time ago I read an account from a former army armorer who said he was in service while M4's were not yet universal, and they were still using M16 rifles along side of the M4's. After so many tens of thousands of rounds (I don't remember how many it was now), he said replacing broken bolts was common for their M4's. But it was a problem that was almost unheard of in the full length rifles.

The carbine gas system was hard on bolts but mainly hard on extractor springs and extractors. It was several years before the army let Colt put a heavier extractor spring in there or even add the O-ring. They also came up with a better extractor and basically were allowed to fine tune the system. We all benefited from that. When is the last time you saw a blue insert in the extractor spring?

I remember firing a 20” rifle after shooting carbines for years. I thought I had a squib load there was so much difference. M-16’s are as smooth as it gets.

As for the video, he’s an influencer. He gets paid well even if it’s just ammo and products.

I think it’s pretty well accepted that longer gas systems run somewhat cooler, and certainly heat plays a role in how parts wear, lube is “consumed”, maybe even affects the temper of metal, including springs. My current upper is rifle length and it seems to run smoother, with less buffer “sproing” than my previous mid-length, but something else may be involved. At any rate, it runs very smoothly. I suspect that the piston guns are easier on action parts as well, besides running cleaner (inside the receiver anyway).

This low cost upper functioned well enough that for the largest part of the gun buying crowd it would meet their needs.

This is exactly the kind of gun to have to leave in the ranch truck, or in the tractor for day to day functionality, without feeling bad about lack of care, or possibly losing it to theft. I've probably shot half as much out of the truck at targets of opportunity as international hunting scenarios, and appreciate a functional, decently accurate beater. Add a PSA red dot or low power scope and call it good.

I’ve got an 18” barrel with rifle gas and it’s certainly smoother than my 16” carbine gassed gun but the difference is not as drastic as it was back in the day. Buffers and springs help as well as properly sized gas ports. Back when I was shooting several Bushmaster carbines and a few other brands, they were terrible. Large ports and carbine buffers were really hard on parts.

Piston guns seem to have their own set of problems as well as not being as accurate as DI. But given a short barrel running suppressed in FA, HK seems to be the answer.

I find that mid-length gas is quite a bit smoother than carbine length. You can get mid-length gas in any length barrel that's not an SBR, although not in all brands. Rifle length is even smoother.

I've had barrels that were still shooting quite accurately after more than 5000 rounds. These were good quality barrels that I shot in matches, so they got pretty hot at times.

There are 12.5" mid-gas barrels out there too.

Pappy,
You are at least 10 years behind the curve.
The piston gun thing was all the rage. Most manufacturers, and all their shills in the gun rags were all in on piston guns. Some only made piston guns.

It ran its coarse, now you gotta look a little to find one.


The Gucci issue guns from FN or HK that use pistons?
They came out of that Era.
The unanswerable question... are pistons the reason for their reputations?
Or, are pistons and timing what got them attention?


The Marines are all in on their HKs, the ground pounders or the brass?

For me, pistons don't bring anything worth the $$$.

Hopefully, I don't get a screaming deal on a SCAR or 416!😉
Like half price.