Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Ask The Gunwriters Annealing...for those who doubt...Part 2

A while back this thread talked about annealing.
https://www.24hourcampfire.com/ubbt...nealing-for-those-who-doubt#Post18307350
Recently I acquired an Amp Annealer. So I have been using it and doing some testing comparing the Amp to the salt bath.
The Amp is faster, hands down. And immediately ready without waiting for the salt to heat up.
With the salt I know exactly what the temperature is, and I dont with the Amp.
So I tested with 223 and 308. I have fired side by side, mixed, and every way I can think of to show a difference in accuracy and speed between the two.
I cant find it. I suspect there are differences in the metallurgy, but I don't think that's ever going to matter with me. One of the test was to use brass from the same lot in 308 and fire it 30 times, annealing every third shot. No difference that I can tell.
I will do some more testing when I figure out a way to show the difference. But for now I'll use whichever one is handy.
I'll report back if I find anything.
Charlie

That’s good to know, thanks.
I bought all the supplies for the salt method but haven’t gotten around to doing it yet. Still using a propane torch on low flame and a metronome app for timing.

As I said in the other thread....I thinks its much more important that you anneal, than what the method is. I used a candle for a long time, it works fine, but its slow. And I used a torch.
Come to think of it, are there any other ways to anneal ? Candle ? Torch ? Salt ? Amp ?
Charlie

I have been using molten salt for a few years, and don't have much motivation to look farther. It is also very good for pistol cases.

If I were to switch to something else, it would be induction heating. That has the potential for very quick, uniform results. I did a little bit of experimenting with a homemade heater, but didn't have the right power supply for best results.

How long does it take to anneal 100 brass?

Alcohol for fuel based on Fred Barker Candle method anneal <credit JB>

https://www.24hourcampfire.com/ubbt...7040/dna-candle-case-anneal#Post12607040

i use a propane torch, a bucket of water (which you don't need) and my fingers. i wanted to do a salt bath, but i am cheap so i go from there . i only do 100 cases at a time. it is 5 times till i anneal.

i've been shooting the 35/30-30 Starline cases that aren't annealed. i'm on 20 -21 shots without annealing. it may be the powder charge (2400/tuft of Dacron) that does this. but i don't know. it could be a space alien technology or such.

the 8x57, 7.65x53, 7x57, 9.3x57, 270 Win, 6.5x55 (made from '06 cases) was annealed the first time i cut them. 5 shots later, i anneal. same goes with 30 and 357 Herrett (made from 30-30 Starline cases).

i was taught by a gunsmith (RIP) and friend when my dad's (RIP) 7x30 Waters case cracked after 3 or 4 shootings. it must be 35+/- years now since i leaned annealing. i can remember my cases cracked only about 2 or 3 times after annealing.

I have thought about this as well. I've made coils and other parts of the apparatus for industrial induction heat-treating processes, but it was long ago and far away. Electrical/electronic engineering has come a long way since and I suspect it would be quite doable to develop a setup that would mount on a reloading press making it possible to simple put a case in the proper shell holder and run it up into the induction coil only far enough to heat the neck/shoulder area, then back down. We made coils plumbed up for cooling water running through, but we were heat treating steel components a couple of inches in diameter, had a very close tolerance on the depth of case created and also the case had to be consistent across all features of the part. Pretty high amp/high frequency induction. Probably (maybe) not so much heat to deal with if just annealing brass cases.

With my Giraud, about 17-18 minutes, and I can be doing other reloading tasks while it is working.

I just use a candle. its CHEAP. FREE IN FACT.

So cheap in fact when people found out I used candles I was getting all kinds in boxes. Christmas is a candle boom when the season is over.

Each time I anneal the scent of pine fills the stairwell in the house.....side benefit.

With a count to 8 or 11 depending on the case mouth size.

Cases last quite a while.

.243 cases on their 17th reload........cases annealed every time.

Best
Heavy

Roughly 10 cases per minute on my crude homemade annealer, or 600 an hour.

I don't have tens of thousands to anneal though......

I have the home brew version of that exact same machine, but my anneal times seem shorter (just by watching the video). Used Tempilaq to set the time. I think my torch might be set a bit closer though.

I can do a lot of brass on it in a very short period of time.

I use the anneal-rite annealer. It isn't as fast as Amp or the one posted in the videos but it is faster than the candle method that I used for serveral years.

www.cartridgeanneal.com

With the molten salt method, I can do 100 cases in about 10-15 minutes. I don't have a lot of reason to invest in something faster.

I concur, and this method is cheaper as well.

If I am doing more than 50, I use the salt bath. If less than 50, I employ an alcohol lamp fueled with methyl hydrate. Unlike using candles, the alcohol lamp is clean. IOW, no soot.

Video here.

https://ballisticrecreations.ca/

My BC1000 does around 300-350 an hr. at a leisurely pace:



Hunting rifles I anneal at least every 3 firings, the precision/match stuff every firing.

10min, maybe a bit less w/the AMP.

I’m not sure how it could be possible for salt bath annealing to be more convenient than an AMP. I’ve done lots of both along candles, torches etc. Using salt bath is the worst to deal with by far.

That is a home brew machine.

My tank was probably half full in that vid, and that makes times just a little longer. Something I noticed, full bottles, more pressure, faster times. Probably hook up a 20lber and not worry for like ever. The only thing I wish I'd done different is make the auto feed hopper. The next one I make will have that.

one question to Charliesisk, if I may...

I seggregate cases by the number of times I have shot/resized them, believing that those with the same number of shots will deliver more uniform results, something I do not really know but that makes sense to me.

If I anneal all of them, will that bring them all to the starting point and make them uniform regardless thei number of shots?

Thank you,

chamois