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Joined: Dec 2019
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Dec 2019
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.........It costs exactly zero dollars to take a stand. Calling or emailing a Representative is free. Speaking out in your own circle requires only courage and principle. Lots of good Germans stood by while the trains were loaded. 🫤 One of the problems with living in a litigious society is that everybody who hopes to survive must think like like a lawyer to some extent. So as I consider this topic, thoughts come, and the magic of the internet allows research. My interest in the struggle between ADFG and federal agencies over fish and wildlife management is a subject of great interest to me. I'm not stupid enough to even imagine that my opinion matters, but I'm conniving enough to know that wrenches can cause great damage to the machines I dislike when tossed into the gearbox instead of turning nuts. Thus the thought came to me: This is Alaska. It is full of bears, the feds want more of them, and federal lands within suitable bear habitats already have the highest densities of bears on Earth. Defensive firearms are and always have been a fact of life in Alaska, even with federal wildlife professionals. Do they carry lead-free ammo in their service weapons? Since firearms can be carried for defensive purposes even for people who are not carrying hunting licenses, the POSSESSION of leaded ammo on federal lands in defensive firearms shouldn't be banned. Sure enough, I googled up queries using the keywords "possession" "lead" "ammo" "federal lands", and various keywords like those in various combinations. I got no meaningful hits regarding federal lands, and even few official hits regarding lead bird shot violations and penalties (lots of forum discussion by hunters, though), but I did come across hits regarding California's ban on lead ammo for all hunting. My reading revealed that the possession of lead ammo in the field in California, when not hunting, is perfectly legal in most circumstances. In early August of 2005 I was running north on the Old Man Creek Trail from Eureka with rifle, camp, hunting license, and caribou permit in possession. South of Crooked Creek I came upon a Trooper (blue shirt) "interviewing" a couple of young hunters. He asked me to stop until he was finished with his customers. I did, and enjoyed the interesting show. When they left, it was my turn. First, he asked me for my license. I asked in reply why I needed one. I had no dead animal in my possession, and I had not shot at one. That's how the exchange went. It was a legal dance the entire way. It was perfectly cordial, too. I learned quite a bit from the dance, and it helped my dance steps for the future. In the end, I showed him my documentation, and gave him my phone number and the description of my rig at the highway (but not my license plate number, because I don't memorize such trivia) after asking wh6 I should give him said information. I then gave him directions, because he was lost!!! Bottom line? One can be on wild public lands, armed, and anonymous under most circumstances. But I'll always carry some form of official ID, just to prevent being "detained", although I'm tempted to respond to the next officer by speaking in espanol, just for sheets and grins, if I have some time to waste. Lawfare is a game. I can play, but only for fun, and I don't expect to "win"..........only to to learn, or passively resist when there's no downside. I met Trooper Joe while hunting up there a couple years ago. He flew his blue and yellow floatplane into the lake where we were dropped. I think he may have been the nicest cop I've ever met; and I know a bunch. I would even comply with ammo restrictions if necessary. I do so now for waterfowl. Just the same, I'd actively oppose any widening of lead restrictions. I do not believe they serve any logical purpose and, as stated above, think that they are part of another whole agenda. Joe, out of Dillingham? He very possibly is the nicest and most professional warden I have ever crossed paths with. The very same. A credit to his profession, IMO.
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Joined: Jan 2005
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Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 57,494 |
If you haven't had luck with hammer or TTSX then you have other problems using mono bullets........ I actually haven't reloaded any because they're so long per weight, my powder capacity is reduced, and I'm in love with velocity. I've tried manufactured copper bullets in a 30-30 in California at the range. I didn't run them through the chronograph. This was just before California banned lead for hunting. They shot fine, I guess. Hell, I wasn't even hunting quail in California while down there. We'd drive to Arizona for dove and quail. I guess I'm just happier walking away from a lousy landowner than play his games. Copper is your baby then. You shoot 1-2 groups lighter in weight for the performance. So the bullet length is the same give or take as your heavier CC bullet. You can up the speed. All in favor of you and your desires then. FWIW my life and my clients life is in my hands at times. Or could be all the time. I carry no CC. All I carry is barnes. They usually exit. Even on Brown bears at hard angles. I'm shooting a 458 win mag as an example but using 350 barnes. 400 would be ideal. IE lighter. Faster. Hold together.... 8.5 foot not dead bear I shot as it got out of the bed at 30 feet. Rump was about all I had on hands and knees. That bullet and others came out behind the shoulder. One I did find halfway out the skin. 350 grains. Lets see a CC do that. and yes. Lead bans are a bunch of BS. I hate them and am against them every where I see them come up.
We can keep Larry Root and all his idiotic blabber and user names on here, but we can't get Ralph back..... Whiskey Tango Foxtrot, over....
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Joined: May 2023
Posts: 181
Campfire Member
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Campfire Member
Joined: May 2023
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Well, I guess I need to start loading up some Barnes bullets to experiment with in the 300WM and 338WM. It has been four years since the last Great Ammo Shortage started, and I'm just finishing loading up a stock of Accubonds and A-Frames for my rifles. The feds must have heard about it, so they're going to pull this stunt now.
There's a guy on another forum I used to hang out in who was getting me half interested in Tesla vehicles. EVs are yet another mandate that the feds are pushing on us, but it's beginning to look like their mandates will destroy the automakers financially. Let's see if they can bankrupt ammo manufacturers just before WWIII starts.
BTW, did y'all know that the Army has recently refurbished their ammo plants and reopened a few that had been mothballed?
NRA Life Endowment Member
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Joined: Jan 2001
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Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
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I was at the show Friday evening and saw these guys. I did take the little postcard for the free copper ammunition. If you scan the barcode on it, it takes you the California Fish and Game sight. Once I saw that I was done with it. I like Barnes bullets, but I’m not for a lead ban at all. My thoughts on it, is that it would eventually bleed over into not just hunting but even target practice at the range etc.
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Joined: May 2023
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Campfire Member
Joined: May 2023
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........My thoughts on it, is that it would eventually bleed over into not just hunting but even target practice at the range etc. LOL........yup. In the 1990's there was a bit of word play on Ft. Rich about "green bullets". The environmental cops within the Army were focusing on lead in the exterior ranges throughout post, and since M855 was steel core, and it had green colored tips, it came to be known as "green"..........as environmentally friendly ammo with which to kill people. There was also an incredibly expensive and troublesome contract to remediate the lead in an indoor handgun range between 2005-2011 timeframe. Lots of headaches with that one. I was thankful it wasn't my job. There was an old range on an Indian reservation at Pala, California, where I shot NRA matches at that closed several years ago. The tribe was troubled with the almost certain environmental liability in their future. That's the story throughout the state. If you own the land where a range is, you're going to have trouble.
NRA Life Endowment Member
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Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Jan 2005
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We cannot allow a lead ban to happen if we can avoid it.
That said Mono bullets are good things. Electric vehicles work. The motors work really well. But for the use of most things vehicle size the way we use them, they are a joke. I would not trade my dewalt tools though...
And trying our best to tell them to shove the EV mandate up their azz too...
As to ranges. We have had them on our property forever. I don't think it would be good for them to come looking or telling us anything about them.
We can keep Larry Root and all his idiotic blabber and user names on here, but we can't get Ralph back..... Whiskey Tango Foxtrot, over....
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Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 7,975
Campfire Outfitter
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OP
Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 7,975 |
I do not want to be spot-checked more questions, by the Feds checking for lead bullets have enough negative interface with them in the field already!
kk alaska
Alaska 7 months of winter then 5 months of tourists
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Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 631
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Campfire Regular
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Sadly, they are too late. Every last Alaskan condor is now extinct. let alone alone the elephants or wooly mammouth ...
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Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 631
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
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cant wait to hear about copper poisinning and the only way to stop that will stop hunting ...
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Joined: May 2023
Posts: 181
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NRA Life Endowment Member
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Posts: 5,045
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
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Funny thing about this thread. I got an email Thursday about a group advocating for copper bullets, but they claim they are not for a lead ban. The article was saying that copper should be encouraged, but not made the law, etc., and that they are only concerned with it for hunting purposes. I’m all for it being a personal choice, but mandatory no. The name of this group I can’t recall, but it was not similar to the group at the outdoor show.
I think in the most recent Sports Afield magazine, there is a group calling for a ban on plastic shotgun wads. This “surf group” claims that shotgun wads are the number one plastic they find washed up in their area.
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Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 57,494
Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 57,494 |
There is an underlying issue if there is a "group" pushing copper bullets.
I simply think they perform more reliably than any cup and core I"ve shot so I use them and encourage others.
But why would I form a group... There is something there not being said.
We can keep Larry Root and all his idiotic blabber and user names on here, but we can't get Ralph back..... Whiskey Tango Foxtrot, over....
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Joined: Aug 2022
Posts: 1,976 Likes: 1
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
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Maybe if they banned lead in Alaska, the likes of Betty Sue would quit eating it and there would be fewer R-tards in the world.
"Full time night woman? I never could find no tracks on a woman's heart. I packed me a squaw for ten year, Pilgrim. Cheyenne, she were, and the meanest bitch that ever balled for beads."
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Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 3,940 Likes: 3
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Jan 2005
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Maybe 10 years ago the refuge manager of the Alaska peninsula and Becharof NWR required all guides operating on the refuges to fill out a questionnaire on all their hunters, including bird and waterfowl hunters. From it they extrapolated that yearly there was less than one pellet per acre/ per year used. And therefore there was no need for any additional rules on use of lead
Phil Shoemaker Alaska Master Guide, Alaska Hunter Ed Instructor FAA Master pilot www.grizzlyskinsofalaska.comAnyone who claims the 30-06 is not effective has either not used one, or else is unwittingly commenting on their marksmanship.
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Joined: Jun 2013
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Joined: Jun 2013
Posts: 457 |
To use lead-free or not should be up to the individual.
That said, the political machine that serves certain interest groups agendas realizes that they will never be able to ban guns in this country. So they are going to make it just as miserable, inconvenient and expensive as possible to own guns/shoot guns/go hunting.
Dear Lord, please come quickly.
Last edited by Marshal_Dillon; 04/28/24. Reason: Grammatical error
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Joined: May 2023
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Campfire Member
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Campfire Member
Joined: May 2023
Posts: 181 |
Maybe 10 years ago the refuge manager of the Alaska peninsula and Becharof NWR required all guides operating on the refuges to fill out a questionnaire on all their hunters, including bird and waterfowl hunters. From it they extrapolated that yearly there was less than one pellet per acre/ per year used. And therefore there was no need for any additional rules on use of lead Great factoid to share there. It's a classic example of a false hope that local managers can illicit. As a former fed, my bet is that the refuge management at the time was under some level of pressure to address the issue by their handlers back east. They came up with an excellent way to keep the lawyers and pseudo-scientists at bay. Given the level of human pressure there compared to, say, the Kenai NWR, that study will likely work for Becharof NWR.........until some Washington bureaucrat/tyrant creates a universal reg that a clownish POTUS might sign that all refuges must adhere to.
NRA Life Endowment Member
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Joined: Jun 2001
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 32,135 Likes: 2 |
My gun, my choice. 
The only true cost of having a dog is its death.
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Joined: May 2014
Posts: 10,444 Likes: 2
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: May 2014
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These guys just piss me off. I can just see a guy with his flintlock using mono copper bullets.
I can get by with Barnes bullets but I don’t need some son of a bitch telling me what I have to do.
I prefer classic.
Semper Fi
I used to run with the hare. Now I'm envious of the tortoise and I do my own stunts but rarely intentionally
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Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 57,494
Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 57,494 |
These guys just piss me off. I can just see a guy with his flintlock using mono copper bullets.
I can get by with Barnes bullets but I don’t need some son of a bitch telling me what I have to do. I can way more than get by with mono. Best performing for lots of what we do by far over other options. That said I don't need some sob telling me what I have to do either! Totally agree
We can keep Larry Root and all his idiotic blabber and user names on here, but we can't get Ralph back..... Whiskey Tango Foxtrot, over....
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