Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Ask The Gunwriters Phil Shoemaker, 10mm Tisas

Good afternoon, I hope this finds you well and your weather improving. I've been scanning through various posts and came across your singing the praises of the Tisas D10. Do you have any further thoughts or experiences using it since you last posted about it? Out of curiosity, why would you consider a 1911 style 10mm as against say a FN 510 with a much higher magazine capacity?

Appreciate your feedback!

I suspect you'd get better results by changing your header to "Phil Shoemaker and 10mm Tisas," or sending him a private message. While Phil still participates here, he does so far less than he used to due to the increasingly contentious nature of the Campfire.

Wow! So elegant.

Thanks for continuing to hang out with us Mule Deer. Your writings and musings are always spot on.

....and VERY much appreciated!

I'll take a stab at it to keep the thread going until Phil shows up. I really enjoy reading bear stories. I have read every book I could get my hands on. While most man/bear encounters I have read of involved rifles, those involving pistols were settled in fewer shots than a 1911 holds. I simply don't think that at the ranges man/bear encounters take place the situations afford time for more well placed shots than a 1911 provides. Well placed is likely the reason for the 1911 preference. Simply something that he shoots well.

Tisas and other Turkish guns by most accounts are good, reliable guns at very good prices. I simply can't bring myself to buy a gun made in a country that supports terrorism.

While I understand the feeling anent Turkey and agree; Our current administration appears to be preferring Hamas over the victims of their terror activities. The world is a complicated and often corrupt place.

F01

I have two 1911s, a Springfield Professional in 45 ACP and a Springfield V16 in 45 Super. Love them both. The 45 Super is my woods gun.

While there certainly are some good guns coming out of Turkey, there are also enough turds that I won’t chance another. My CZ O/U came with an action so tight I could hardly open it, and the barrels were 8” apart at 40 yards. CZ USA worked on the action, but the convergence issue was just my tough luck. The bastards had the nerve to send me a test target showing them only 4” apart, at 20 yards. I’m no mathman, but c’mon man!

There was a lot of wishing and hoping about the new Springfield .22 rifle, but all the tests I read and watched yielded very mediocre accuracy. You’d think at least one of them would’ve made a fair showing. A number of guys I shoot clays with have bought inexpensive autoloaders made in Turkey, and they’ve been far more troublesome than the Brownings, Berettas, Remingtons, and Benellis. Another concern is parts availability. I found a very pristine Browning Gold Hunter a few years back and it has a plastic bolt buffer that had deteriorated, as plastic sometimes does, since 1995. A couple of new ones were easy to find. Try finding parts for one of those Turkish Delights in 20 years or so, or even today.

The Turkish guns do often have nice wood…..

I’ve had a pending 10mm 1911 handgun purchase (of quality) on the backburner for some time. Was thinking maybe a Kimber but the price tag on the Tisas is tempting. Can’t wait to hear Phil’s take.

My results with the Tisas 10 mm have been excellent and I would not be hesitant carrying it, loaded with the proper ammunition of course, as bear protection. Using similar bullets it’s performance and power rank right alongside the 357 and slightly better than the 9mm.
I just picked up a S&W M 58 41 Mag and plan on carrying and testing it this summer.

But power & penetration are only one side of the issue as handguns also have to be easily and comfortable to carry all day. The 41, my 44 Mtn Gun and the Tisas 10mm all weigh approx the same and are noticeably heavier on the hip after 8-10 hours of fishing than my M65 S&W 357.

Well looks like you won’t be buying any guns if that’s the case

I am always on the lookout for new guns to test

There certainly should be no secret to producing a reliable 1911 at this point, all it takes is the will. An inexpensive one in 10mm, assuming it works, makes perfect sense as a trail gun that might be subject to some neglect and possibly even loss; no need for a Barbecue Gun for that application, nor one with match-grade accuracy. No worries about parts or service with a 1911 either.

Just checked their website and they look like a serious company, and one that puts their own name on what they make and sell. Mr. Phil’s recommendation doesn’t do any harm either….. Might be worth a shot, though I’m not buying any more guns, honest honey😝

Love my Delta Elite 10mm. Any 180 grain bullet, XTP preferred, 8.2 grains of Longshot and she’s ready to rumble.

Thanks for sticking around 458WIN. You are greatly appreciated!

Do you much prefer something like a S&W 65 to a compact 9mm for the lighter & handier carry?

I picked up a D-10 in December, for less than $600 out the door. Other than needing a trigger job real badly (as do any factory 1911 pistols), it's been an excellent pistol so far. After doing a trigger tweak, it shoots as well as my RIA 6" 10mm.

Both of those pistols will sling brass into another county with the factory springs, and should be re-sprung, if you want to reload your own ammo and keep your brass. That's the nature of the 10mm, though, my Colt Delta Elite did the same thing back in 1987, when I bought it. Of the three pistols, I actually like the D-10 best of the bunch. They all shoot about the same, in my hands, anyway. I paid about the same amount of money for the Colt, in 1987, that I did for the Tisas, 4 months ago. amd the D-10 came with adjustable sights, and checkered frontstrap, that I paid extra for, on the Colt.
The Tisas is one helluva bargain.

Phil: Since you are "...always on the lookout for new guns to test" you might want to find a Taurus Titanium 5 shot 41 Mag to test. Weighs 24 ounces. With a 4" barrel it shoots Federal 250 grain Castcore (P418) at 1240 fps. Despite what 10mm advocates state the 10mm (220 grain at 1100 fps) is not a 41 magnum. The Taurus Titanium is my bear protection when I am hooffing it.

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CONTENTIOUS NATURE? I’ll have you know that she wasn’t even a FIRST cousin! That’s the last time I tell you anything about my family reunions!

It’s not simply the “continuous nature”.
I simply feel overwhelmed by all the bear experts and their choice of weapons 🙄

Ha!

Lol….

Don’t disregard the Springfield XD in 10mm.

I think Mr. Phil made a good choice in his M-58 .41 Rem Mag. Should be more than adequate for killing anything that needs killing. Not hard to recover fired cases for reloading either! HSM 230 gr Bear Loads should do the trick.

Phil,

I probably didn’t ask this very clearly.

Given your famous resolution of a bad bear day with a 9mm & well chosen ammunition, do you still feel a compact .357 much superior?

Or, when you’re choosing comfortable carry for a very long day over a bigger gun, what is that most likely to be?

I am guessing the mention of the 65 was my answer but wonder where your opinion lands.

I know I like my 3” 65 with heavy hard cast, flat noses when I may have to deal with something large but don’t want to lug a heavy handgun. In my world, more likely cattle.

I am in a place where grizzly attacks are unlikely compared to you but still around as well as mountain lions & wolves. Human criminals are still the most likely threat here.

Maybe I am just falling into the common human case of wanting to confirm what I already believe but would value your daily carry opinion.

Anteloper, my choice of the M65 S&W revolver involved numerous considerations. Function, reliability, familiarity and performance were first considerations. Weight and comfort for carrying all day were factors, as was the ability to shoot both accurately and rapidly under stress.

Self protection is an entirely different matter than hunting where you can make a careful stalk and try placing a single shot on an unwary animal. A powerful 44 magnum, 454 Casull , 475 Linebaugh or 500 are much better choices for hunting but can not be controlled as well as the 357 or 9 or 10 mm autos.

My son, daughter and I all carry M65 revolvers for that reason

Phil,
Not trying to drag this out, but what ammo or loads do you carry in the M65’s?

180 gr Buffalo Bore Outdoorsman they are running mighty close to the 1400 fps advertised velocity

WOW! That’s got to be a handful in the ‘65!

Thank you and hope you folks never have to use these in an emergency situation.

Thanks Phil!

Exactly addresses my curiosity & I absolutely understand the point b/t hunting & self defense.

I’ve made the same point in kind of the reverse when folks have pointed out the successful use of tiny pistols like .22 & .25 in assassinations or murders of unsuspecting or disabled victims, questioning why they are not recommended for defense against a determined attacker.

They do recoil pretty stiffly but are much more pleasant and manageable than my 44 Mtn Gun with equivalent loads.
But that load is literally painful to shoot in a M60 J frame S&W

I was invited by some friends to go trout fishing in Yellowstone years back. They went every year and the previous year they’d had a brush with a grizzly, no damage but they still stuttered when they spoke of it. They carried bear spray but I wanted a pistol and one with serious horsepower. My M60 always seemed to work in Colorado and Wyoming but I wanted something more powerful than the Keith semi-wadcutters at 900fps I’d always carried. Loaded up some 190 gr round nose flat points, I had for my 357 carbine ,to book max plus a little bit more. I thought I would try them just to see how bad the recoil was…I fired 3 shots…unloaded the other 2 rounds and went to the urgent care place to get stitches in the cut on my thumb from the cylinder latch.

Those lightweight Smith's are STRONGER THAN WE ARE !!!

That they are...lol!!

I will say that I would feel better armed with my 9mm and 147 Gr FN Buffalo bore ammo than my M60 357

Good choice

More holes are well, more, right?

Just saw you have a podcast with Spomer. Looking forward to that.

Podcast was excellent, thanks for answering the question Phil.

More is better but I’d bet the controllability is the big point there.

458Win;
Morning sir, I hope all is going more than less according to plan up there and you and the family are all well.

Thanks for doing the podcast with Ron Spomer, it was one of the better ones that Ron has done I thought.

I learned a whole bunch on a variety of nuanced subjects which I always enjoy.

Thanks again and all the best to you and your family this upcoming season.

Dwayne

More holes are well, more, right?

[\quote]

Well sure, but you’re basing that on first hand experience and not innernet experts. Doubtful at best!!

Really enjoyed listening to your insights on Spomer's podcast.

Phil, I thoroughly enjoyed that podcast. I was listening to it while I was putting together a chicken casserole. Every now and then I'd step over to the computer screen and watch bits of it. What impressed me right off the bat was the unflinching certainty wand authority with which you answered Ron's questions about bear behavior. I guess it's to be expected from a man with 45 years years of experience, but it still awed me. It was also interesting to hear you talk about how you will take time out to more or less experiment with their reaction.

Listeners and viewers should walk away knowing this. They should bring what they shoot well and use a proper bullet!

With each question you answered and each comment you made, it spawned another question in me. I won't hit you with a full barrage. but if you'll indulge, I'd like to run a few by you.

I have had few encounters with Kodiak browns. Only one that could be considered close. In one case, I was hunting the perimeter of Buskin Lake when a very heavy fog set in. I was so close to one that I could hear it, and smell it, but I still couldn't see it. I was so nervous and pumped up that with each beat of my pounding heart, my vision blurred. Have you become cooler over time with close encounters or is it something that you just have in you?

You mentioned that you live in an area with a high density bear population. Do those bear behave differently than those in lower density areas? Do Kodiak browns behave differently from those on the peninsula?

You have a well refined sense of when they mean business and when they don't. What are few tell tale signs that they are going to attack?

I am very interested in what your testing with bullets has revealed. Have you ever tested penetration on A-Frame handgun bullets. The partition sits very far forward on them, and I have always fancied that out of my Glock 40 10mm they'd give enough penetration to reliably hit vitals while giving a little expansion as well. Any thoughts or experience?

I am glad you are still willing to hang out here. I read every word you write with interest.

Oh, and $10,000 worth of groceries at Costco!!!

Enjoyed the interview!

Pretty good questions Paul.

TAG

Mr. Shoemaker:

I’m sure you have found the best solution for you and many others.

I’m just curious about that choice.

I have a G40 that spits out 200gr UW HC bullets at an avg of 1,314 fps.

The recoil is fairly tame.

Heavier bullet; wider bullet; almost as fast; less recoil; quicker follow-up shots; probably a bit heavier, but fairly comfortable to me in a Blackhawk holster.

That thing has never failed to fire.

Does that seem like a decent solution, among many others?

I loved "placement and (bullet) performance trumps everything else". So true.

OUTSTAND PODCAST !!! We are blessed.

Phil, do your M65's have 4" barrels?

I wonder what your “go to test medium” is?

Other than having dead bears handy.

I have tested numerous caliber on bears, both alive and dead, and have a good idea of how deep different calibers and bullets penetrate.


So using plastic bags to hold them I simply used a stack of 1” dry magazine, followed by 4” of damp magazine, another 1” dry, then another 4” wet until I had a couple feet available.
It may or may not have been exact but it was amazingly close to what I got in a real bear
Then I could honestly compare my 30 Tokarev, 9mm , 357 and 44 loads

It sounds like an excellent choice as long as you have confidence in it

I have a Tisa 1911 with a long slide/barrel and I have fired over 200 rounds through it without a hiccup, this was over 3 trips to the range temps were from 20 to 50 degrees. I am very happy with the gun it is a breeze to shoot, I was happily surprised with the mild recoil and the accuracy is better than I can do, I am not a good shot with pistol, I tend to spend a lot more time shooting rifles at 1,000 yards than I do pistols at shorter range.