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#2895091 - 03/18/09 07:40 AM For users who have experience with both. HK 91/93 VS. AR10
Torque Offline
Member

Registered: 12/28/06
Posts: 235
Loc: Central Arkansas
I have mind mind made up that I am buying one or the other as a just in case situation. For those of you who have used both, which would you recommend? The HK would be a the high quality clone, and the AR 10 would most probably be a DPMS.


Edited by Torque (03/18/09 07:42 AM)
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#2895544 - 03/18/09 10:50 AM Re: For users who have experience with both. HK 91/93 VS. AR10 [Re: Torque]
hogan Offline
Campfire Regular

Registered: 12/07/06
Posts: 633
Trigger on the AR is better,
Integral scope rail on flat top AR is better,
DPMS AR-10 uses FNLAR magazines,
AR-10 design is easy to home-gunsmith,
Genuine H-K 91 chambers ruin brass,
DPMS parts routinely available, easy to come by,
Lots of custom builders and accurate uppers for AR-10,

No brainer AR is way to go.

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#2896410 - 03/18/09 05:45 PM Re: For users who have experience with both. HK 91/93 VS. AR10 [Re: hogan]
mudstud Offline
Campfire Ranger

Registered: 03/18/02
Posts: 1532
Loc: Dakota
HK91,
1.) Stocks are too dang short.
2.) No last shot hold open.
3.) Throws your brass about 30 feet unless you have the port buffer installed.
4.) Because of the fluted chamber, the brass is ruined anyway.
5.) I think they are hard kickers, probably because of 1.).
6.) They have the rotary style peep sight, which in my case is usable only at the 300 meter settings and above, because I can't get my cheek low enough to use the 100 and 200 meter settings.
7.) Genuine HK accessories are incredibly expensive, altho there are much cheaper alternatives available now days.
8.) They are now going for, what?, $3000 or so! Give me a break! Heck, they were over-priced when you could buy them for $600!!

One good thing about HK 91's, I made a substantial profit on mine when I sold them!

If you do decide to go the HK91 route, I still have some accessories laying around, shoot me a PM if you could use the actual original HK claw lock scope mount, a 1000 meter sight, port buffers, carrying handles and such! Before I put this stuff on eBay.
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#2896543 - 03/18/09 06:48 PM Re: For users who have experience with both. HK 91/93 VS. AR10 [Re: Torque]
Rick n Tenn Offline
Campfire Regular

Registered: 07/22/06
Posts: 833
Loc: TN./MS
I have fired both weapons and prefer the AR-10. The AR is a much more accurate weapon .

The clones don't scar up brass like the original HKs . Doesn't throw them as far either.

I own a DPMS LR-308 , I am looking to buy a SOCOM for my MBR.

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#2896648 - 03/18/09 07:39 PM Re: For users who have experience with both. HK 91/93 VS. AR10 [Re: Rick n Tenn]
splattermatic Offline
Campfire Tracker

Registered: 07/25/08
Posts: 5866
Loc: n.w. new mexico
get a fal !
wayyyyyy, better than either.

mags are everywhere, cheap compared to ar10's, and the rifle itself is way more reliable and easier to use than either.
no moving your face to charge the rifle, it's on the side. no destroyed brass. and it has lots of acc's and cool things avaiable, that won't break the bank.


para's are the only way to go....

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#2897876 - 03/19/09 11:59 AM Re: For users who have experience with both. HK 91/93 VS. AR10 [Re: splattermatic]
GunGeek Offline
Campfire Kahuna

Registered: 10/08/04
Posts: 16340
Loc: NW Nevada
Mudstud has it right on all the negatives except for the brass

First off, real H&K 91ís do score up the brass, but it is reloadable. The PTRís use much shallower fluting of the chambers, which does very little scoring of the brass; again, itís completely reloadable.

The real down side of the AR-10 is that itís not a real military rifle. Itís based on a military design, but itís not built to any military spec because none exists. The real AR-10ís that did see military service were poor performers and most were phased out within a few years of adoption.

Splattermatic has it correct. Of the .308 battle rifles, the FAL is the clear winner. It was adopted by most of the free world and has won out in most every military test it has ever been put in. The Germans only adopted the G3 over the FAL because of licensing issues, not because of performance. The US had to re-design the US military rifle tests a few times in order for the M14 to come out ahead of the FAL.

Thereís a reason the entire free world adopted the FAL; it works. Out of the box, a FAL is more accurate than a G3 or M14 and the original AR10ís. These days, a good FAL is every bit as accurate as a standard grade M1A, more reliable, parts are much cheaper and more readily available, so are magazines. The DPMS AR10 is a proprietary design for many of the parts, so if you have parts breakage, you have to depend on DPMS being in business and continuing to make that model forever.

Parts availability for the PTR is much the same as the FAL, cheap and available.

It all depends on what youíre looking for. If youíre looking for a battle rifle, then the PTR is clearly the better choice over the DPMS AR-10. The G3 design, warts and all, is a very proven design and it works. I donít care for it much, but it really does work.

Still, I think the FAL is the best of the .308ís hands down; again, talking about true fighting guns.

If youíre looking for a range toy, then the DPMS is the clear winner, because it will make smaller groups, easier to mount optics on, and the triggers are better.

Problem with American shooters is, they will always opt for more accuracy over more reliability; which is why the AR and M1Aís reign supreme in the US.
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#2897892 - 03/19/09 12:07 PM Re: For users who have experience with both. HK 91/93 VS. AR10 [Re: GunGeek]
BMT Offline
Campfire Kahuna

Registered: 11/09/02
Posts: 18300
Loc: Alvadore, Oregon
 Originally Posted By: KevinGibson


If youíre looking for a range toy, then the DPMS is the clear winner, because it will make smaller groups, easier to mount optics on, and the triggers are better.



Hey, I resemble that remark!

;\)

BMT
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"The Church can and should help modern society by tirelessly insisting that the work of women in the home be recognized and respected by all in its irreplaceable value." Apostolic Exhortation On The Family, Pope John Paul II

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#2897902 - 03/19/09 12:12 PM Re: For users who have experience with both. HK 91/93 VS. AR10 [Re: Torque]
BMT Offline
Campfire Kahuna

Registered: 11/09/02
Posts: 18300
Loc: Alvadore, Oregon
 Originally Posted By: Torque
I have mind mind made up that I am buying one or the other as a just in case situation. For those of you who have used both, which would you recommend? The HK would be a the high quality clone, and the AR 10 would most probably be a DPMS.


"just in case" = 22lr + 12 guage + 308 Bolt action + AR-15 clone.

Battle Rifle = FN.

I bought my DPMS 308 in order to reduce knowledge requirements. Its just a big ar-15.

(and It shoot little bitty groups).

BMT
_________________________
"The Church can and should help modern society by tirelessly insisting that the work of women in the home be recognized and respected by all in its irreplaceable value." Apostolic Exhortation On The Family, Pope John Paul II

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#2897940 - 03/19/09 12:34 PM Re: For users who have experience with both. HK 91/93 VS. AR10 [Re: BMT]
TC1 Offline
Campfire Tracker

Registered: 08/28/02
Posts: 5667
The AR-10 is in service with of our troops. It's known as the M110 Semi-Automatic Sniper System. It's an incredible rifle built by the Knights Armament corp. I would love to own the version DPMS summited for the bid, the DPMS SASS.

Having owned two FNFAL's I never found them to be anything special except in the looks dept. They aren't uterly reliable nor very accurate. This was the general feeling of most that carried it for thier country. BTW, DSA summitted a sniper style FAL rifle for the SASS bid competition. Thier submission wouldn't shoot MOA which was one of the requirements and they were rejected early in the competition.

Since you aren't going to be fighting with this gun I would opt for the most accurate of the lot.

Terry
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Well, other than that Mrs. Lincoln, how was the play?

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#2898239 - 03/19/09 03:24 PM Re: For users who have experience with both. HK 91/93 VS. AR10 [Re: TC1]
RyanScott Offline
Campfire Ranger

Registered: 09/08/08
Posts: 1601
TC1, AR10 is a term only applicable to Armalite rifles, and the M110 SASS is a turd that doesn't function as advertised.

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