Home Forums Lever Action Central Big Bore Levers Might be a silly question but.....

Can a 45/70 be loaded with shot. I have a guide gun that is so compact and handy. I will use it mainly for bear defence but carry it fishing and on the quad etc.I am always bumping into grouse and would really like to be able to yse a light load of shot.
I am not talking about knocking ducks and geese out of the sky, just 20-30 foot shots on grouse.
I read(maybe here on the campfire) about being able to use 410 in the 444,so this got me thinking.
The 45/70 shell definitely looks big enough to do it,I just wish that if it can be done a ammo manufacturer would produce some ammo.
If it can be done what would lead do to the rifeling? I am not concerned about barrel life as I would over the years only put less than 100 rounds of shot thru it.A box of 20ga ammo lasts me quite a few years and that is my main grouse gun.

The main problem you would have, in addition to it being a cylinder bore, is the rifling will tend to "donut" the pattern. It is not an optimal setup, but would work at short ranges.

Don't know where, but there has to be data for shot loads for 45-70. Prolly cardboard wads over a pistol powder load, then another cardboard wad over the shot. Maybe a 410 wad would work?
Seems I've seen this data somewhere.
Virgil B.

257,
No, this is NOT a silly qustion. You've got me intrested also! I've got an 1895 45-70 with the barrel cut back to 17" Am thinkin you are right, a grouse load for this gun would be ideal!
I posted your qustion over on "shotshell reloading" I hope WE get a response!
Virgil B.

Thanks V.B. Sure would be a fun project to play with.Hope we get a response.

If you can get your hands on a 410 shot cup try it for size in the 45-70. A snug fit would be desirable. I use them in a highly modified case in 44 mag and 44 spec. but I do have to modify the cups some to get them to fit. Mainly cuts down on bore leading. With just bare shot you will most likly get some leading which will probably be pretty minimal if only one or two shots are fired. Other wise cut some card wads and load one over the powder and one over the shot with a good crimp. One of the faster pistol powders such as bullseye, win 231, unique etc. should work fine. I'm out of shot cups and have a liftime supply of shot cartridges for the 44's otherwise I would have already checked the fit.

257STEW,
I posted this qustion over on "ask the gunwriters" Got some more ideas...Seems the 410 shotcup will work if wrapped in thin cardboard to fill the gap. Wish I could get mesurements on a 28 gague shotcup.
Virgil B.

V.B. love the info. I have the local shop trying to get me the speer 45 cal.shot capsule,however they are .4515 and I am hoping a good crimp will hold them.I am also getting them in .44 and trying the same trick in my ruger 96/44.Over all I am looking forward to playing around with this idea,anything to keep me at the bench and at the range. I will post my results when I get some. Until then,Stew.

Guys there is another website where this very topic is being discussed on a couple of threads. Don't feel right in directing people away from Rick's website by posting the address publicly, but if you PM me I will give you the addess.

Well there was a guy on marlinowners (444), he cut the tops off of 410 shells (2.5) then he put the shot in a separate bowl, then removed the wad, then put the powder in a separate bowl. He then took a primed,sized 444 case and put the components in it. He then had some milk carton cut to fit over the shot and I believe he hot glued it in place.

I am going to try the same thing w/my 444. I am going hog hunting here in TX in July and I hate snakes. My theory is to carry a 3-4 on the butt stock.

Also that fella showed pictures of his project and some patterns he shot.

That would be the website..............

Viking, I carry a Smith & Wesson 44mag with #6's for rattle snakes! Now around the house I drop down to #7.5's for copperhead snakes. Both will do the job but on a big rattler I like those #6's cause they penetrate very deep at 10 feet.

I just got done loading 5 shells. I took apart the 410's and put the components in a primed 444's. Then I had a daughter cut some cap's. I also but a slight crimp, for feeding purposes. I then hot glued them for a seal. I thought of finger nail polish but........ da wife's mary kay. But wanted to go unscathed for another day.

I loaded some 45-70's with #6 shot in a 2-1/2" 410 shot wad. I used 410 data for 2400 powder. Cut some cardboard wads with a .45 Colt case sharpened up with a case de-buring tool, and put one over the powder and one over the shot, then sealed the whole thing by dripping some wax from a candle. At 20 yards I got about a 2-1/2 foot pattern that had a big enought hole in it that a grouse might escape. maybe I need to use smaller shot?
Anybody need a few 410 wads lemme know. I had to buy a bag of 250. Way more than I'd use in a lifetime!
Virgil B.

I don't think it will matter what shot you use. Years ago I fired a shot shell from a 44 mag. revolver at a big piece of cardboard. The same results, a donut shaped pattern. However I learned that I would need to sight along the barrel. My 444 is scoped, so if I run across a snake coiled up I will just site along the barrel and pray that works.

I used hot glue, do you think that will work instead of wax.

The hot glue might be better than wax. Another poster says he used a .45 ca. gascheck turned upside down. This sounds like the best method.
Virgil B.

What about .45 cal muzzleloader sabots? IIRC, MMP makes some that measure .457 across.

Make a paper capsule and stuff it between two sabots open end to open end. [*SHOT*]

I think the real trick to pulling tighter groups would be to shoot lighter shot and somehow reduce the effect of the rifling on the shot load.

I've seen 44 Mag with shot shells work very well on Grouse and Spruce hens.