Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Alaska Displacement Hulls in SE Alaska

I have always wanted a St Pierre Dory like they make in Lunenburg Nova Scotia. I was all geared up at one time to build one myself but work time and money all conspired against me.

Nonetheless...

I have heard that the currents in SE Alaska near Ketchikan and POW can be insane. Do you HAVE to have a boat that will get up on plane? Does anyone run a displacement hull boat of a fairly small size? Or is it dangerous?

I am kinda odd. When I am on the water I am never in a hurry. And I like bottom fishing more than anything. Why wouldn't a displacement hull work for puttering around?

I googled them; they are nice looking boats.
I have a little Hewescraft, so not experienced with a D-hull.
But most any $500 GPS chartplotter will have a tide/current function that gives you current speed and direction, more importantly hours until slack tide, at many potentially dangerous points anywhere in AK. But it will really test your statement that you are not in a hurry, when you are waiting 6 hours for a tide swing.

If you are big into pre-planning, you could work out your trips in advance to see the passes with 20 kt current speeds, at safe times.

There ARE many places in SE Alaska where the tidal currents are quite strong but not so strong as to make displacement hulls impractical or undesirable. There are plenty of displacement hulls operating in SE Alaska - mostly in commercial fishing boats and other commercial boats but also in pleasure craft. But tidal currents are not the main factor pushing people one way or the other in selecting a hull type.

There are several factors that drive most people toward planing hulls - speed probably being foremost. Most working people have little time and have to fish/hunt/recreate after work and on weekends. They want to get to where the fish are and back as quickly as possible. Also lots of people get their start by buying a skiff with an outboard and progress up through what they are familiar with and is most readily available - the floating bathtubs with outboards or inboard/outdrives that are fast but at a high cost in fuel and seaworthiness - that have been the most popular/available from the boating industry for a long time. These things tend to measure fuel use in tens of gallons per hour. Most people who buy/operate boats don't really spend the time to learn about the characteristics of the different hull types (or about weather, etc.) and just buy what is most available (new and used) and what is the trend of the day at the time they get into a boat. And certainly the pleasure boat industry has been and still is dominated by planing hulls so that's what most people are familiar with, see in ads, see on the water and buy themselves. They don't live on their boats - just spend a few hours a week on them during the months of May - September, so speed is the most important factor.

For commercial fisherman speed was (and for most still isn't) the most important factor in selecting a hull design. Function, efficiency, and seaworthiness are more important. When commercial fishing was not a rodeo (and for some fisheries it still isn't) speed wasn't that important. Getting out, being able to stay out in rough weather and GETTING BACK all at low cost was most important.

I've fished and hunted out of Juneau for 40 years. Although I now live in Anchorage my boat still lives in Juneau - in the Douglas Harbor where it's lived for a long time. I have a little 27" double ender with full displacement hull and single screw inboard diesel. It is a great fishing boat and also very nice for cruising the waters in SE and using as a base for hunting. It's too slow for most folks - cruises @ 6.5 knots - but is great for my purposes. It burns only 1/4 gallon (yes one-quarter gallon) of diesel per hour at cruising speed and with a 100 gal fuel tank has a range of @ 1200 miles. It's perfect for trolling for king and silver salmon - basically puttering around dragging bait through the water where there are salmon. So, yes displacement hulls work for puttering around in SE Alaska.

Here's the URL of the builder http://www.allweatherboats.com/. They are built by Homer Hughes out of Ferndale, WA (just outside of Bellingham). Homer is an interesting guy who builds these things to be stout, functional, and seaworthy. They ARE very well made, very seaworthy, and very low maintenance boats.

On a side note: I too once dreamed of owning a St. Pierre dory - sailing dories were THE fishing boats on Bristol Bay (and most of Alaska) at one time. There was a great example in Juneau in the mid-'70s. It was 27" with a cuddy cabin where you could crawl in to sleep, with a rudder and a motor well. It was for sale for @ $2,500 - unfortunately at the time more than I could afford. I agree they have beautiful lines and are very functional - can be set up for rowing, sailing or motoring (or all three). There was years ago an old time builder in Ouzinkie (on Spruce Island - a small island a few miles north of Kodiak) who made beautiful dories. May still be some folks building/using them.

You're not "odd" you've just got a different perspective and different sensibilities from most people on the water (or anywhere else) today.

If you aren't making long runs, then a displacement hull with a small diesel sure makes for a economic way to get around. It just depends on your use.

I'd love to have a sailboat or displacement hull, but they are simply too slow for my use. I'll cover from 60 to over 100 miles on a day trip, so I need something that will cruise at over 20 knots and wot of 30 knots, and wouldn't mind a boat that would cruise at 30 knots and wot of 40+knots.

There is also something to be said for having some speed to head back when things are starting to turn, rather than plodding along and getting clobbered. Also if you're going against a several knot tide change, your speed over the ground could be down to about 5 knots.

Check out Tolman skiffs if you want an AK designed dory, that will get up on plane.

http://www.alaska.net/~tolmanskiffs/

http://www.fishyfish.com/tolmanskiff.html

http://www.skiffkits.com/

I'm rather fond of my Tolman widebody

Mr. 458,

You built that didn't you? I think I remember you posting pics of it under construction???

I have that book! Bought it years ago when I was working in the South Pacific.

Mr Ak Chessie;

Thanks for the info! I checked out the link and those boats look wonderful but I could not find a price anywhere except on the used boat for sale saying replacement price was 120 grand.

Hmmm

Very interesting perspective you describe. Very encouraging to me at least!

I have fished on 458Lott's boat and it handles well and gets things done very efficiently.

Mr 458...

Got any more pictures?

Hey Dixie,
Have you seen any copies of the magazine "PassageMaker"? My Harbor Master gave me a stack of them when I first moved to Kodiak, really neat periodical about trawlers of all kinds.

Most of my pictures are ones of the construction process. Either that or pictures taken from the boat.

I took some good pictures this 4th of July, but either lost or somehow errased the memory card











A few more

Thanks for the heads up!

Thanks for the pictures.

I looked at the web site you provided and I can afford that pre-cut kit.

I'm gonna build one! Really!

Did you fiberglass it or just epoxy paint it?

The wood is completely covered with fiberglass and epoxy resin. Then you get to fair, prime and paint. The fiberglass is part of the structure, so think of it as a composite hull with a wood core, not purely a wooden boat. The book was the product of Renn building 100+ skiffs commercially, so unlike most designs, you get the builders experience of building the hull, not his concept of what it will be like to build it.

Neil is a great guy, and his kits are top notch. It saves a bunch of time, and epoxy to go with the kit so you won't be sorry.

A friend built a St. Pierre Dory back when I was in school in Wa. He would run it up the inside passage every summer and Troll for Salmon commercially and Seine Herring some too. He would live aboard for 3-4 months a year and still loved the boat after four years of this. He could make it up to Bristol for fuel costs less than it costs me to fill up my Pickup truck now. Never needed slip space as he would just beach it wherever he needed to.

I can see 458's points as I have had to run from some hairy weather and other times had a huge white water wake behind me only to realize I was going backwards in a strong rip. That was in a 21 foot pilot gig, not a Dory.

The C Class Dory is another good one that is a semi planning hull. Combines the best or worst of both types depending on how you look at it.

458 Good looking Skiff and photos.

I've been scratching my head about a lot of this, but in addition to building a larger skiff I want to build a purpose built river boat that I could more or less live on and also beach without tearing up the bottom.

Go aluminum for a boat you'll beach.

Mr. 458----That's a beauty you built there. Nice job sir.

I ran an OLD 43ft boat up the inside passage and ran it around SE Alaska. It had a very old 3 cylinder engine and made 8-10 knots on a good day. I was spun around one time in a whirlpool but no real problems.

Full displacement, semi displacement hull or planning hull. That are your three choices.

I looked long and hard at the Alaskan Skiff at Neil's shop, it is a beautiful design and Neils boat is georgios. The design is a potential killer, as all square stern designs are in a bore tide. I lost two friends buried not a mile from me in just such and accident, This was in a huge Waller. They were trapped in the cabin and went down. If it was me, I would look for a double end er like a Bartender, they ride stern waves.

And make it quarter inch. Put plenty of power on it as well. Big water is no place to mess around with almost enough. There will be times.... and being able to reach deep, even if you mostly putter around, can not only be handy, it can save your life. Four-stroke is the only way to putter and still have the necessary power available if you need it.