Home Forums Reloading Bullet Casting Cast bullets for deer

Anybody else using cast bullets for deer hunting this year? My deer poison of choice is a custom .30 cal. 190 gr. flat nose cast from an alloy of WWs and tin, giving me 12-13BHN hardness. Loaded to 1900-2000fps in both .30/30 and .303 Savage 1899s. In the past this bullet has served me well, in terms of accuracy and killing effectiveness. I imagine leading would start to rear it's ugly head with extended shooting, but I clean after 20 shots and it's never been a problem. Used an NEI 180 gr. RN design years ago and may actually give them a whirl again, cast of the same alloy. I prefer the 190 both for it's better shape (wide flatnosed) and bit more weight but that may be academic.

I use cast bullets for everything. Both my Marlin 1895 in 45-70 and my various Sharps in 40-65, 40-70 Straight, 45-70, 45-90, and 45-110. I also use them in my 50-90 Sharps. I wouldn't use anything else. If it ain't broke, don't fix it.

Hello
My favorite bullet in my favorite deer rifle is 170 grain paper patched bullet.I found that it kills just as good as the Hornady Interlock,and destroys less meat.
Frank

How much expansion is realy needed. I have a 162gn GC lino bullet ( Lyman 287641 Sil) for my 7x57 that runs at 2415fps and will put 5 into 1 1/2 @ 100. Have oportunities on goat but have not used them so far because of the question of whether they would kill quickly enough. So far have been using them on paper but would like to try them on meat if the lino that fast would work.

Von Gruff.

That alloy is rather hard. If it doesn't hit bone it will likely zip through with little expansion. If it hits heavy bone it's likely to shatter. My first attempt at killing a deer with cast bullets, about 30 years ago, was with a Lyman 311284 210 gr. RN out of a .30/40 Krag. I don't remember the exact alloy but I do know it was based on monotype, with some pure lead mixed in. I remember it as being really hard. At Krag velocities (2000 fps +/-) it was hell for accurate. The deer I put the kibosh to died hard. At least 3 shots, maybe 4, all in the boiler room. I don't remember. The bullets behaved like full metal jackets. No evidence of expansion.

If it were me I would water that lino alloy down to where it's about half as hard as it is, and slow it down to 2000 fps max to obviate leading. It'll kill better than the alloy/velocity you're using now, even though at less speed, IMO.

Lino has a pretty narrow window to open up; if your strike velocity was that speed you'd find it may be excessive in the damage dept..

A few hundred feet slower strike and it will definitely be a solid.

Nose shape plays a role in that window too. Add more lead to soften or make a few with pure lead noses and you'll be in a surer spot.

Newsprint wet and dry will tell you how soft, how fast and what speed you need to make things work and how soft you can go and still keep your group.

These (I think its four shots, not five) are from a 22 Hornet, 48 gr softnosed at 2,900 fps. The nose was 1-20 alloy.
They work fine if you have a good bore and patience in casting quality bullets. I wish I had taken pics of more cast targets


A 400 Whelen target, 375gr at 2,200-2,300 fps.



The two left were zeroes, the three under the bull print 3 inches lower than the 300 gr. TSX loads at 2,500 fps used after. Luck!

Thanks guys, that is about what I thought would be the case. At least they are great fun on my practice plate. (a 8x8 steel plate that I use for practicing field shooting)

Looks like I will have to try casting a soft nose for the bullet which is something I always wanted to try anyway. I had thoughts of about 40-50 grn of 75/25 ww/pb. And because it is a bore riding design leading should not be a problem. Actually there has been a bit of playing done as the bore is .2755 and the bullet nose drops at .276 so I have adapted an unused 358 sizer die to take a .275 neck sizer button so I could size just enough of the nose to allow prpper bullet seating depth. This in effect gives the front portion of the nose a .0005 clearance before the remaining nose portion that has .005 positive engagement. If I regulate the soft portion with the .005 under sized portion of the nose then velocity shouldn't be any concern. Do you feel that 45-50 gns soft is enough or should I look at more like 65-70.
Any advise from those who have gone down this road would be apreciated. Have read lots on getting the soft and hard to properly join together but it is the proportions that I would like input on.

Von Gruff.

Use a flat nose and wheel weight metal. They expand just like a picture.

NEI 395 .411 from a converted Browning High wall (to .411 40-82) at about 1800 FPS.

NEI DD bullets I use:
.411, .358, .309



Yesterday's group with the 309 from a HiWall 300 H&H.

Now you're cooking with gas! My NEI .309 180 is the one that looks like a scaled down version of your .411. The most accurate .30 mould I own (out of about 15). After a day at the range last weekend I found it to out shoot by a small margin the Saeco 190 flat nose, but not enough to give up that extra weight and flat nose for deer hunting.

NICE! I took my moose with cast 405 grain for 45-70 a couple weeks ago

I've got a mold for the Lyman 358009 286 grs. I might try it next year in the 35 Whelen. Does anyone have any experience with this?
whelennut

I've got one and it shoots very good in my rifle. I have not used it on anything that bleeds, however.

I have a Marlin XL-7 in 35 Whelan and the 358009 shoot great, but has a pretty stout recoil on the 8 lb gun.

I also like the 185gr Round Flat point Gas Check 35 cal boolit I shoot out of my 35 whelan at 2400fps! I just use air cooled wheel weights.
I'm looking forward to trying one out on deer this year.

Here is a pic of the bullet. The flat point one not the HP one.
These are from a Night Owl Enterprise mould. (aka NOE)

Very nice, blammer!

Well, I haven't tried my Wilson hollowpointer on the 30.
Got to gather up a lot of phone books to soak (our local one is 5x8 and 60 pages)

Thinking of working up a load for it for my 303 1899, should be a penetrating mutha! Put a greater effort into stalking those speed goats!

I've been using the Lyman 457193 cast at 30:1 or 40:1 in my Marlin 1895 CB. Got a small whitetail (125# yearling) last Sunday with that setup. Dropped it like it had been hit with Thor's hammer. Complete pass through. I have also used that bullet in my single shot 45-70s but use the Lyman 457125 in them for the most part. That setup works good on deer, too.

Otter--I think we are on the same page about the 45-70 and good bullets for it. The 457193 Lyman is a great 400 grain bullet. I have also used the 457125 with good success in hunting, here as well as Africa.

Penetration is very important to me. I want an exit hole, plain and simple. I use a Sharps for almost all of my hunting and as a resultI favor longer, heavier bullets for the dual benefits of increased penetration and long range accuracy over the shorter 400 grain or so bullets.

Having said that, my 1895 Cowboy Marlin has a lot going for it, not the least of which is that it holds 8 in the magazine and 1 in the chamber. It is light, accurate, and fast. I have held off on using it because I have been unable to shoot a longer,heavier bullet in it--until now.

The Lyman 457121 is a flat nosed bullet with the same nose as the 457193. However, it has SEVEN grease grooves, is longer, and weighs 480 grains. I have found that I can load 66 grains of 3f black powder--highly compressed--and this bullet in my 45-70, and it will feed beautifully in the Marlin. It goes 1249 fps, and basically shoots one hole if you can hold it.

It would be easy to load this bullet with 37 grains of 3031 if you wanted to shoot smokeless, and it would be pure poison in the Marlin and give incredible penetration.

I plan to shoot an American buffalo bull on Dec. 4th, and intend to use this load and bullet. I will be very surprised if I don't shoot all the way through him. I have already shot through an impala in Africa from end to end with this bullet out of my 45-110 using black powder for 1370 fps. I strongly suspect that the 45-70 will do just as well. I intend to find out, and will keep you posted.

sharpsguy,

Yup - ain't nothin like the results you get using a 45-70 (or your 40-XX, 45-XX or 50-XX of choice) when hunting the larger big-game species. Going to have to try the Lyman 457121 out. As said earlier, I have had real good luck with the 457125 and the 457193 (some guys don't, for whatever reasons) and stopped experimenting when I got both bullets to shoot well. I have also used the 457122, 330 gr FNHP with some succes, but like the heavier bullets - they make as big a hole and go all the way through. I do use smokeless in my 1895, but load them as if it's BP under the bullet - BP lube in the bullet grease grooves and wad underneath. My single shots have had nothing but BP through them.

BTW - I cast my 457193 30:1 or 40:1 and they weigh out 415 gr +/-.