Home Forums Miscellaneous Topics Second Amendment Coincidence ?? HARDLY !!!!

Algore and the Clintonistas admitted four years ago that the NRA cost the Democrats the election.

This time, Kerry loses the popular vote by 3.5 to 4 million votes.

Is it merely coincidence that that is almost exactly the number of members in the National Rifle Association ???

I don't think so !!!!!

Me neither!! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Huntr

I hope it's more than a coincidence.

It's a fairly meaningless numbers game....I mean, it's not like the NRA members were all that likely to vote for a Democrat (ANY democrat) to begin with. The portion of NRA members that were going to vote were probably going to vote Republican no matter what.

Well, let me ask...is your point that the NRA membership (4.5 Million) cost Kerry the election? If that's what you mean, you are somewhat right, but the point is moot...at no time was that number about to vote for Kerry. It was just one of those "given" factions for the Republicans.

I believe that is correct. We NRA members would only vote for pro-gun politians (At least I hope we all do).

I did notice something different this year however. My wife is Catholic. Most Catholics have always voted for democrats (at least that has always been my observation). But the Catholic church took a strong and political stand against any politician who supported abortion and/or gay marriage. There are now a lot of Catholics who were once democrat, who have switched over to republican do that fact. For a lack of a better term, there is almost a civil war between the liberal priests and conservative priests within the catholic church itself. And it is my belief the Conservatives in that arena are winning.

I think these new Catholic republicans, along with all our other conservative church groups helped turn the tide in the elections this year (just my opinion).

It is just so nice to see that not everone in this country has been duped by the liberal hog wash.

Here's an even better reason !!!!

Oh gosh, that's pretty good <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />.

Now that's funny!

I don't understand why a Catholic would vote for a Democrat.

Firstly, to be a Catholic you must be a Christian.

Hopefully that would mean you actually follow Christ.

To follow Christ one would learn what Christ taught in the Scriptures.

To believe in the Scriptures one would certainly not be a liberal ie Democrat because the Democratic party as a whole is relativistic/humanistic and usually abhors anything that resembles an absolute moral code.

I know this appears simplistic, but it works. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

Scottyman your right.

A lot of Catholics grew up Democrats. Their parents in the 1940's were democrats (back when Democrates were not a wacko group of people). They raised their kids Catholic and Democrat, as they felt that the D party defended the the rights of the poor. And I believe in those days they probably were right. Hence, it is hard for their off spring generations to change what they were programed to believe and practice.

During the 1960's the seminaries of the Catholic church got some way out liberal priests teaching in them. Their views and what they taught were very much away from what the Catholic principles were. Further, they got a lot of liberal thinkers who joined the preisthood at that time, attending those seminaries. A lot of conservative men who would not conform to these new ideas were forced out of the seminaries. There are a lot of these priests who came from that time who are still very much liberal in their thinking and hold key positions of authority. And they have influenced a great many people in their modern humanistic theology (when you see catholic priests who march in the gay parades, or against City Hall because some gang banger's family wants to sue for police brutality. Well, those are them <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />).

Plus, there are a lot of Catholics who actually don't know what their church believes or who even know their Bible. They just go through the motions. I would not say that they are really practicing Catholics, their heart (my opinion) is really not into knowing God's will, it's just what you do for fire insurance. These kind of Catholics blow in the wind and imbrace the liberal way of thinking.

But their are a lot of Catholics, who do know their Bible, know what their church practices & believes in and why. These Catholics are very much conservative (I believe Allen Keyes is Catholic). These catholics believe in the fundamentals and moral beliefs (who percieve abortion as killing babies & gay marriage as against God's law and unatural, and know that war is sometimes necessary). These catholics are taking a strong stance on these issues.
As I said before there is a civil war so to speak, a clashing of swords between the liberal priests and the Conservative ones and the body of the catholic church is witnessing it. The Vatican's stance is clearly on the conservative side. This has caused the liberal priests with their perverted stances to use rationalizations, in the attempts to make their corrupt stances to appear righteous.

There are some very fine Catholic people out there, who have a great deal of common sense and love to serve God, in the best capacity they can offer. For a Baptist boy. This goes against what my father (a Baptist minister) always taught me about Catholics, but he was wrong.

Wow - I am Catholic - 12 years of Catholic school. I don't remember ever seeing and Democratic bend amongst the Catholics I grew up with. I really don't think it is that simple. More like people are a denomination and much like Kerry - just that only at church. They do not allow their faith to be part of their life other than Sunday mornings. They are more like Democrats who are also Catholic rather than Catholic Democrats.

After a long discussion with a co-worker of the Democratic (and catholic) persuasion, we came to an agreement on one issue. The majority of Americans do not have an extremely strong opposition to issues which provide MORE rights to individuals, such as gay "unions", abortions,etc... and, no, I'm not endorsing them... but the majority of Americans do have an exteme opposition to the loss of rights, such as the right to bear arms, even if they do personaly partake.

Being Catholic myself I think TEAL summed it up nicely.

Being a Catholic myself & (consider my self an independent) , I really think the Democrate's missed the "mind set" of common values that most people have.

The county where I was born & raised in PA. has always been Democrat. My parents were some of the "few" people who didn't agree that a "Yellow Dog Democrat" was better than any Republican.

This county has for at least the last 50 yrs. always voted Democrat, no matter what.

This yr. they voted Republican by 1440 votes ( approx. 156K people in the county) even thought they are registered 2 to 1 Democrat-Know Why ?

MORAL VALUES.

At least that's what a lot of my friends, & relatives up there have told me. They saw Kerry , & the Democratic party as not a moral, but , & it hurt them to admit it, because he is a Republican,
Bush was a "better moral person".

As you may know, guns, are in most every home. In fact I don't know any one who doesn't own a few, in these small farming towns. Guns, & the NRA had some credit, but MORAL VALUES, was the major factor in that area.

I have to agree. While I am proud to be a conservitive "firearms enthusiest", I realize that my vote only cancelled that of a left wing radical. All the good folks in the middle call the shots...and they want INTEGRITY. Will the Democratic party every realize that (again) and quit selecting scumbags as their frontmen? I, myself, would love to vote democrat. I believe it would be benificial to my pocketbook. My morals just won't let me.

A lot of Catholics don't care what their church believes. Many Catholic acquaintances of mine openly and vociferously disagree with the official church stand on just about everything, abortion, pre-marital sex, divorce, married clergy, celibacy, female priests, etc.

It is not just Catholics. A lot of church goers, and union members, routinely ignore their own 'leadership' and vote their conscience. The era of the 'monolithic mob' is ending. The future is one of balancing special interest groups.

<< because he is a Republican>>

Oops! Did I vote the wrong way?

Bagtic,
I don't disgree with what you say about some Catholics not agreeing to the church standing/teaching of the items you mentioned.

I call these people "Cateteria Catholics", as they believe only what they want to believe, they pick & choose what they want to believe, not church teaching.

The same is for any other religons. I believe, no matter what religion you choose, you should try to follow there teaching. If not, you'll wonder around for the rest of your life, searching, because you ( not you personally ) will never find a religion that suits you.

If the people ( Catholics) feel that way, why would they consider calling themselves Catholics. They should start another religon, as to what they believe.

We all have at times "reservations", about the teaching of our faith, no matter what faith/church we belong to. Just because I don't agree with some thing dosesn't mean I am right, & they are wrong. Some people seem to think they are right all the time no matter what. All you have to do is read some reply's on the other "main topics" here on 24 hr.

They ask a "gunwriter" a question because they think he knows a little more on the subject, & then because he doesn't have there point of view, they really disagree with him. People are People.

When I use the word "you" above, please don't think I am referring to you.

No offense taken or even suspected. Until I got to your final line it never crossed my mind, then I had to go back and reread to see what I had missed. Still can't find it.

I agree that if a person is at odds with whatever group they belong the should move on. I believe the explanation is that for many people religion, and a lot of other things, are more a tradition than a reflection of who THEY are. Its a case of 'We [in this family] have always been Democrats/ Republicans, Catholics/Jews/Baptists, etc. and are going to stay that way'. It is almost as though the 'seniority' is more important than the relationship or commitment.

I had a personal experience several years ago when an engagement got called off because I would not convert. My feeling is each to his own and everyone do their own thing, politically or theologically. The wonderful lady I finally ended up with didn't care that she and I share some differences. The result is a marriage that is the joy of my life. Made all the forgettable years till then worth it.

BAGTIC,

I sent you a PM