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Joined: Jul 2007
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Jul 2007
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Day in and day out the 7RM is faster across the board if both are operated at the same pressures....in general 7RM will move a 160 gr bullet at the same velocities a 280 will move a 140,as a general rule.And a 7RM will outrun the 280 pretty easily with the same bullet weight.By how much depneds on how hot you choose to load each catridge, what barrel you are running, etc etc.
I always looked at the 280 much the same as a 270,a cartridge for a light and lively mountain rifle weighing in the 7-7.5 pound range with a 22" barrel;and the 7 mag weighing a bit more with a 24"+ tube. If I'm gonna lug a 24" tube I would just as soon have the magnum chambering and take advantage of the additional powder capacity.
Differences in recoil between them are pretty moot to me,as even a heavily loaded 7RM's recoil is trifling....this has always been one of the cartridges greatest virtues. I'm a big fan of the 280 and the short action version of the 280AI.(7SAUM) That said, it's hard to argue with any of what Bob said. I don't care to "lean" on anything - if I truly want 7mag performance, I'm using the 7mag. 
![[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]](https://i.imgur.com/X0n16mr.png) WWP53D
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Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 35,900
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 35,900 |
Did I say that?  Geez one thing that is spooky about the Internet is that... ".....everything you say can and will be used against you......",and there is a written memo of it all..LOL! We are all being Miranda-ized
Last edited by BobinNH; 03/30/10.
The 280 Remington is overbore.
The 7 Rem Mag is over bore.
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Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 7,197
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Feb 2002
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Bob has hit the nail on the head. I had a 280 AI and was shooting 63.0g of powder and with the 7Mag was shootig 65.5g of powder. The 7 Mag got 75 fps more, probably due to variations in barrels.
I have discovered R#25 with the 154g SST's which is pushing the 154's at 3200+ with extreme accuracy in the 7 Mag. The 154g SST is really a fantastic deer bullet when you start getting out there a ways. I hunted a fruit tree that was 300-325 yards away from my stand. I killed two bucks in their tracks at 300, and one jumped straight up in the air doing a summersault, landed on it's belly and never even kicked at 325 yards. The 154 SST's demand to be jammed into the lands for extreme accuracy in the 7 Mags that I have shot them in.
Recently a fellow on the fire suggested that I try Retumbo with Fed 215's with the 162g A Max and glory be, shot three shots in a single hole at 3100 fps, Rem 700 sporter-26" stainless barrel. He said that customs got 3200 fps with a tighter chamber.
I use vias muzzle breaks on my 7's and see the bullet impact on the deer's hide...recoil less than a 243 sporter.
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Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 17,242
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 17,242 |
The recoil of a 8-9lb 7mmRM is not unbearable by any means, but it is enough to make me not really enjoy practicing. That's why I'm leaning toward the 280 or 280AI for my current project. The 7RM is a wonderful chambering, but I sometimes don't need that level of horsepower. Burning 7-10 grains less powder won't decrease recoil that much, but it is noticeable.
Now with even more aplomb
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Joined: Jul 2009
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Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 14,076 |
I am always disappointed with the 7rem mag with the velocities it gives. I currently load for 3 of them and they are all slow. they do have shorter barrels but I would like to think that I could get over 3000fps in a 22" barrel with 140grn bullets and it just won't get there. I started loading for a new 280AI the other day using the same 140 grain AB and got velocities up to 3215fps with RL17 before pressure signs showed up. So my 280AI outruns all 3 7mag's by 200fps while burning less powder and has less recoil. I like the 280AI but it is not for everyone.
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Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 17,242
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 17,242 |
The last 7RM that I worked up loads for had a 24" barrel and hit 3200+ with 140's and 3000+ with 160s', all with RL22. I'd not think that losing 2" of barrel would not knock off 200fps, but I'm not chopping mine off to see..... (grin)
Now with even more aplomb
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Joined: Jul 2009
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Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
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Yeah that is what I would expect to see with them as well. They are not my rifles so I don't care to much and the guys that have them like them so it is fine by me. It has however caused me pause in getting a 7mag for myself.
I used RL 22 and 19 in those as well just luck of the draw and getting slow barrels I guess. It can happen with any rifle/cartridge.
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Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 5,185
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Dec 2008
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Day in and day out the 7RM is faster across the board if both are operated at the same pressures....in general 7RM will move a 160 gr bullet at the same velocities a 280 will move a 140,as a general rule.And a 7RM will outrun the 280 pretty easily with the same bullet weight.By how much depneds on how hot you choose to load each catridge, what barrel you are running, etc etc.
I always looked at the 280 much the same as a 270,a cartridge for a light and lively mountain rifle weighing in the 7-7.5 pound range with a 22" barrel;and the 7 mag weighing a bit more with a 24"+ tube. If I'm gonna lug a 24" tube I would just as soon have the magnum chambering and take advantage of the additional powder capacity.
Differences in recoil between them are pretty moot to me,as even a heavily loaded 7RM's recoil is trifling....this has always been one of the cartridges greatest virtues. I'm a big fan of the 280 and the short action version of the 280AI.(7SAUM) That said, it's hard to argue with any of what Bob said. I don't care to "lean" on anything - if I truly want 7mag performance, I'm using the 7mag. I totally agree with what is being mentioned here. I'm also a huge 280 fan, but I also see it as the little brother to the 7RM. If you insist on really stoking the .280, you are really better off picking up a 7RM with a 24" pipe and having at it. As a matter of fact, I'm doing that very thing and my Win featherweight .280 is in the middle of becoming even lighter and more handy. Then, I'll pick up a 7 mag of my choice.. If you are hunting in area's where shooting 300 to 400+ yards or so might be more than occasional, I'm opting for the 7RM every time...and they don't have to be heavy. Recoil? The ones I have shot feel less than a stoked up 30-06. CLB
Last edited by CLB; 03/30/10.
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Joined: Jun 2005
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Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 842 |
...
Recently a fellow on the fire suggested that I try Retumbo with Fed 215's with the 162g A Max and glory be, shot three shots in a single hole at 3100 fps, Rem 700 sporter-26" stainless barrel. He said that customs got 3200 fps with a tighter chamber.
I use vias muzzle breaks on my 7's and see the bullet impact on the deer's hide...recoil less than a 243 sporter. Thank you! @ keith: What was the exactly charge of Retumbo with the A-Max? A friend of mine playing in the F-Class team has a new project with the 7 mm SAUM running. He offered me some of his 7 mm A-Max bullets for testing in my new 7 mm Remmy Demmy. How do they perform on deer or are they just reserved for paper punching?
Last edited by ElmerKeith; 03/30/10.
Elmer Keith
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Campfire Tracker
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Interesting...I just posted sonething about that load a few weeks ago....good to hear others are haveing the same results as I. My load in the 7Wby is 77grns under the A-max for 3180 fps average,IIRC, 24 inch barrel and excellent accuracy.
3MOA up for a 300 yrd hold, and 10MOA up for a 6. Makes hitting at distance easy..
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Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 13,436
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 13,436 |
Guys,
I know this has probably been hashed out numerous times, but here goes. I am building another TC encore and have the frame and stock and am now looking for a barrel. I have plenty of reloading supplies for 7mag, but have been told (by a friend) that the .280 or even better .280ai will give me similar ballistics of a 7mag out to about 300 yards with less recoil and less pressure on my encore frame. Trying to decide which way to go. I know the .280ai costs alot more for reloading and the barrel itself, but in the long run may even out to about the same $. This is for whitetail, mulies, elk and hopefully one day bear/moose.
Thoughts? Yes, I have thoughts.. There is only one sensible answer to your question. Buy BOTH barrels, and be done with all of the heavy thinking. I own, a 77 Rem Mag, and will never sell it. I own, a 284 Win, and will keep it too. The 284 is so close to the 280 you can't find a space between them. You really "NEED" both barrels...LMAO
Don Buckbee
JPFO
NRA Benefactor Member
NSSA Life Member
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Joined: Jan 2007
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Jan 2007
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heavywalker, what kind of rifles are those slow 7 mags?
The 280 Remington is overbore.
The 7 Rem Mag is over bore.
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