Home Forums Lever Action Central Big Bore Levers Possibly getting a 45-70 in trade...... have questions

I have a chance of taking a Marlin 45-70 in trade. I have pictures of the gun and it appears to be in very good shape. It has been magna ported though. My question, how many foot lbs of kick does the 45-70 put out? What's it compare too?

The gun does come with a scope, sling, pachmar deccereretor pad and a box of Hornadys.

Can anyone give me a good extimate of value on this package? The gun has the shorter barrel, blued with hardwood stock.

Thanks

Factory ammo, Win/Fed/Rem 300's or 405's feel about like a 20 gauge shotgun. They are not bad unless you really stand on the skinny pedal and add much powder.

These are the pictures of the gun, scope and ammo
. Maybe it would help with the value of the package.

If I do trade for this I may keep it and use it for bear. Looks like it would make a great bear gun. All my shots would be less than 75 yards.

If I decide to sell it from what I can tell there seems interest in these big bores.

You can load them from super mild, to really painful.

If you will be using it inside of 100 yards or so, you will probably enjoy it far more with a small scope (mounted low), or irons.

I ended up with XS ghost ring sights on mine. I love it.

You can tame them down for less recoil or go whole HOG and loosen your fillings in your mouth. Now I load a 350 grn bullet for most things but the "bears" get my attention quick like, so I use a "hardcast" wide metplate and stoke the case up to read around 1650fps on my Chrony. I sometimes used the 350 grn Hornady bullet at 1850fps but once in awhile that jacket will peel back.

I also use the 405 grn Remington at 1600fps, however I like those hardcast for bears or moose country (where bears are) up North. I also do NOT use a rifle scope on this rifle! In the dark timber it is just to hard to pick up enough light etc. I like the rifle without the scope on it, as it is faster for me to see target and get off the shots.

A 405 grain hard cast at 1200 - 1300 ft/sec will kill all the bears and moose you can point it at, especially at ranges as close as 75-100 yards. Keep it and shoot it. Lose the see through mounts. Use either irons or scope, not both.

The porting wil not hurt the value of a shooter 45-70 in a Marlin. It will probably improve the value just a bit. Marlin has sold alot of them ported over the years.

The rifle appears to be in pretty good shape. So let's talk about the rifle only. I would easily put a value on it of $500. I have been to a few auctions over the past few years. Every 1895 Marlin there went for around $550 to $600. So $500 is a very fair value.

Now as far as the scope is concerned. I am not familiar with that scope so I can not place a value on the scope.

Do you reload?? That is the most important question about recoil. And the above statement is 100% correct. At 1200 to 1300 fps with a 405 grain cast bullet you will be deadly---very deadly---on any critter walking in this country. I load a 405 with 40.0 grains of RL-7 which equates to approx. 1600 fps in all my 45-70's. This load has some recoil, but to me it is manageable.

The porting will help alot with muzzle flip of the Marlin. Which IMO is more noticable than the actual recoil.

If you reload then just load the 405 pill to about 1200 fps and enjoy your rifle. I have a TrapDoor that I shoot with a 1200fps load, and the rifle is in the 7# range. It is fine too shoot, not alot of recoil at 1200 fps. Some, but ceertainly manageable. Tom.

I do not reload.

I was reading about the lighter hornady load, somewhere I thought I read the Hornady leverevolution was shooting close to 2000FPS?

I was hoping the value of the gun would be a bit higher. I am considering trading a snowmobile that I have for the package. I feel the sled is worth $900.

Original plan was to trade that gun for a encore or towards another LH SS Browning A bolt.

The machine is a bit big for me so I have no need for it.

Check the Auction sites...AuctionArms, GunBroker and GunsAmerica.

Kick depends on the weight of the bullet, powder, rifle and velocity...magnaporting reduces a cartridges like the 45-70 about 20-30%. Goto Varmint Al's, he has a recoil calculator you can download. Recoil is also very subjective. I'm no Arnold S. but a factory 405 Rem 45-70 doesn't cause me much concern...others think somewhat different.

A 400 gr bullet at 1500 fs is about 22ftlbs in a 9.4 lb gun...not really very much. A 45-70 325 Hornady gumby nose at 2050 is about 25 ftlbs. A 180 gr at 2700(30-06) is about 18 ft.

I have a 336 that started life as a 3030, then rebored/rechambered to 356 Win. I did a lot of work to it and now it is a swap barrel 444M and I have a 45-70 barrel coming from Gun Parts that will be here 5-16-2011.

For about $300 you can have Mic McPherson do his 2.73" COAL job.

I long throated the 444, modified the carrier to handle a max cartridge OAL length of 2.68" and before I'm done I will have barrels in 375JDJ, 50 Alaskan and something in the 22-6mm cal and maybe a 307/308 Win.

When the 45-70 barrel gets here I will long throat it also, rechamber it with a 458 WM reamer so I can use whatever case length I need to fit whatever weight bullet I want to use 400-550gr...but NOT A FACTORY 458 WM.

Before anyone gets all worked up I've done things like this before, many times, but RENAME the cartidge on the barrel so no one does a no-no.

The 444M barrel is a 1/38 T so 250-300 gr/<0.850" bullet length is all it will shoot straight. The 45 cal has a 1/20 T and will handle all the "Normal" bullet weights accurately.

One thing very few even think about is you can shoot a longer than spec round as the first shot and whatever will feed through the mag as second on...that means if you rechamber your 45-70 to 45-90, 100 you can have a higher velocity/energy first shot round. You will have to pull the bolt to get a loaded round out and also use a screw driver to open the extractor slightly to release the rim, but if you buy the nice knob from Brownells, it is easy to do...or make one like I did...or just shoot it out.

My rifle weighs 9.4 lbs loaded with 5 444M rounds, scope, XS sight rib and a leather lace on recoil pad. I also installed a muzzle brake. I have 6 big bores including a 45-120, OEM 45-70 NEF BC and shoot quite a bit of the heavy stuff so a 525 gr PileDriver or 550 gr Crater only scares me a little.

There are many ways to put new life into a Marlin 45-70 and turn it into a T-Rex killer, but if a factory Rem 405 is all you want or need, that's OK also...but I need all the stomp I can get for those saber toothed sage rats when they jump into the light. Hahahahah

Luck

In my guide gun factory fodder 405 grain slugs run about 1230fps and are quite pleasant to fire. I hopped mine up to about 1700 fps with 405's and recoil really gets my attention.

Sorry but it is definitely not worth $900. Not really even close. Tom.

For a used 1895G, scope, etc around here that package would probably fetch $600 tops.


Since it has see-thru rings I would deduct another $100

I tend to agree after doing some research. I was at my local Gander Mountain today and found the same gun for $550 less scope. I finally sent the gentleman a email telling him he had to throw something else in the deal or I would have to pass. I think he is going to pass at least no response.

I do appreciate the comments. They helped me make a educated decision. I did learn something else. I would like to pick one up for a future bear hunt. If this deal does go through I will post a reply.

I saw a used Marlin 1895 at the local gunstore last week and the price tag was $475 dollars.

My 1895G was $499 NIB last year

I don't want to get a 450M VS 45-70 hoohaa going and I'm not dissing the Marlin as I have one I like very well, but I just picked up a Browning BLR in 450 M with two extra mags at a price I still can't believe...MUCH less than 1895M's or 1895G's are going for on the auction blocks. There is NO comparison between the two...like comparing a VW to a Mercedese 600...the BLR is so much more gun.

I missed a 1895M ported model about 3 years ago when I waited too long...I've been looking for a 450M...ANY 450M...ever since...THIS time I snatched it right off the dealers rack and whipped out the cash. He started laughing as he had just taken it in a couple day previous, put it back in the corner of the used rifle rack for me and just hadn't called me yet.

The barrel at the chamber is 1.17" OD, that means chamber walls ~0.330" thick compared to the ~0.100" walls in a square threaded 45-70 and the bolt is almost 1" in diameter...just MASSIVE compared to the "tiny" Marlin bolt.

If gunsmithing the BLR wasn't so difficult I would pick up a long action 300 WM and turn it into a 458 WM in a NY heartbeat.

Magazine length is the only fly in the ointment...2.60" is max in the 450 BLR but it could be loaded to 300 Win pressures without a hiccup...if I could find the right powder for the case.

I have a 45-70 barrel due Monday 5/23 for my Marlin swap barrel and will rechamber it to 45-90 to get the extra length and a bit of "freebore" or 450 Alaskan...and I plan on doing a 50 Alaskan if I don't do the 450 Alaskan first.

Now I (will) have TWO 45-70's - one is a NEF BC rechambered to 45-120 so I can shoot ANY 45-XXX case, a 450 M, a 458 American I can shoot 45-70, -90, -100 and 458 WM (loaded to <45LCUP) in, plus using 458 WM cases trimmed from 2.25" to 2.45" to fit the bullet cannelure...and I still have delusions of grandeur for doing a 499 HE swap barrel for my NEF Ultra receiver. You might say I like the 45 caliber.

There is just so many things you can do with the 45-70 AND 450M the simplistic arguments over the case capacities and published velo's are just ridiculous to me when I read them knowing what I've done and what ANYONE can do with those cases.

Luck

Gun show today....two Marlin 45-70 Guide guns, non ported, no scope or accessories, two different tables, $575 each.

Luck

My Marlin 45-70 is .925" OD at the chamber, that'd be about .212" wall thickness.

The BLR's aluminum receiver probably mandates more steel in the bolt/chamber walls.

Ain't nuthin' wimpy about the 1895 Marlin. My shoulder stops the loading progression before the rifle does.