Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Hunting Rifles "Busting the Magnum Myth" R. Seyfried

Here is a little offering from a fellow most should recognize.
He sums up a lot of what has been said by a few here. Its a good read and food for thought.

http://www.gunsamerica.com/blog/ross-seyfried-busting-the-magnum-myth/[/url]

As with most things in life, drilling them in the right place with a good projectile gets the deed done.

Not to worry though, there are still enough poop shoot drillers around that will be continually baffled as to why they can't get their gal pregnant.

There is more pure "wisdom" and experience wrapped up in that article than we can expound upon....

270 Winchester and Partition naysayers,take note.

Why I LMAO when I hear it doesn't "work"....for the real reason, look in the mirror....

Good article. Not exactly surprising, even from Ross.

I wish Seyfried would put all his writings in a book.


As much as I like the the 270 win though its no 30/06...

Dink

As much as I like the the 270 win though its no 30/06...

"DRT"

A book would be a great addition to the gun library. The sentiments of the article work just as well for the 30-06.

An excellent and very true article...

I learned what Ross Seyfried has written about the "hard way". I spent most of my 50+ hunting years using the first center-fire rifle I ever bought... namely a new Winchester Model 70 in .338 Winchester Magnum I bought in mid-1961 (obviously a "pre-'64" Model 70).

Back then, I dreamed of an Alaskan Kodiak bear hunt... which never happened, but was the reason why I bought the .338 Win. Mag. to start with.

Admittedly, the .338 Win. Mag. is a fine cartridge and I'm not a whimp when it comes to recoil, but that heavy-recoiling cartridge made even slightly MORE recoil-happy with my "hot" handloads kicked the snot outta me for over 40 years of big game hunting.

True, it put down deer and big moose with great ease, but it was never "easy" on my shoulder. While I loved to shoot, the big Winchester didn't give me a "break" and actually began to hurt me after shooting just 17 "hot" hand-loaded rounds off the bench-rest. But being "brave", I put up with it.

Finally, after one very long shooting session with the .338 during which a scope mount screw was sheared off and I ended up shooting over 40 rounds of heavy-recoiling, hunting loads in my attempts to sight the rifle in (but didn't know the screw was sheared off) before hunting season, I decided that "enough was ENOUGH" (recoil) and began to "campaign" to anyone who would listen for a new big game rifle.

I ended up with a pretty sore shoulder for the next two weeks... with my shoulder, upper arm and the right half of my chest all black & blue... deeply bruised from the .338's considerable recoil.

After listening to my complaining about my bruised body and seeing the "damage", my children and my bestest hunting buddy got together and gave me a pristine, like-new 1953 Model 99 Savage in .300 Savage caliber as a birthday present the following February.

I was happily surprised at receiving the classic, lever-action rifle with its rotary magazine and its fine, soft-recoiling .300 Savage cartridge that was more than "adequate" for the deer I then exclusively hunted which was a huge favorite of so many eastern deer hunters.

Once I shot this excellent deer rifle, the .338 was FOREVER "retired" to an honored place in my gun-safe. I'll never sell the .338 and, instead, shall pass it on to one of my sons, but I'll never hunt with it again.

Then, by chance, a year or so later... I happened on to a fine bargain in a used, but like-new rifle I've always truly admired and wanted to own since Bill Ruger first designed it, but I had always hesitated to put out the $$$ for a new one... namely the Ruger #1 International (aka "Ruger RSI")... and the one I found was a used, but beautiful little (39-inches overall length) single-shot rifle in like-new condition without a mark on its Mannlicher style stock or its deep blued barrel or action with a 20-inch barrel, great looking wood and a falling-block action in a really OLD, "tried & true" caliber... 7x57mm (aka "7mm Mauser" and ".275 Rigby") which, like the .300 Savage, performed far better with a well-placed "hit" on game than it's mild recoil indicated it would.

Now... several years later, I still wonder WHY I ever put up with the "beating" I took from the .338 Winchester Magnum when either one of these two current "big game rifles" would have taken the moose, elk or deer I hunted most of my adult life without the bone-jaring recoil I endured all those years when I sighted the big Winchester in each year prior to hunting season.

What is that old German saying?

"Too soon oldt, too late schmart...?"


Strength & Honor...

Ron T.

His experiences with the 140 Fail Safe in the 270. are completely different than I have seen.I have 3/4 of a box I won't use because of how they performed on Elk and deer.

It may be because they were very new when I got mine but it is the worst bullet I have ever used in the 270 Win.

Using Noslers a guy never has to experiment or wonder or especially,learn the hard way on Elk in very steep country.

Jayco

Good article with plenty of sage advice. I owned a 270 for a while and was rather enamored with it for reasons cited by Ross. I would expand that class of middling cartridges that kill well with today's bullets. I'd include anything based on the 30-06 case - wildcat or standard - and throw in about any 7mm magnum. If a 270 shooting 150 grain Partitions is good; a 'reasonable' 7 mag of some sort with a good 150/160 should be Nirvana. Recently finished my M70 SS Featherweight, sittin' in a McEdge, weighs a skosh more than 7.5 lbs and flings 140 Accubonds at 3200 into an inch. Will get around to 160 Accubonds this winter after seasons are over.

My hunting partner this year somehow managed to kill a dang nice bull with a 165 Accubond from a 30-06 moving at 2850 or so. I still think it bounced off

Seems like pretty common-sense stuff.

Find it pretty funny though, claiming you invented something just because you wrote about it first. I doubt 'his' RUM's beat Aubrey White's Imperial Magnums to production...they were built on factory Sako barreled actions and McMillan stocks with headstamped ammunition....not many real original ideas.

Bigwhoop: Mr. Seyfried is "right on"!
I could not agree with him more.
His experiences and observations exactly match mine (except I don't Hunt Africa).
It is not "bore diameter" or "foot pounds of energy" that KILLS Game - its proper bullet placement!
I have seen first hand, numerous times, where "magnumitis" advocates have wounded/lost game that should have easily been brought to bag. And I have seen numerous times where those afflicted with "magnumitis" have basically "wounded game to death" taking several shots to accomplsh slowly what could have been done quickly with one well placed shot from a manageable Rifle!
There was a fellow who used to post hearabouts that claimed the minimum caliber he would consider using on Mule Deer was a 340 Weatherby Magnum!
That type of mentality is breathtaking in its stupidity and is exactly what Mr. Seyfried is illustrating.
Excellent article and thanks for the link.
Hold into the wind
VarmintGuy

I remember reading that one a while back and thinking there was a lot of wisdom in it. It seems to me that the better that my shooting has gotten the better I can use a powerful rifle but at the the time I care less about power because my shooting is solid.

As for his suggestion to shoot a .270 Winchester with good bullets, a .270 with 150 grain bullets worked to perfection for me on a whitetailed buck this morning. The deer just dropped in its tracks.

Yes Varmint Guy, this spelled it all out plain as day. Forty years of wandering the gun aisles, hundreds of articles, now internet yakking and it comes down to this one article.

Great read! The 270 has always been my go to rifle, even though I have a safe full of Magnums. Just surprised to see Seyfried expound it's virtues with the right bullets and shot placement. It's always worked for me as long as I did my part.

Yes, sometimes we just make this stuff way too complicated.

Ross Seyfried has come to the same conclusion as others before him. Here are a couple earlier writers:

Jack O'Connor in an article on the 7x57 in Gun Digest 1974:

"I have some more news: game is not killed by foot pounds of energy. In fact, energy has little to do with killing power. Animals are killed by putting in the right place a bullet that penetrates deep enough and opens up adequately."

Finn Aagaard, concluding an article on killing power in Rifle in the 1990s:

"Proper bullet placement + sufficient penetration = quick, clean kill.

That, really, is all one needs to know about killing power."

I'm not buying it. Magnums have a place in my safe, and get used when needed. Plenty of hunting situations where a Magnum will out perform the 270 and 150gr Partition.

ok.. You sit on your ass for 5 days, and no shooter moose. Then on day 6 after you've convinced yourself that the area is devoid of big bulls, something of this size/variety steps out, head on, at 335 yards. He's standing on the edge of a swamp/lake. You don't have a boat, or a guide, so it's you going swimming if the moose does.

Would you rather have a 270 Win with 150gr Partitions or a 338rum with 225 Accubonds?

So your saying a 270 win won't break the shoulder on a bull moose?