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Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 30,971 Likes: 6
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 30,971 Likes: 6 |
Did I say that I like the 6.8
I got banned on another web site for a debate that happened on this site. That's a first
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Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 34,338 Likes: 10
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 34,338 Likes: 10 |
I cannot find any published/tested load data using bullet heavier than 150gr in the x39. There is s ton of user generated data that is of course untested and could be dangerous. Most of the data I found lists velocities around 2200-2270 with a 22 inch barrel. Convert that with QL to 16 inches and we get roughly 2160fps.
LoadData.com (Rifle Mag #117)lists an SKS (barrel length?)174gr load at 2092fps.
Give a man a fish and he eats for a day. Give a man a welfare check, a forty ounce malt liquor, a crack pipe, an Obama phone, free health insurance. and some Air Jordan's and he votes Democrat for a lifetime.
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Joined: May 2007
Posts: 13,957
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 13,957 |
Where did I say you'd get there with the anemic loads required for the SKS?
Hint: I didn't.
I have no idea WTF your issue is with this one, but damn....
The 7.62x39 IS capable of doing exactly what I said it would do loaded to it's potential IN AN AR or A BOLTGUN.
Why you have a hard-on to modify what I said, or what I said the parameters were to get there, I have no idea. I didn't modify anything you said. There are several different conversation going on here at once. Attempting to bring them all into an apples to apples comparison is fruitless. The "loaded to it's potential" is the subjective part that derails all of these comparisons, as we tread into "I'll go north of SAAMI, while you stay right there at SAAMI". I mean, hey.... let's take the 6.8spc north to NATO 5.56 pressure (62,000 psi) and see what she'll do. The military loaded the 6.8spc up to 58K, so we've got lots of potential, that the 6.8spc hasn't used up yet.
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Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 30,971 Likes: 6
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 30,971 Likes: 6 |
WOW! I like your new avatar
I got banned on another web site for a debate that happened on this site. That's a first
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Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 61,130
Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 61,130 |
Where did I say you'd get there with the anemic loads required for the SKS?
Hint: I didn't.
I have no idea WTF your issue is with this one, but damn....
The 7.62x39 IS capable of doing exactly what I said it would do loaded to it's potential IN AN AR or A BOLTGUN.
Why you have a hard-on to modify what I said, or what I said the parameters were to get there, I have no idea. I didn't modify anything you said. There are several different conversation going on here at once. Attempting to bring them all into an apples to apples comparison is fruitless. The "loaded to it's potential" is the subjective part that derails all of these comparisons, as we tread into "I'll go north of SAAMI, while you stay right there at SAAMI". I mean, hey.... let's take the 6.8spc north to NATO 5.56 pressure (62,000 psi) and see what she'll do. The military loaded the 6.8spc up to 58K, so we've got lots of potential, that the 6.8spc hasn't used up yet. JFC....
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Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 61,130
Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 61,130 |
Then, restrict them all to military issue ball ammo. I mean, the military uses only that stuff, so it's what you've got to base your opinions on, right? Can't handload anything in there that might increase performance, let alone do so safely.
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Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 61,130
Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 61,130 |
Glad to know I can't handload the .303 Brit up in single-shot rifles, or the .30-40 Krag up in the same, or the .280Rem up at all, or the .30-30 Winchester, .38-55, .45-70.... Heaven forbid you actually load a cartridge SMARTLY to it's potential in a rifle that is DESIGNED to take those pressures.
Damn.... what was I thinking?
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Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 10,185
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 10,185 |
"I mean, hey.... let's take the 6.8spc north to NATO 5.56 pressure (62,000 psi) and see what she'll do. The military loaded the 6.8spc up to 58K, so we've got lots of potential, that the 6.8spc hasn't used up yet."
With all the pressure problems it's already had, don't you think this is a stretch? I mean with all the hotrodding done these days and the internet to spread the word, someone would have done it by now if it could be done.
Not a nickles worth of difference...
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Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 34,338 Likes: 10
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 34,338 Likes: 10 |
and knowing Bill and Arne, neither would have any business setting a max pressure level. IE not enough knowledge there or testing equipment vs the bolts and pressures. Great folks and I loved doing some of Arne's test firing of the Grendel, but you have to have labs to set levels... Like I've said before, I've seen more than a few oddball bolt faces in the AR15 guns, but mostly 223 faces. Guess which one I've seen loose a lug? 223.... This is from Bill Alexander. Operating pressure is 50,000 psi
It is derived from the requirement for a complete durability cycle within the AR weapon system. Determination was from old fashioned fatigue analysis of the design and trials of the weapons. Ultimately the fielded rifles have the biggest effect as the fleet durability is what matters.Whatever that means?
Last edited by steve4102; 12/06/11.
Give a man a fish and he eats for a day. Give a man a welfare check, a forty ounce malt liquor, a crack pipe, an Obama phone, free health insurance. and some Air Jordan's and he votes Democrat for a lifetime.
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Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 18,342 Likes: 1
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 18,342 Likes: 1 |
Did I say that I like the 6.8
it seems like a nice round, I am glad you like it. 
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Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 30,971 Likes: 6
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 30,971 Likes: 6 |
Did I say that I like the 6.8
it seems like a nice round, I am glad you like it. Thank you
I got banned on another web site for a debate that happened on this site. That's a first
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Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 57,494
Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 57,494 |
and knowing Bill and Arne, neither would have any business setting a max pressure level. IE not enough knowledge there or testing equipment vs the bolts and pressures. Great folks and I loved doing some of Arne's test firing of the Grendel, but you have to have labs to set levels... Like I've said before, I've seen more than a few oddball bolt faces in the AR15 guns, but mostly 223 faces. Guess which one I've seen loose a lug? 223.... This is from Bill Alexander. Operating pressure is 50,000 psi
It is derived from the requirement for a complete durability cycle within the AR weapon system. Determination was from old fashioned fatigue analysis of the design and trials of the weapons. Ultimately the fielded rifles have the biggest effect as the fleet durability is what matters.Whatever that means? Like I thought
We can keep Larry Root and all his idiotic blabber and user names on here, but we can't get Ralph back..... Whiskey Tango Foxtrot, over....
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Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 34,338 Likes: 10
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 34,338 Likes: 10 |
What the hell is "old fashioned fatigue analysis"? Sounds like, Load em until it breaks, then guess where that breaking point is?
Give a man a fish and he eats for a day. Give a man a welfare check, a forty ounce malt liquor, a crack pipe, an Obama phone, free health insurance. and some Air Jordan's and he votes Democrat for a lifetime.
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Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 57,494
Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 57,494 |
Makes you wonder. Arne would not do anything like that. If it was up to him, he'd have it tested out.
Bill though, well I just ain't sure about taht part...
We can keep Larry Root and all his idiotic blabber and user names on here, but we can't get Ralph back..... Whiskey Tango Foxtrot, over....
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Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 24,670 Likes: 1
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 24,670 Likes: 1 |
JWP and I have talked about this at length.
I have very little complaints about the 7.62x39, but the fact is, the 6.8 out-classes the 7.62x39 in every category; I consider the 6.8 to be about �state of the art� for an assault rifle. However, due to the exceptionally low cost of the 7.62 ammo, I choose the 7.62x39 because it does anything I will ask of it (I�m not TOO demanding) and does it WAY on the cheap. I�m not a big AR guy, I�ve always liked the AK for several reasons. If they could ever re-design the mag well on the AR to dump that POS straight, then curved magazine, I�d maybe jump on board. I can hit everything I want out to 400 yards with cheapo Russian ammo, so I�m GTG. Plus I use the finest magazine ever made; Bulgarian synthetic circle 10�s.
JWP is pretty happy with his 6.8 and hasn't had a lick of trouble. I'm betting in any shootin contest with his AR and my AK, he'd hand me my arse on a silver platter (he has class ya know); but at twice the price.
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Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 57,494
Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 57,494 |
Oh, I don't know if you can discount the x39 when reloaded and tweaked for accuracy... you could ask a coyote on the otehr side of 550ish about it, well actually not since he/she is deceased from the X39 in an AR of my nephews(that'll teach him to walk away from the gun to chase a bunny rabbit.....)
We can keep Larry Root and all his idiotic blabber and user names on here, but we can't get Ralph back..... Whiskey Tango Foxtrot, over....
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Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 18,342 Likes: 1
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 18,342 Likes: 1 |
those Arsenal AK's look pretty good.
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Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 30,971 Likes: 6
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 30,971 Likes: 6 |
There is no such thing as a good looking AK IMHO
I got banned on another web site for a debate that happened on this site. That's a first
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Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 34,338 Likes: 10
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 34,338 Likes: 10 |
Oh, I don't know if you can discount the x39 when reloaded and tweaked for accuracy... Here is my x39 tweaked for accuracy. ASI conversion with true .308 bore. ![[Linked Image]](http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y17/steve4102/IMG_0593-1.jpg)
Give a man a fish and he eats for a day. Give a man a welfare check, a forty ounce malt liquor, a crack pipe, an Obama phone, free health insurance. and some Air Jordan's and he votes Democrat for a lifetime.
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Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 18,342 Likes: 1
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 18,342 Likes: 1 |
What no love for the worlds most popular rifle? Sadly our pampered lifestyles build no appreciation for its inner beauty.
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