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#6197141 - 02/20/12 05:45 AM Re: Highly Customized Turkey Shotguns; What Do You Run? [Re: BlueK9]
Magnumdood Offline
Campfire Outfitter

Registered: 08/08/02
Posts: 8970
Loc: Working my way back to Texas
Originally Posted By: BlueK9
80-90% in the 10" @ 40yds. Really!!?? Even with 18 g/cc tungsten, which you said you shoot, I only average about 50% in the 10 with a .665". That's with #8s which tend to pattern a little tighter than the #9s from my experience. I consider a good, broadly effective pattern to yield to a 40yd pattern of 45% in the 10" and another 40% in the 20".

Personally, I like the #9s as either will kill as far as 99.9% would consider and it allows me to open the choke (.670") a bit and larger patterns yet still get 100 in the 10 to 70yds.

Using your 10ga, how much shot are you throwing? I assume you're going something like 2.25oz and shooting #8s or #9s. Otherwise, why not just shoot a 12ga. Yes?

So, you're getting something like 450 and 640 pellets with #8s and #9s, respectively, in the 10" at 40yd, assuming the low end (80%) of your estimate. I've never heard or seen anything like that before. I can't imagine getting to those percentages with lead, or 13g (Hevi-13) or 15g (Federal HW) shot. All I can say is you're consistently getting 80-90% @ 40yd is you're ready for the NWTF championships. You'd beat the best 2-3X over. Just sayin'...


I load 2 oz of #4 Tungsten, with 30 grains of filler over 34 grains of STEEL with the accompanying felt to get the shot & filler right to the top and then crimp.

With regard to the NWTF championships, I know the top shooters and I'm not worthy of cleaning their shotguns after each flight.
_________________________
Ralph J.

PROUD NRA Lifetime Member



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#6197236 - 02/20/12 06:19 AM Re: Highly Customized Turkey Shotguns; What Do You Run? [Re: Magnumdood]
BlueK9 Offline
Campfire Regular

Registered: 03/02/06
Posts: 377
Interesting choice. There'd only be about 160 pellets in that load given the density. I'd have enough penetration to kill at 100yd+. A common rule of thumb with HTL shot, including tungsten, is patterns degrade by 30% every 10yd beyond 40yd. I've found that to be more or less accurate out to 70yd, but haven't patterned beyond that range.

Your load is good only to 50-55yd before density thins to 100 pellets in the 10" if that rule of thumb holds true. Of course, you may have an outlier there as I've never heard of any load that will consistently deliver 80-90% in the 10" at 40yd. I've had a few loads at 60% during summer dog days when temps are in the low- to mid-80s early in the morning with humidity levels over 80% and no wind -- essentially when the air is thinnest and most stable.

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#6198889 - 02/20/12 02:14 PM Re: Highly Customized Turkey Shotguns; What Do You Run? [Re: BlueK9]
Magnumdood Offline
Campfire Outfitter

Registered: 08/08/02
Posts: 8970
Loc: Working my way back to Texas
I had a 30" barrel honed by Denny Tubbs so there are no imperfections in the bore and the I.D. is consistent. I also had the barrel cryoed and then I coated the bore with UBC. Denny also machined a choke (also cryoed) for me that was made to go with the wad I use (TPS). In fact, I had everything metal in my SP-10 cryo-treated. I killed a Jake last year with it on the last day at 68 yards. I hit him once in the head and twice in the neck. I couldn't find any in the body.

It is true, the pellet count is awful low when you compare it to a lead payload, but the HTL shot patterns more consistently than lead with a higher % of the load staying in the center of the pattern.
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Ralph J.

PROUD NRA Lifetime Member



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#6199381 - 02/20/12 04:27 PM Re: Highly Customized Turkey Shotguns; What Do You Run? [Re: BlueK9]
Magnumdood Offline
Campfire Outfitter

Registered: 08/08/02
Posts: 8970
Loc: Working my way back to Texas
Originally Posted By: BlueK9
...you may have an outlier there as I've never heard of any load that will consistently deliver 80-90% in the 10" at 40yd...

A dubious statitician or college prof...
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Ralph J.

PROUD NRA Lifetime Member



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#6204655 - 02/21/12 07:28 PM Re: Highly Customized Turkey Shotguns; What Do You Run? [Re: Magnumdood]
BlueK9 Offline
Campfire Regular

Registered: 03/02/06
Posts: 377
Originally Posted By: Magnumdood
I had a 30" barrel honed by Denny Tubbs so there are no imperfections in the bore and the I.D. is consistent. I also had the barrel cryoed and then I coated the bore with UBC. Denny also machined a choke (also cryoed) for me that was made to go with the wad I use (TPS). In fact, I had everything metal in my SP-10 cryo-treated. I killed a Jake last year with it on the last day at 68 yards. I hit him once in the head and twice in the neck. I couldn't find any in the body.

It is true, the pellet count is awful low when you compare it to a lead payload, but the HTL shot patterns more consistently than lead with a higher % of the load staying in the center of the pattern.


This is why I found your choice of #4s curious. Frankly, you were very, very lucky to get that many pellets in him at 68yd with #4s given the likely pattern density. Yes, tungsten will pattern tighter, on average, compared to lead other HTL shot. However, it's not enough to overcome the fact that you're shooting #4s of 18g shot, which has far few pellets per ounce than lead.

Why not go with #8s or #9s? To me, and everyone else that I know who shoots tungsten, that's the whole point of going that direction -- dropping shot size to increase pattern density and still retain adequate penetration at extended range. Tungsten #8s offer adequate penetration to 90+yd and #9s to nearly 75yd. Why handcuff yourself with #4s?


Edited by BlueK9 (02/21/12 07:28 PM)

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#6204756 - 02/21/12 07:48 PM Re: Highly Customized Turkey Shotguns; What Do You Run? [Re: BlueK9]
Todd_Bradford Offline
Campfire Regular

Registered: 05/11/04
Posts: 631
Loc: Alabama
Quote:
This is why I found your choice of #4s curious. Frankly, you were very, very lucky to get that many pellets in him at 68yd with #4s given the likely pattern density. Yes, tungsten will pattern tighter, on average, compared to lead other HTL shot. However, it's not enough to overcome the fact that you're shooting #4s of 18g shot, which has far few pellets per ounce than lead.

Why not go with #8s or #9s? To me, and everyone else that I know who shoots tungsten, that's the whole point of going that direction -- dropping shot size to increase pattern density and still retain adequate penetration at extended range. Tungsten #8s offer adequate penetration to 90+yd and #9s to nearly 75yd. Why handcuff yourself with #4s?



Agreed. The whole point of shooting TSS is to drop down to small sized shot like 8's in order to get amazing pattern density without the penetration limitations you would normally suffer with number 8 lead shot. No doubt a TSS number 4 pellet would kill a turkey a hell of a ways out there if it hit a lethal spot but 4's just aren't going to hold a dense pattern nearly as far as 7's, 8's or 9's. So all that energy and power of a TSS 4 is pretty much rendered irrelevant because the pattern with 4's is going to fall apart waaaaaay before the individual number 4 pellets run out of lethal energy. TSS 8's or 9's will hold a lethal pattern way farther than the 4's and kill just as far as they will hold a tight enough pattern.

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#6207918 - 02/22/12 02:39 PM Re: Highly Customized Turkey Shotguns; What Do You Run? [Re: Todd_Bradford]
Magnumdood Offline
Campfire Outfitter

Registered: 08/08/02
Posts: 8970
Loc: Working my way back to Texas
I can't refute anything either of you've said. Hal asked me the same question when I ordered the #4 shot. Luckily, I have a good supply of #7.5 TSS I bought from the web-site while he was closing out his business. I also have several pounds of #5 TSS.
_________________________
Ralph J.

PROUD NRA Lifetime Member



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#6208075 - 02/22/12 03:17 PM Re: Highly Customized Turkey Shotguns; What Do You Run? [Re: prairie dog shooter]
MnFn Offline
Campfire Regular

Registered: 08/30/05
Posts: 422
Put a slip-on recoil pad on it-one of the hardest kickers I've owned. A Merkel 12 gauge.
o

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#6258285 - 03/06/12 06:54 AM Re: Highly Customized Turkey Shotguns; What Do You Run? [Re: MnFn]
yukonal Offline
Campfire Guide

Registered: 03/04/08
Posts: 3016
Loc: MN
Not really "highly customized", but I've killed...a bunch...of toms with it.

20 Enore Turkey Shotgun w/Aimpoint, and Bellm worked trigger. Factory choke for all but last years birds. I bought into the hype, and tried an Indian Creek.


Edited by yukonal (03/06/12 06:55 AM)
_________________________
Originally Posted By: archie_james_c
I should have just
bought a phucking T3...



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#6258851 - 03/06/12 09:13 AM Re: Highly Customized Turkey Shotguns; What Do You Run? [Re: yukonal]
Magnumdood Offline
Campfire Outfitter

Registered: 08/08/02
Posts: 8970
Loc: Working my way back to Texas
Glad you ended that 'yote's career of predation.
_________________________
Ralph J.

PROUD NRA Lifetime Member



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