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#6592554 - 06/14/12 Which .338 Barnes TSX for elk?
Tally_Ho Offline
Campfire Regular

Registered: 04/03/11
Posts: 259
Loc: Nebraska
In preparation for a late season Arizona elk hunt this November, I have been testing different loads in my .338 Win Mag. I would guess the shot distance would be typical of most elk hunts, 0-400 yds or so. The top two contenders are the 210 gr TTSX at 2835 fps and the 225 gr TSX at 2780 fps. Accuracy being equal, which would you utilize?

I'm not interested in other bullets, the topic of discussion is the Barnes TSX, thanks!

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#6592602 - 06/14/12 Re: Which .338 Barnes TSX for elk? [Re: Tally_Ho]
gunner500 Offline
Campfire Kahuna

Registered: 09/08/09
Posts: 23434
Loc: Oklahoma
210 TTSX.

Gunner
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#6592640 - 06/14/12 Re: Which .338 Barnes TSX for elk? [Re: gunner500]
Jordan Smith Offline
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Registered: 03/30/06
Posts: 7896
Loc: Calgary, AB, Canada
Any .338 TSX/TTSX will work wonderfully, but the TTSX gives me the warm fuzzies a bit more than does the TSX, from a design perspective. The TSX has worked flawlessly for me in the field, but I do believe the TTSX is an improvement.
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#6592647 - 06/14/12 Re: Which .338 Barnes TSX for elk? [Re: gunner500]
jorgeI Online   content
Campfire Kahuna

Registered: 06/20/03
Posts: 24439
Loc: Orange Park, Florida
Originally Posted By: gunner500
210 TTSX.

Gunner


yep. Never hunted elk but have hunted animals of similar size.
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#6592673 - 06/14/12 Re: Which .338 Barnes TSX for elk? [Re: jorgeI]
Tally_Ho Offline
Campfire Regular

Registered: 04/03/11
Posts: 259
Loc: Nebraska
Thanks for the replies, the TTSX seems to have a following! I was leaning that way but wanted to get some opinions. I have used the original Barnes X bullet on elk and mule deer and the TSX on whitetail, but have never harvested game with the TTSX, I think it may the winner.

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#6592684 - 06/14/12 Re: Which .338 Barnes TSX for elk? [Re: Tally_Ho]
gunner500 Offline
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Registered: 09/08/09
Posts: 23434
Loc: Oklahoma
Yessir, the 210 may have a slightly higher B.C., a bit flatter trajectory and wind bucking ability, plus less recoil, and in my limited experience, that bullet is more than enough for any Elk that ever walked.

I shoot the 225 TTSX's in my 338 WM to around 2800 with H-4350 powder, it's been so accurate I haven't tried another bullet.

Good Luck on your hunt.

Gunner
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#6592687 - 06/14/12 Re: Which .338 Barnes TSX for elk? [Re: Tally_Ho]
guyandarifle Offline
Campfire Regular

Registered: 06/13/08
Posts: 946
From what I've put through it the 210 TSX is my .340's favorite bullet. I've yet to want for more than it delivers.
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#6592705 - 06/14/12 Re: Which .338 Barnes TSX for elk? [Re: guyandarifle]
jstevens Offline
Campfire Regular

Registered: 10/26/06
Posts: 1060
I have no problem recommending a 210 TTSX, pretty much like everyone else. I load it normally with RL19 at about 2950 fps.

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#6592816 - 06/14/12 Re: Which .338 Barnes TSX for elk? [Re: jstevens]
mudhen Offline
Campfire Outfitter

Registered: 05/30/05
Posts: 9984
Loc: Boot Heel of New Mexico
I have switched to the 210 TTSX in both of my .338 Win Mags, although I have yet to shoot an elk with it. Maybe this year...
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#6592832 - 06/14/12 Re: Which .338 Barnes TSX for elk? [Re: mudhen]
65BR Offline
Campfire 'Bwana

Registered: 02/22/07
Posts: 12645
Loc: NW Louisiana
Can't knock the 210, but even in my former 338/06, I felt the heavier bullet was more efficient in it's case size, the 225 should pass up the 210 downrange w/little difference in drop.

Again, the 210 is proven, but I like middle/heavy weight bullets in larger capacity rounds as their trajectory is often fine at the speeds they run.

Flip a coin, sight in and bring a sharp knife wink
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#6592880 - 06/14/12 Re: Which .338 Barnes TSX for elk? [Re: 65BR]
Tally_Ho Offline
Campfire Regular

Registered: 04/03/11
Posts: 259
Loc: Nebraska
Thanks guys. I think the weight of the 225 vs. the B.C. of the 210 may be a wash at further distances in regards to drop, drift, etc.

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#6592884 - 06/14/12 Re: Which .338 Barnes TSX for elk? [Re: 65BR]
ghost Offline
Campfire Regular

Registered: 08/28/06
Posts: 806
Loc: Maryland
The 225s the only way to go, unless you can get a 250. I used the 225gr Ttsx in my 338/06 on Oryx (4 of them) in Namibia and a deer here. Work fine. Just punching a hole in something not the point. The 225s and 250s have a lot more energy, and hold their speed and trajectory better. I would never use a bullet that's almost as wide as it is long. The 338 originally designed to be used with 250 and 275s. The 225 Ttsxs are longer for their weight than a lead bullet, so have a BC equal to a 250gr lead based bullet, so work well..I loaded 225s in my 340 last year and was hunting Moose and Caribou with it, and got a caribou. Weather went south and we didn't get a chance on a Moose.
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#6592892 - 06/14/12 Re: Which .338 Barnes TSX for elk? [Re: 65BR]
prm Offline
Campfire Tracker

Registered: 10/27/08
Posts: 5345
Realize it was not one of the options, but for the sake of discussion, why not the 185 TTSX? I tend to hear faster is better for TTSXs. There is even discussion in the bullet energy thread that given two similar bullets the one traveling through flesh faster will do more damage. In the case of TTSXs, you're not going to cause bullet failure with speed, and while the heavier bullets will have more energy, I don't think there is much question about creating two holes regardless of 185/210/225, so why not the faster alternative? I'm actually curious to hear thoughts on this for a different rifle, but similar situation.

Given the OP's alternatives, I'd go 210. More than enough energy and a wee bit less recoil. There's no wrong choice here.

Edit: I did run these, and the 185 at 3000 FPS in JBM, and all of them will be over 2000 FPS at 500 yds if shot at any meaningful elevation. The 185 will stay faster, but only by 30-50 FPS by 500 yds.


Edited by prm (06/14/12)

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#6592899 - 06/14/12 Re: Which .338 Barnes TSX for elk? [Re: prm]
dvdegeorge Online   happy
Campfire Kahuna

Registered: 10/29/04
Posts: 17441
Loc: Western N.Y.
I'm rolling with the 185TTSX out of my .338-06 for my plains game huntin Africa come Sept.
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#6592959 - 06/14/12 Re: Which .338 Barnes TSX for elk? [Re: dvdegeorge]
ghost Offline
Campfire Regular

Registered: 08/28/06
Posts: 806
Loc: Maryland
I'm not much on using a bullet with a BC that's eqivalent to a patched round ball,in a modern rifle. Plains game animals mostly small, unless a Kudu, Zebra or Eland, so probably won't matter. But, when I was in Namibia, the shots STARTED at 200+ yards. Last year in RSA, had 3 shots over 250 yds, and 3 closer. Used a 308 and Ttsx 150s last year.

DVD, what load you using in your 338/06? and where you hunting in Africa?
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#6592985 - 06/14/12 Re: Which .338 Barnes TSX for elk? [Re: ghost]
prm Offline
Campfire Tracker

Registered: 10/27/08
Posts: 5345
Originally Posted By: ghost
I'm not much on using a bullet with a BC that's eqivalent to a patched round ball,in a modern rifle. Plains game animals mostly small, unless a Kudu, Zebra or Eland, so probably won't matter. But, when I was in Namibia, the shots STARTED at 200+ yards. Last year in RSA, had 3 shots over 250 yds, and 3 closer. Used a 308 and Ttsx 150s last year.

DVD, what load you using in your 338/06? and where you hunting in Africa?


Even the .338 185 TTSX has a better BC than a 30 cal 150 TTSX. Not exactly equivalent to around ball...

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#6593002 - 06/14/12 Re: Which .338 Barnes TSX for elk? [Re: ghost]
dvdegeorge Online   happy
Campfire Kahuna

Registered: 10/29/04
Posts: 17441
Loc: Western N.Y.
Quote:
DVD, what load you using in your 338/06? and where you hunting in Africa?
RSA North Eastern Kalahari area so 200 to 300 yd shots are very possible
185 gr TTSX 57 gr R-15 @ 2920fps
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#6593021 - 06/14/12 Re: Which .338 Barnes TSX for elk? [Re: prm]
Tally_Ho Offline
Campfire Regular

Registered: 04/03/11
Posts: 259
Loc: Nebraska
prm, regarding the 185's, my thoughts are if I were to drop that low in weight, I might as well be using a .300. The 210 TTSX has a higher BC than the 225 TSX due to the BT and boat-tail design, I think it may be a good compromise between "light" and "heavy", though I'm quite sure the 185's would be more than adequate too.

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#6593024 - 06/14/12 Re: Which .338 Barnes TSX for elk? [Re: prm]
ghost Offline
Campfire Regular

Registered: 08/28/06
Posts: 806
Loc: Maryland
prm: was about to say, BS, but checked Barnes site, and it seems you're right. But, still, a 338 anything, was designed to be used with long heavy bullets. I just cannot imagine using a light weight bullet in a 338 anything. 225s should be minimum IMO.
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#6593037 - 06/14/12 Re: Which .338 Barnes TSX for elk? [Re: ghost]
Tally_Ho Offline
Campfire Regular

Registered: 04/03/11
Posts: 259
Loc: Nebraska
Ghost, how did the 150 perform?

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#6593083 - 06/14/12 Re: Which .338 Barnes TSX for elk? [Re: ghost]
Jordan Smith Offline
Campfire Outfitter

Registered: 03/30/06
Posts: 7896
Loc: Calgary, AB, Canada
Originally Posted By: ghost
prm: was about to say, BS, but checked Barnes site, and it seems you're right. But, still, a 338 anything, was designed to be used with long heavy bullets. I just cannot imagine using a light weight bullet in a 338 anything. 225s should be minimum IMO.


Modern technology was also not even a figment of the creator's imagination when the .338 was designed...
_________________________
"Others are happy to hit the rock, or maybe the dark spot on the rock. I wanna head shoot the mite clinging to the pubes on the left nut of the fly that's sitting on the black spot on the rock."

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#6593152 - 06/14/12 Re: Which .338 Barnes TSX for elk? [Re: Jordan Smith]
dvdegeorge Online   happy
Campfire Kahuna

Registered: 10/29/04
Posts: 17441
Loc: Western N.Y.
.338 185 TTSX BC .432 @ 2920 from .338-06

.308 180 TSX BC.453 @ 2650 from .30-06

I'll roll with the 185 TTSX from my .338-06
Dropping down weight with a TSX don't scare me as a matter of fact I prefer to do so BT/DT
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#6593231 - 06/14/12 Re: Which .338 Barnes TSX for elk? [Re: Tally_Ho]
ghost Offline
Campfire Regular

Registered: 08/28/06
Posts: 806
Loc: Maryland
Excellent. Killed a Kudu at 275 yds, 2 shots, as the Ttsx bullets, imo, don't seem to have the shock, if you will, of a lead based bullet. Hit it in the right shoulder, as it was coming down a hill, below us, and quarter L-R..bullet came out through the paunch on the left side. He kept walking, but went into some brush,then came back out going R-L and I hit him, again, right behind the left shoulder and out behind the right (classic double lunger) he kept walking and went into some more brush, and dropped dead about 50 feet in. I hit an Impala at 50 yds, almost face on. Bullet went in between the left shoulder and neck (actually hit the neck a few inches back from shoulder area) and came out about half way back on the right, and he was doa. One a waterbuck, would have been fine, but pH shouted, don't shoot, we want to use the sticks, as I was about to take a texas heart shot on a Waterbuck at 25 yds...before I could recover he went over the hill, and we trailed him up and again, I'm on the sticks and putting the last bit of pressure on the trigger, when I'm told "hurry", which caused a jerk, and hit him in the rear of the ribs, though had the sight right on the back edge of the shoulder. He took off (about a 100 yds shot) and we followed him up and got another shot in at 25 yds or so, when he was standing in some brush. He turned and went into the brush, and we couldn't track him, and it was getting dark, but we found him maybe a 100 feet away in the morning. The bad shot placement was the cause of it not working here. I think had I taken the Texas heart shot on the Waterbuck, the bullet would have gone end to end. Indeed, the PH said he didn't like the Ttsxs, as they penetrated "too much". We shot a small warthog too, but with the 150gr BT bullet, at about 50 yds. Hit right behind the left shoulder, and out the other side, and he literally flipped onto his back. I had my 308 sighted in 2 1/2 inches high at a 100 yds, and was able to hold right on, on the long shot on the Kudu. I did miss a Blesbok at 400, because I underestimated the range (400 yds, vs my guestimate of 350) and the bullet went right under it, but in line with a behind the shoulder shot.

I shot 18 animals in Namibia in 2009, and used the 140gr Ttsx in my 280, and everything I hit (not all of it with the 280), was slammed and down now.

When I was talking about the light weight 338 bullets was thinking more along the line of the lead based ones. Talked to Ty at Barnes, and he said the 308 150 has one more "groove" in it than the 338 bullet, which causes the BC to be lower.

DVD, saw your note on the 180 in the 06. I never go that heavy as unless hunting something like Elk, is too heavy (IMO) to open right on deer. I used 165s on Kudu and Eland in my 06 and they worked fine (used Nosler partitions). My buddy Elmer Keith designed the 338/06 (333OKH same thing with 33 caliber bullets) and wanted LONG heavy bullets for penetration. His criteria was a bullet going in behind the ribs on the left side, had to be able to reach the right front leg. The Ttsx and TSX both seem to have enough penetration, at least in the 225s. Elmers favorite bullet for the 338/06 (lead based of course) was the 275gr Speer.

An intersting project would be to take a pillow case, and fill it tight full of wet grass and twigs, and back off 50-100 yds and see it the bullets will penetrate it.



Edited by ghost (06/14/12)
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#6593322 - 06/14/12 Re: Which .338 Barnes TSX for elk? [Re: ghost]
dvdegeorge Online   happy
Campfire Kahuna

Registered: 10/29/04
Posts: 17441
Loc: Western N.Y.
I did better than a pillow case... Hog at 170 yards DRT

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