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#7075081 - 11/14/12 10:49 AM Re: 300 AAC Blackout [Re: jimmyp]
clark98ut Offline
Campfire Outfitter

Registered: 01/30/06
Posts: 7542
Loc: Liberty Hill, TX
Originally Posted By: jimmyp
I struggle with the concept of a 1-8 twisted 30 cal.


The Noveske barrel on my rig is actually 1:7"...

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#7075282 - 11/14/12 11:53 AM Re: 300 AAC Blackout [Re: clark98ut]
rost495 Offline
Campfire Oracle

Registered: 01/05/05
Posts: 35280
Loc: La Grange, TX
There always can surface a bit of what is ignorance of what can and does work. Ignorance is not meant in a derogative term, simply the truth.

I"ve run 52 grain BTHP in 223 in a 6.5 twist with no issues around 3350 fps.... Most would think that would torch the bullet instantly... does just fine and plenty accurate thank you.
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#7075736 - 11/14/12 02:31 PM Re: 300 AAC Blackout [Re: rost495]
jimmyp Online   content
Campfire 'Bwana

Registered: 11/28/03
Posts: 11215
Loc: Georgia
how many benchrest guns are twisted that fast Jeff? I think Bill Wilson and Savage are right on this one.
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#7075791 - 11/14/12 02:48 PM Re: 300 AAC Blackout [Re: jimmyp]
rost495 Offline
Campfire Oracle

Registered: 01/05/05
Posts: 35280
Loc: La Grange, TX
Who needs a bench gun when they can shoot a highpower rifle?

Point is, you don't know what you are talking about on this one. You don't twist for a caliber... you twist for the bullet and velocity you are chasing...


And I'm not flaming ya either, its pretty much exactly what the benchresters do. You match the bullet length mostly, to the MV, to get your twist. They don't over stabilize at all because they shoot very short range shots, others like us tend to overdo it a hair because where BR stops mostly is whwere we start mostly and head on towards 1000 yards there so stability is key.

Where an 8 twist 30 cal might be ignorant in a 300 wtby driving 150 grain bullets( some folks believe in light bullets for some reason) the same twist isn't with a slow 240 grain 30 cal. And vice versa the slow twist for trhe 300 wtby, would leave the 240 slow 30 cal almost tumbling as it left the barrel.
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May the road rise to meet you, May the wind be always at your back, May the sun shine warm upon your face, The rains fall soft upon your fields and, Until we meet again, May God hold you in the palm of His hand.

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#7075828 - 11/14/12 02:58 PM Re: 300 AAC Blackout [Re: rost495]
jimmyp Online   content
Campfire 'Bwana

Registered: 11/28/03
Posts: 11215
Loc: Georgia
so exactly what you just said pardner. You twist for bullet and velocity...and they have put a 1-8 twist in a gun that runs both supersonic bullets and 220 grain subsonic bullets and call it good.
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#7075967 - 11/14/12 03:48 PM Re: 300 AAC Blackout [Re: jimmyp]
tex_n_cal Offline
Campfire Kahuna

Registered: 12/30/02
Posts: 15003
Loc: Back in Texas, for good!
I believe I let the shot go too high on the doe I lost, shot with the .300 and 220 Matchkings. Not a bad shot - a bang flop with a .270 IME, but it sure didn't work in that case. Realize if sighted for 100 yards, the bullet - even one as streamlined as a MK, will have enough trajectory to be 4" high at 50 yards, and the shot was at about 60 yards. If I try it again, I need to be exacting on placement, in the heart or just over it. I dunno, maybe the Berger would be a better choice too, even though neither bullet is designed for game at those velocities.

I still like the gun/cartridge, but I may go for a Noveske 1:7 stainless barrel, just to get a little more twisty. Maybe I'll even give 240's a try at subsonic speed.

The other comment I would make, though, is I read the .300 is the equal of the 7.62x39. I'll say, not exactly - since the Rooskie round will drive 123's as fast as the .300 will run 110's. Neither of them equal to a .30-30, which even in a lever action will drive 160's to the high 2300's - and even higher in a strong action.

I kinda like the idea of the 7.62x40, but have seen no barrels suitible for subsonic heavy bullets.


Edited by tex_n_cal (11/14/12 03:50 PM)
Edit Reason: grammher :(
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#7076022 - 11/14/12 04:07 PM Re: 300 AAC Blackout [Re: rost495]
jimmyp Online   content
Campfire 'Bwana

Registered: 11/28/03
Posts: 11215
Loc: Georgia
I will concede I know nothing about nothing, on the other hand I also stubbornly believe a Jack of all trades is a master of none.

rsilvers will drive by soon to set me straight!

If someone could point to a single thing other than subsonic it would do head and shoulders better I would go out and spend $900 on an AAC upper!


Edited by jimmyp (11/14/12 04:23 PM)
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#7076521 - 11/14/12 06:32 PM Re: 300 AAC Blackout [Re: jimmyp]
rsilvers Offline
Member

Registered: 11/05/09
Posts: 60
Originally Posted By: jimmyp
I struggle with the concept of a 1-8 twisted 30 cal.


The latest research is that 1:8 twist is a good thing even for 308 - because it helps the bullet expand by the rotational force, and improves terminal effects. Also, there is some evidence that it helps the bullet survive the transonic boundary and increases the ability to shoot much longer range.

So I would use 1:8 or 1:7 even for full power 308.

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#7076527 - 11/14/12 06:34 PM Re: 300 AAC Blackout [Re: tex_n_cal]
rsilvers Offline
Member

Registered: 11/05/09
Posts: 60
Originally Posted By: tex_n_cal
The other comment I would make, though, is I read the .300 is the equal of the 7.62x39. I'll say, not exactly - since the Rooskie round will drive 123's as fast as the .300 will run 110's.


300 BLK has 16.7% more energy than 7.62x39mm at 300 meters. There is not a single 7.62x39mm factory load which is more powerful than 300 BLK past 120 yards. I have posted much proof of this before, along with photos, but it is a pain to re-locate this stuff that I have said in the past each time it comes up.

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#7077221 - 11/15/12 04:46 AM Re: 300 AAC Blackout [Re: rsilvers]
tex_n_cal Offline
Campfire Kahuna

Registered: 12/30/02
Posts: 15003
Loc: Back in Texas, for good!
well...

644 ft-lbs at 300 yards:

http://www.hornady.com/store/7.62X39-123-gr-ZMAX-Steel-Case/

and their .300 whisper load, 622 ft-lb at 300 yards:

http://www.hornady.com/store/300-Whisper-110gr-vmax/

But I'll agree it's a lot easier to find good .308 bullets than .310-.312. And the cartridge itself is a better for the AR platform. That's what I'm keeping for a house gun, and I do like the cartridge.

But the 7.62x39 is a bigger case, although held to lower pressures. I wouldn't try it in an AK or even an AR, but a strong action could be warmed up even further.
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