Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Single Shots School me on the 1885 45-70

I have been thinking of getting a 45-70 in a Winchester or Browning 1885 and have a few questions. Is there much difference between the quality of a Winchester and Browning? What does the recoil compare to. I plan on shooting open sight only. Sorry if this has all been covered before.

There's no difference in quality between the Browning and the Winchester, they were/are built in the same Miroku plant, roll marks on the barrel being the biggest difference.
Some of the early Brownings did not have a tang, the current crop of winchesters all have a tang that is drilled and tapped for a tang sight.

Isnn't the wood different? The ones from winchester I see are nowhere near as fancy as the Brownings.

1B

Browning started selling a Japanese-made High Wall copy, the B-78, in the 1970's, including one variation in .45-70. It was discontinued after a few years, then re-introduced as the 1885 model a few years later, with a slightly different design and lawyer-proof trigger. A low wall version came later, as did several other variations.

I have a original B78 in .25-06, and killed my first deer with it. It is funny-looking, but superbly accurate.

A few years ago Browning decided to sell some with Winchester brands. Most have lesser quality wood than the Brownings. The Traditional Hunter Models, both High & Low Wall, came with tang sights. The Low Wall, obviously, was never sold in .45-70

Some of their design decisions leave you scratching your head, but they are very well made, with good barrels. I can think of at least 4 different variations of .45-70 High Walls, made by Miroku

There are other highwalls of course, and most of the others are true (or mostly true) to the original 1885 Winchester. The current production Winchesters and Brownings are completely different from originals - when you look under the hood.

There are some advantages to the traditional style and some cosmetic differences that I also happen to prefer, but the new made Wins and Brownings do shoot well. Very very well.

Strangely, if you want a new Win highwall that is the most authentic, you do not want to buy a Winchester. This is a sign that The End must be near...

I would get one from C. Sharps. Theirs are very close to an original Winchester, and you can order what you want in the way of stock shape, barrel shape/length, sights (or none)--just like you could with an original 1885!

As to recoil. Well, I for one don't enjoy shooting ANY .45-70, and wouldn't get one for that reason. Lots of people feel differently, but I'd find one you can shoot a little before investing in one. (I have several single shot rifles that were ORIGINALLY .45-70s, the original owner shot them a few times and sold them off cheap. I bought them and rebarreled them into more shoulder-friendly calibers....).

But do keep in mind that if you are only using the gun for a couple of shots a year at big game, you won't notice the recoil when you are shooting at a critter...adrenaline is a great anesthetic! But the original sighting-in session can cause a flinch that lasts a while and affects your shooting of other guns.

I suggest if you order a Hi-Wall from C. Sharps, you get one with the "shotgun" (flat) buttplate. Spreads the recoil around and allows a slip-on recoil pad for sighting-in sessions.

CSharps
Meacham
Ballard Rifle Company
Wyoming Armory

All of these make excellent copies of the originals. In fact their parts can be dropped right into an original action and pick up where the old ones left off w/o missing a beat.

I own a Ballard/Wyoming Armory hybrid rifle that I like very much as my custom target highwall. I also have an orginal highwall and two original lowwalls.

Uberti also makes a copy of the highwall but where it sits relative to the others I'm not quite sure. It looks a little more like an original than the current Win/Browning, but not sure about the guts.

I wonder where this will show up?

1B I think the grade of the wood is about the same, but the Brownings carry that varnished finish , while the Winchesters are mor of an oil finish.

Good question Brent, and will there ever be any new topics, or do we just keep this one going with considerable thread drift as necessary.

I think we can keep this thread going like a lifeboat for as long as we want, but starting another - can't happen. Might have just been a forum-operator error that will get sorted eventually. Anyway, I hope the OP got something useful from this thread. He ought to drop down the BPCR thread though and pick up where he left off he has more questions.

Well that'll work, until that mysterious unidentified mod, clicks the delete forum button there......

fixed now

cool.

It's ALIVE!

Nothing like an digital phoenix.

So, rrd - what do you think? I assume this will be a hunting gun. Is it to be shot with black and lead or white and copper? Open sights = barrel sights I presume. I don't know what the modern barrel sights are like on a modern Win or a Browning.

Thanks for all of the information and I have no problem if the topic gets derailed.

I was just looking for something cool to have that I could also use to drop a deer with or maybe even use as a backup rifle elk hunting in the thick stuff. On the recoil I was just trying to get an idea where it was compared to others like the 300 WM or 338 WM. I have had both in the past and shot them a lot. I guess I'm not stuck on the 45-70 but it would be a good short range thumper.

Back on the recoil question, it will depend a lot on what the OP loads. Saying for the moment he gets one of the Traditional Hunter models with the curved buttplate, and shoots BP or BP-equivalent loads, with 300 to 400 gr bullets, most people would not find them objectionable in recoil.

The action could certainly take warmer loads, and the hotter you go, obviously the more they kick, and the stylish buttplate doesn't help. Maybe that's Miroku's sneaky way of keeping people from shooting heavy loads in them.

I'm running warm smokeless 300 gr loads in my .45-70 Ruger #1, that clock 2270 fps. They do get your attention, but not as heavy as say, a .375 H&H. The same loads I think are out of character for an iron-sghted High Wall.

I have had both the Browning and a Winchester marked model. The B was padded and had a shotgun butt- pleasant. The W was a Legacy model w/a steel crescent butt. The only rifle that I ever had that compared to it (with stiff loads) was a Ruger No. 3. It was wicked to use. Both were surprisingly accurate. Usually, the Brownings had better better wood, but that may not be so with later editions.

I just got a uberti 1885 45-70. I really like it except the sights will be replaced soon. Very mild recoil in the almost 9 lb rifle with low pressure loads. I loaded some 400 gr at high marlin lever loads. They thump a little but not bad

I've got one of the B78's in 45/70. It's an absolute pleasure to shoot..

Here is a NIB in Oregon for sale... The price he's asking appears to be high, but if you throw in the bases and the other items, the price is actually low for a NIB B78.. I'd be all over this hadn't I already had one..

http://www.northwestfirearms.com/rifle-classifieds/91541-browning-b78-45-70-new-box.html