Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Competitive Shooting Action Preference?

When I was shooting silhouette Remington bolt guns ruled the line but from time to time when I shot highpower more often than not the bolt guns were Winchesters.Comments please.

Hi...you are probably correct on the win/rem action thing. The reason is, I think, because Rem once only offered the 40-X for XC. I`ve shot one for close to 20 yrs. now. And the 40-x was, and still is, expensive. Rem dose have alternitives now for a new shooter to start with a bolt gun without breaking his bank. Win. the same. Most Win. I saw on the line were of course Mod.70`s on 06. some rechambered to 308. My buddy went with a SA Win chambered for .223. built from a varmiter. Don`t know the Model.
Short and sweet, Winchester did offer more in the way of options for a bolt shooter than did Remington.

The Winchester M70 offered several advantages over the Remington M700 or 40X.
1) The bolt handle is longer and better placed for better cycling...especially during rapid fire.
2) The M70 offers better camming on the bolt again offering easier cycling.
3) Some feel that the M70 has a better extractor (both in Pre-64 and Post-64 forms. Better reliability in cycling rapid fire. (One of the common modifications of the M700 is fitting a Sako Extractor making it similar to a Post 64 M70!)
4) The folk shooting M700's or 40X's often have to load their magazine very carefully to ensure proper feeding.

The current 40X stock ended up being something that is proving none too appropriate for Highpower Position shooting.

With that said, the M700 is cylindrical and marginally easier to true up. It also has an advantage in bolt lug bearing area.

There's an article out there with a more indepth analysis than I just provided...I'll see if I can dig it up.

Here are some of the reasons the M70 was used more than the M700 or 40X;
1) The M70 Bolt handle is longer and better positioned for cycling in rapid fire.
2) The camming is more gradual in the M70 again giving easier cycling for rapid fire. This also helped in primary extraction.
3) Winchester had a longer history in Match Rifles for Highpower Rifle dating back before WWII.
4) The 40X bling magazine seems more finicky and takes some working to make it work properly.
5) The M70 extractor (both Pre and Post 64) are more confidence inspiring than the M700 or 40X (one of the most common modifications of the M700 is installing a Sako extractor).
6) The current 40XNM stock is not especially suited for Highpower Rifle position shooting.

On the flip side of the coin perhaps for Silhouette and BR.
The M700 is cylindrical and lends itself to truing a bit easier.
The M700 has greater locking lug bearing area.

There's an article with a more indepth analysis between the M70 and M700 out there. I'll see if I can dig it up.

To add to Chris' post about the 700 for Silhouette and BR

- The 700 is lighter than the M-70 (bot BR and Silhouette have weight limits)
- The 700 has always been the top dog of commercial actions in competitions where the "Nth" degree of accuracy is the most important characteristic


I think the most important reason that we see more Wins in Highpower and Rems in BR has much less to do with the performance of either action and more to do with what folks "fell into".

The M-70 was introduced in 1937 and was the most reliable and accurate rifle of the time so it quickly established dominance in Highpower. The Rem action came along in 1948, which was a little after Benchrest started to be competed. The 222 Rem in the M-722 was such an accurate combination that it quickly began to dominating BR.

As each respective discipline evolved, they built on the M-70 in Highpower and the M-722 (then the very similar M-700/40X) in BR. All the aftermarket parts and expertise were with the M-70 in Highpower in M-700 in BR, so when you wanted to get into the sport, your best chance of success was to start with what everyone else was using.

BTW, the primary reason most 700/40X BR rifles use a Sako extractor is because of the 6mm PPC. The 6 PPC has become the dominate chambering in little BR, and it has a non-standard bolt face size. Rem does not make a bolt face or extractor that fits the 6 PPC rim, so you must use a Sako extractor to use the PPC.

IIRC, Silhouette came to the US (seriously) in the 1960s. The first national competition was held near Tucson at the range where I shoot in 1969. Because of their success in BR, Rems had established themselves as the "accuracy standard" all other rifles were judges by. Guys could go buy an off-the-shelf 700, scope it, make weight, and be very competitive. This is not to say an off-the-shelf M-70 (espeically a PF M-70) wouldn't work, it's just guys started with the Rems, got used to them, and had no reason to change.

Rems beat out the M-70 as the Marine Sniper rifle in 1969 and have kept that position since. I think the Marines could do better today with an aftermarket action, but I think they have become so used to the 700/40X they see little reason to change. I think because the USMC uses the 700/40X, it was a natural progression for tactical rifles to start with the 700/40X given tactical competiton is kind of based on the military sniper craft.

Interestingly, before David Tubb switched to custom actions, he used appears to have used a M-70 in Highpower and a M-700 in Silhouette. Truth be told, either action will work for either application, but both are surpassed nowadays by custom actions.

Interesting replies guys Thanx.

My heavy/unlimited rifle was a Remington 700 7/08 but my hunter rifle is a pre 64 M70 270Win.If the truth be known even though I shot the 7/08 for a long time it was a lot more fun to shoot the M70 deer gun.BTW the 135MK is a dandy silhouette bullet in front of H4895.