Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Ask The Gunwriters If you would, powder question for Muledeer.

Hey John, I noticed another fellow asked a question concerning all the new powders that are out and how you guys are trying to break it down to using only a few. Keep it simple sort of way. After reading the post and seeing that some of you also have older discontinued powders and are trying to use it up I also have a can of discontinued powder and I don't know where I picked it up at, but would like to use it rather than just destroy it. I have quite a bit of it, it's Winchester 452AA. I've looked at the burning rate charts and it's sandwiched between HP-38 and 231 and we all know these two are identical. Question is,,it looks like it could be used in a handgun application and here are the handgun calibers that I own. .38 Special/.357 magnum, .44 magnum, .44-40, 10mm, .45acp. Can I use this powder in any of these and do you have any load data for any of these. Thank you very much. RRM

RRM,

Not Mule Deer, (obviously..) But W-W used to publish free powder booklets periodically. I think I have a collection around here somewhere. I'll give it a look and see. but at one time, IIRC, they did publish data for handgun with 452AA. Many years ago, when I shot a lot of Trap, I used that. I just discovered an unopened 3 lb keg of it, so I need to look up the data, anyway... I shall report back.

GH

Here's my never-fail method for testing handgun "mystery" powders:

Using .38 Special cartridges fired in a strong .357 revolver, load a few rounds of the mystery powder using Bullseye START data. Chrono them and compare velocity to what Bullseye would have given. If the velocity is about the same as for Bullseye, consider the mystery powder to be "Bullseye equivalent."

If velocity is lower, repeat the test with a few loads of mystery powder using Unique data.

If velocity is below what Unique would give, repeat test with Blue Dot data and finally with 2400 data, if required.

To be absolutely sure of things, begin the experiments by test-firing a few loads using actual Bullseye, Unique, etc to serve as a velocity baseline in YOUR gun.


BTW, If I recall correctly, 452AA was about the same as RedDot or GreenDot in burn rate and load data.

I use a lot of 452 in handguns. Load Data has lots of data mostly from the Speer #11 (of which I have at least 2 copies to be able to find it) so there is no real need to experiment beyond the book.

Grasshopper, RockyRaab & Clarkemyers, thank you very much. Now that you mentioned it,my brother used to shoot trap and that is probably where I got the three pound keg at. And I think you're right about the paper flyers that Winchester put out and I think I may have one laying around here somewhere, I'll look. Rocky, pretty neat way you have figured out on working up a load. I will write it down for possibly future reference. Thanks again. RRM

Thanks. I was forced to it. I used to get so many cans of "widow sale" reloading supplies that I had to find a way to safely find load data. Then as a writer, I'd often get samples of new powders - and of course needed to find safe loads.

Rat Rod,

I'm sure I have several old WW loading pamphlets, if you can't find yours, PM me.

RatRod,

I looked in my file of old powder booklets. I have 1st Ed, 1973, 2nd ed-1975, 1978 Ed, Editions #12, #13, and #14... And BION, NONE of them have data for pistol with .452AA.

The latter have data for WW-SuperTarget, and WW-SuperField. which I believe were replacements for .452AA, and 453AA.

I did check Speer #11 and hit paydirt! What calibers/bullet weights do you load for?

GH

452AA is excellent in the 45ACP. I used it for many years shooting IPSC. It burns cleaner than 231. I believe it was the powder used in factory AA Winchester 12 guage loads. Was replaced by WST (Win Super Target), I think. 452 AA is good stuff, wish I still had some! Shoot it up.

Son of the Gael, I found a Winchester loading booklet dated 1981 and it has 452AA listed, but not as a handgun component just shotgun loads. The handgun loads are with 231 and 296 only. Maybe when I visit my next gun show ( if they're still legal by then ) I'll look for a manual that has it listed like the Speer #11. Thank you all very much for helping me. RRM

http://books.google.com/books?id=lF...EwBQ#v=onepage&q=ww452aa&f=false

Try this link.

SEdge, Boy I sure appreciate the page out of that book. Gives me somewhere to start. And by the way (my small way of returning the favor) I have been playing around with my .44 magnum this past week and have come up with a very good load in my Ruger Redhawk. So if anyone is interested here it is,,, 18.5 grains of 2400, Hornady 240gr. XTP, Federal 150 primers with a loaded length of 1.600". Brass doesn't seem to matter as far as accuracy goes, maybe case life. I've got a Chrony set up about 12' from the muzzle and average around 1,240 f.p.s. I shoot 15 round groups off of a concrete bench, revolver resting in a sandbag front rest. More than one group of fifteen shots into 2" to 2 1/2", and this is counting all fifteen shots center to center of the two furthest holes. I don't know about you guys, but that is great for me. Give it a try sometime and maybe it will shoot good in your gun also. Thanks everyone. RRM

W452 is a great powder for 9mm, 45acp, 38 special and 12 gauge trap loads. I burned many pounds of it. Hodgdon sold the same powder under the name of Trap 100. I got most of my data for it out of old Winchester powder data books.