Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Hunter's Campfire Double body-weight squat

Well headed into the gym to try for a double body-squat. It has been a fitness goal since before I hurt my foot, and now I am back up to it. Will update upon return

A snippet from Corinthians 9:27 I like:

"I subdue my body and I enslave it"

A 2X bodyweight squat is a great fitness goal. Are you doing it "raw and ass-to-ankles"? Good luck! Stay tight! Chest up!

RS

Depends on your bodyweight...

Not really. No-neck retard-strong types may back-squat 495 but they tend to weigh 300# to be able to do it. I used to work with a guy like that. As a result of a one-rep max that went bad, really bad, he gets to get up in the middle of the night and thread a catheter up his pecker so he can piss. Caution is the watchword, and if you are getting under that much weight, without some coaching, or at least having read Mark Rippetoe's "Starting Strength", you may be threading something up your pecker very soon.

Before I attempted 2xbodyweight, I'd make sure my form was deadnuts and I'd make sure that I could do my bodyweight 20reps without racking the bar.

Just got back into the gym two weeks ago myself. Haven't lifted seriously since high school, but remember from then that double your body weight squat was the set goal for every player, bench goal was 100lbs over your body weight.

I got a ways to go but am enjoying getting back at it again.

Seems like you made my point. Your 300# No-neck retard-strong type lifting 495 is 105 short of his double body-weight squat.

I wonder who is the heaviest lifter to do 2X BW?

There is a chick at Westside Barbell that weighs 170 IIRC and can back squat 700#.

Want a tip?


Travis

I can't do my BW x2 more than once. That's pretty badass if you can.

But the number of men who can do 2xBW once AND do several muscle-ups is only a fraction of one-percent. That is a fact. Eat clean, don't get hurt, and keep doing what you are doing and you'll have a long productive life.

GREAT!!!! Now - on to 3x! 2X is a good goal, and achievable with a lot of hard work. (assuming it is raw - maybe wraps) Geared? Well, that's different.... The best thing is that you HAVE a goal, and are working well to get there. Better today than yesterday, regardless of the weight. Good job!

HAHAHAAHAHA!! yeah, right. I work out with a couple of guys who DO sqaut WELL over 495 raw. They are NOT no neck retards. The 300+ pounder is around 850 geared, around 2x raw. That's OVER 600 raw. Clean, no drugs. Just hard work, and a lot of intellect. They do not get hurt much, either. Gym rats are another story....

I think it is Robert Wilkerson. The lift was 1000, with wraps. Don Reinhoudt did 934 without wraps. Captain Kirk Karwoski did 1003 at 308, single ply. Pretty minimal suit, too. These are competition lifts. Gym lifts are higher.

Well the gym went very well, went in feeling great. Squat 330, which is double body weight exactly and had gas left in the tank. I got a little ambitious and tried for 350, and missed it. Should have stuck with 340 I guess

Oh this was raw BTW. No straps, belts, gizmos, pills, shakes, snake-oil. I need to get some lifting shoes

This was a big goal for me in the gym, next is 1000+ in the three lifts (Squat, deadlift, bench) I'm close right now, but deadlifts aggravate my foot so I'm partially stuck.

Oh and Tanner, I recall you posted about muscle-ups in my weight-lifting thread a ways back. Guess that makes two of us

How old are you George? Don't do things that you will pay for later in life my friend.

Just a whipper snapper in my early twenties.

I listen to my body, and never sacrifice form for a bigger lift. As to my foot, unfortunately I'm headed to the podiatrist on Monday

Benchman, I enjoy reading about fitness and nutrition but I'm not sure what you mean. Geared? Must be more than just a weight belt

Educate me please

I think he's talking about a suit/suspenders. Like a bench shirt. They basically do the same thing that draped chains do, sort of. You get some of the load at the beginning of the lift, and all of it as you extend. A bench shirt can and will kill you if you get in over your head without a spotter.

That is a fantastic lift. But my point about 2X BW is simple math.

If that chick weighed twice as much she would have to squat 1400#.

Am I missing something here? Anyone doing 2X or more is great, but I bet a higher percentage of smaller athletes can do that then the big guys.

I agree with you. It is much the same with a strict bodyweight shoulder press. Few men over 200# can accomplish it. I've never done it. 80% is the best I can do.

Here is Laura Phelps-Sweat. She's squatted heavier with a suit.

I weight about 212 and am 6'5". I doubt with my long limbs (and and 53 yo body) I'll ever be able to squat double my body weight.

But as I'm in the gym 3 days a week, I now have a new goal. Thaat and BP my own weight (I got skinny arms).

This stuff is for the younger people. Saying that my best friend of over 50yrs had a very successful Senior Olympics lifting career. Not saying us older folks shouldn't lift, the young ones just do better.
Youtube below is my Grandson bench pressing 400lbs when he was in high school. Being a college kicker, they do no full squats.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=loEzbqcd7dE

"Geared" is referring to a squat suit, knee wraps, and belt. I've 3x'd in gear in several competitions. Working up to competitions I would be squating 2x for 5-8 reps "raw" (no gear). Suits help some people more than others depending on their build and squating style. Belt and knee wraps seem to help everyone.

Generally lighter lifters are able to lift at a higher % of their body weight than heavier lifters.

Perhaps one of you lifters could explain to me the purpose of the big leather belts? I am not really sure what good they are?

There are squats, and then there are real squats. That video is impressive but I would be way more impressed if she used 1/3 less weight and went ass-to-ankles.

Congrats George on the 2X squat. You learned something about PR's today: One per day is enough. Now, back to working up through the next cycle. Good job!

RS

Indeed, I was so jacked up about making 330 and it felt so good, 350 seemed like it would be easy. Lesson learned

I'm just glad 330 felt great and my form was perfect. Well maybe I haven't learned too much about one-a-day PR's, after squats I PR'd on bench too.

Stay after it George and have a great Ortho guy around.

Artificial "mid-line stabilization", IOW that belt stabilizes your spinal column. Herniated discs don't do much for athleticism.

A fit, tight core/abdomen and a chest full of air will do nearly as well, and many opine you should skip the belt for all but the really heavy sets to develop the same.

True, and Mark Rippetoe would say the same, especially when one is training for personal strength, fitness and athleticism. For a competition however, you have to have a standard that a judge can see and validate, IE, the crease at the top of the hip goes below the top of the lifter's knee.

Congrats on your PR's. Lift smart and hopefully avoid some senseless injuries that plague some if us later in life from being too young and dumb earlier.

So my question is when working up to any of these lifts what is average for someone. Do the majority of people find squatting their own weight common or is it just the 2X BW that is a cool goal?

I am 295 to 305 in general and find no problem getting to 330 or 350. It seems like I can keep adding weight every week and not plateau. What weight should I begin to start to struggle with?

I been lifting since HS off and on but am no expert by any means?


Mack

We got in a little cardio together today scouting. Put several tough miles on the shoe leather, unfortunately I don't think it helped his ankle...

Here are the answers to that question, and the next, and the one after that......

http://startingstrength.wikia.com/wiki/Starting_Strength_Wiki

Thanks Take a Knee

Butch, Josh's accomplishments are outstanding !!!

Man, it's been a long long time since I could bench press 400lbs.

Umm, like never !! Two fifty would bring about need for a pucker string...

Mack, TaK is correct, check out Mark Rippetoe's starting strength.
As long as you can progress in a linear fashion, with excellent form, keep on keeping on. 5 pounds a workout until bar speed slows, and then start micro-loading. Food and rest are super important for progressing; also keep the boozing to a minimum (hint)

Indeed the walking didn't feel the greatest, but hopefully the witch-doctor has the remedy. Fingers crossed it isn't via needle

I'm happy to buy new boots, insoles, snake oil, widgets, or gizmos to permanently alleviate the issue.

LOL I have no designs on a 2X BW squat. I have bad knees from football and rugby I am just wanting to know when to sart to worry about weight being an issue as i life heavier.

From The Desk Of Clarence Bass
"If you don't bend those legs and do those squats, you'll never reach your potential."
Paul Anderson
Paul Anderson, King Of The Squat

World (1955) and Olympic (1956) weightlifting champion - and holder of all the world records at the time - Paul Anderson, the subject of an excellent new book by Randall J. Strossen, Ph.D., was probably the strongest man who ever walked the face of the earth.
�the 5'9", 363 pound �genial giant from Toccoa, Georgia

Having seen Anderson lift five times, I can testify first hand that he was the real thing. My father and I were in attendance at the 1955 national weightlifting championship in Cleveland when Anderson burst on the scene, doing 436 1/2 in the clean & jerk and totaling 1145, both American records and more than any other man had done before.
[�]
Unequaled Squatting Power
What impressed me (and many others) even more than his official lifts, however, was Paul Anderson's still unequaled prowess in the deep knee bend or squat. Outshining his historic performances in the Olympic lifts, Dr. Strossen writes, "[Anderson's] squatting ability surpassed anyone's wildest dreams...He was getting close to squatting double what the record had been before he assaulted it." At a time when the world record was around 650, Anderson was doing 900 pounds for reps in exhibitions. He eventually squatted 1160 before reputable witnesses at Muscle Beach and again on The Ed Sullivan Show before a national television audience. Pressed for his all-time best, Anderson told Strossen, "I did 1200 face value with no reservations whatsoever." As to doubting Thomases, he said, "My squatting power was never challenged or no one ever disputed it after they saw me do, say, 10 reps with 800"--which he did many times as a guest lifter at early powerlifting contests.


[�]
Further on in the book, Strossen makes it clear that Anderson was an independent thinker; he had his own unique ideas about training. He believed that the squat is the most important of all the lifts, at a time when few experts agreed. In fact, the Russian and European lifters rarely if ever practiced squats. Squat racks were not standard equipment for Olympic lifters. In the foreword to the book, Tommy Kono writes that Paul created quite a stir in the training hall at the 1955 Munich World Championships by doing squats "with close to 700 pounds for ten reps without any warm-up and performed it so rapidly that it was as if free squats were being performed." Kono said Anderson would've used more weight, but that was all they could load on the bar.

In an excellent chapter on Paul's training and diet, Randy Strossen writes that Anderson recognized early on that "the legs and back were the key to one's strength." As mentioned above, his early training was devoted mainly to the squat. "Paul combined short, intense workouts throughout the day, with periods of rest," Strossen writes. For example, he would do 10 reps in the squat with 600, rest for about 30 minutes, and then do a second set of 10. After another 30 minutes rest, he would increase the weight to 825 and do three reps, rest again and do two more reps with 845. Then he would rest again and conclude by doing half squats with 1200 for 2 or 3 reps and quarter squats with 1800. The whole routine took three hours or more. He would sip milk during the rest periods, consuming a gallon or more throughout the course of the day.

Paul Anderson was certainly a superman. He devoted his life to ministry and helping disadvantaged youths.

I've been squatting 240 or so, 3 sets of five about once weekly in addition to Crossfit. After reading this thread I took my own advice and, after a thorough warmup, squatted my bodyweight of 170, twenty times without racking the bar. The last five were getting to a serious discomfort level. I feel like I did 10hr of hard labor the next day but I'm not sore in a conventional sense from it. Next week I'll add a second set of 20.

Funky stuff!

No doubt a very physical specimen, though I am much more impressed with Lu Xiaojun. He did 451.94 lbs on the clean and jerk, and 385.8 lbs on the snatch. Though he did not get a third attempt and likely would have gotten a smidgen more. He only weighs 170lbs


Hell I'm happy with 205 in the clean and jerk only weighing 165. Makes me scratch my head seeing him get well over twice what I can muscle up. I did clean 210 yesterday, but I couldn't get my elbows locked out overhead

Paul Anderson died when he was only 61 years old.

Wonder if all that incredible power lifting with those immense weights contributed to his early death??

L.W.

Anderson died of kidney failure brought on by a life-long kidney ailment.

RS

TaK,

You certainly don't need training advice from me but allow me to offer some thoughts based on experience.

When doing sets of 20 squats, I have found it extremely helpful to have a large digital clock right in front of me. The idea being to do the set in one minute or less. Have the weight on your shoulders and at "3,2,1,GO!" do a squat every 3 seconds by the clock. The clock provides structure and discipline to the set. This is crucial on the last 3 to 5 reps.

Additionally, you might want to rethink that second set of twenty. It's your nervous system that will suffer, not your muscles, per se. You will have to either skip WOD's or scale them far more than you would expect.

Cheers, RS

I had a hell of a time finding shoes. I ended up ordering a pair and returning them before I got a pair that fit right. They�re all European or whatever size scale they use in Brazil. Anyway, the shoes helped me quite a bit or at least that was my perception. Nice solid platform to work with. Now I know why Mark Rippetoe recommends them so highly.

I'm thinking you're right Rip. I'm feeling it today, we'll see how the WOD goes this evening. Great suggestion on the clock.

Regarding 20 rep squats, I've only done them in a single set where 20 was the goal...hopefully... Regarding getting them all in 1 minute or less, well, you're not doing 20 rep squats the same way I've done them. It will run closer to 3 minutes give/take. You want to take something that is near your 10 rep max and squat it 20 times without racking it. You have to stop and breath... If you're doing them right, you should puke or feel like puking when you finish. If you can do a second set, your first set wasn't a real set.

In my opinion, working toward a goal of improving your 1 rep max should NOT include sets that make you feel like you are gonna puke. You are working endurance then, not limit strength. Low reps, lotsa weight, lotsa rest between sets. Eat like a pig, and sleep like a baby. Shoes? Chuck Taylors are dang good. Nice flat sole, to work the rear chain. Ab work and upper back work will help a lot too. Gotta keep the core tight. I would be very tempted to overload with some high box squats to get used to setting up with bigger weight than you are used to. The upper body setup is VERY important!

Everything he said ^^^^^^^^^^


Some guy my size was asking me yesterday in the gym why I was taking so long between sets of squat. Guess he was complaining about me hogging the rack. I tried to explain it all but it went in one ear and out the other. Oh well he was struggling with 150 and I was repping out 300.

It's not often a little guy such as myself gets to dick-flex in the gym, so I love every minute of it. Even if I only get a minute a month

20 rep squat sets make me want to vomit just thinking about them. I threw up a bit the other morning on 12 rep sets. I read about a bodybuilder from 20-30 years ago that would do three sets of "breathing" squats for 50 reps, with 315lbs. It took a while to complete. Hurt me just reading about it.....

Everybody has their own goals I suppose, but I find that I don't get injured as often when I alternate workouts of 6-7 rep sets with workouts of 11-12 rep sets. If I can't get the weight up 6 times, sometimes taking a few breaths between those last few, then I need to drop the weight down a bit. Maybe I'm not hardcore enough, but my goal is to still be showing up 4 days a week 25-30 years from now. I also find that good things happen when I take notes on each workout and try to keep making progress in one way or another.

HAHAHAHA!!! Yeah, I know what you mean.....People do not associate little guys with power. Fun to mess with them!

As a tall guy who's had his ass kicked by a 5' 4" guy, I know all about little guy power.

Benchman - what's the secret to getting the illusive double-bodyweight clean and jerk?

Obviously the road is paved by heavy squats, deadlifts, and C&J's. Anything else? Support exercises, genetics, etc?

I could do more than a double body weight squat in my 20's... now I stay away from that sort of intentional punishment. In your 50's there's no point hurting yourself.

My best friend had a 635 lb free-weight squat in his early 20's... recently (in 50's) did a 450lb bench and bulged a disk in his back.

He's pretty mad at himself for being so stupid.

Strength is a relative thing... numbers are overrated, healthy is better.

452 clean and jerk and 386 snatch are out of this world lifts for a 170 lifter. Anderson was setting world records when he lifted weights in that neighborhood as a super heavyweight back in his day.

Official competition:
Clean and press: 185.5 kg (408.5 lbs) on 1955-10-16, in Munich at the 1955 World Championships
Snatch: 152.5 kg (335 lbs) on 1956-06-02 in Philadelphia at the 1956 Senior Nationals
Clean and jerk: 199.5 kg (440 lbs) on 1956-06-02 in Philadelphia at the 1956 Senior Nationals
Total: 533.5 kg (181.5/152.5/199.5) / (1175 lbs (400/335 /440) (clean and press + snatch + clean and jerk) on 1956-06-02 in Philadelphia at the 1956 Senior Nationals

There are a lot of old B&W videos on YouTube where you cannot believe how easy he made those lifts look!

But for pure guts, ya gotta go with the 1956 Olympic Games in Melbourne, Australia.
While sick as a dog, running a high fever and losing over 20 pounds during the Games his Gold Medal Record lifts:
2 Arm Press: 167.5 kg. (368.5 pounds)
2 Arm Snatch: 145 kg. (319 pounds)
2 Arm Clean and Jerk: 187.5 kg. (412.5 pounds)
Olympic total: 500 kg. (1100 pounds).

Paul turned pro and because it was 1960 he could not compete in the next Olympics.
Russian heavyweight Yury Vlasov beat his 1956 records.
So Paul lifted the new records three times in quick succession next time he got the chance.

But Olympic weightlifting was not Paul Anderson. He was a powerlifter before anyone ever heard of the term:
Squat: 1,200 lb (540 kg) raw
Bench press: 627 lb (284 kg) raw
Deadlift: 820 lb (370 kg) raw

And the next time you watch the latest strongman contest remember this.
Paul and his dad build a platform in the backyard, loaded up an old safe with 2,840 and threw on everything else they could find.

And on June 12, 1957, Paul backlifted that 6,270 pound sucker just off the trestles.

Over three tons. The Strongest Man in the World.

The single greatest asset you can have, is good form. That will trump ANYTHING, in terms of benefit. Get a good oly lifting coach, and do what they say. Speed and flexibility are often overlooked. I am NOT an olympic lifter, and it has been years since I lifted with one. Not sure what the going workout strategy is. Form will exploit all the strength you have, though.

My form is clean, but certainly could be tightened up. That's not to say my movement is unsafe or 'bad' per say, but I know with coaching I could squeak out quite a bit more. Where I lift, the strength coach for UAB football is instructing a lady. Perhaps I should talk to him? Dude is a monster too; I wouldn't fight him with a pistol in each hand.

One intangible benefit to lifting weights is the testosterone bump; I walk around feeling like I could just break out at any moment and start flipping tables

If he is not an olympic lifter, and I would suspect he is not....(just not a lot of them out there) he could at least point you in the right direction. At 58, any test. "bump" I get is more of a slight change in texture...... Suppose it must do SOMETHING, I guess.... Now wimmin - THEY'LL bump that testosterone right well!