Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Ask The Gunwriters 300 Win mag vs 300 WSM

Hit the nail on the head there....

JMR40,

You're getting 3150+ with 180's in a 24" .300 WSM? Because that's what "the .300 WM might shoot 25-30 fps faster" implies, because modern pressure-tested data shows around 3200 fps with 180's in the .300 Winchester Magnum with the right powder.

I would accept 98% of .300 Winchester magnum velocity, because that's what the difference in powder room in the two rounds indicates. That would be around 3125-3130 with 180's from the WSM, which is pretty damn good.

And I don't find 200-grain bullets are handicapped at all in the .300 WSM. The standard line among some people since it appeared is that 200's "take up too much powder room," but the butt end of a typical 200-grain spitzer ends up just about as far below the neck in a .300 Winchester or even .300 Weatherby Magnum.

As for absolute accuracy, I don't think there's any doubt the WSM wins. Bob Nosler told me a couple years after the .300 WSM came out that Nosler used to do the daily accuracy testing of lighter .30-caliber bullets with the .308 Winchester and .30-06, and used the .300 Winchester Magnum for heavier bullets. But after trying the .300 WSM, they just started using it for testing the accuracy of ALL their .30 caliber bullets.

JB....what is your "go to" powder the 300 Win Mag with 180 grain bullets?

My 300WSM A7 is right at 7Lbs scoped and you want to be holding it right when you shoot it.....grin

Edge stock with nice pad now so that helps.


2950-3050 fps with 175/180 grain bullets seems to be the right speed depending on H4350 or R17.



JB, depending on COAL a 200 grain Accubond will just barely fit using a full charge of H4831sc. I got 2900fps, and a sore shoulder....grin

300WSM's are fun to reload and shoot though, 175's aren't that bad shooting prone.

Cases last forever and never need to get trimmed.


Big medicine on deer!

mathman,

I don't shoot 180's much anymore in the .300 Winchester, but when I did H4831 was the first I'd try. Ramshot Magnum and H1000 normally get a little more zip, though, and Ramshot's data for Magnum shows 3193 fps for the 180 GameKing, using 86.5 grains.

These days I usually load 165-168 grain bullets with RL-19 for lighter game, and 200's with Magnum for heavier game.

Good informative post JB....We need some damn target pictures of a piss poor shooting Winchester model 70 (with CRF no doubt) 300 wsm:


5 shot group. Missed the fn dime, but still good enough to take my buck at 600 yards in 2011.

10 shot group @ 160 yards (fired with 1 sighter):







Hmmmm, point of impact seems a little weird though: Not way out in left field.


My newer 300 wsm doesn't shoot as well but it's quite a bit lighter and a lot nicer to pack around in the woods:


[img]http://i1180.photobucket.com/albums/x401/chiefbsa/002_zps32ba0ca9.jpg[/img]

I would think the obvious has not been brought up yet. First, there is nothing any wsm can do that an existing traditional cartridge cant do better. I consider that...

Second, if you are going to hunt in dangerous game, ie grizzly, polar bear, etc, you get the picture, one of these babies is charging you at a fast rate of lightning speed, and as you raise your WSM Rifle up to your face cheek, you are thinking to yourself in that split second, God I wish I was shooting the standard cartridge and had that extra cartridge in the magazine of this rifle, I might live with just that one last shot.........

If I was being charged by a grizzly or polar bear, I wouldn't wish I was holding a different gun. I'd be wishing that it was you standing there instead of me.

That's funny. In those circumstances, I'd be using my 375 H&H with 4+1 or even my 348 with 4+1 capacity. 5+1 in the 9.3x62mm would be just fine as well..You're saying the 300 wm holds more in the mag? Mine hold 3, as does my 300 wsm's.

.................Well, I`ll have to disagree with your above comments in a few areas.

First off, no bear including either the polar or grizzly you mention, and given the same shot placements with the same bullets, will ever know the differences between a 300 WSM vs a 300 Win.

Secondly, it doesn`t matter whether your talking about the standard round (the 300 Win) or the shorter 300 WSM as a defensive round for big bears. The ballistic velocity differences between them from the muzzle are of no consequence.

And as long as you are talking about defensive rounds? Personally, I`d take a slightly lighter 300 WSM rifle over a generally heavier 300 Win rifle if for defensive purposes. Imo, your defensive argument should have more emphasis on the rifles and the user`s ability to react in emergency defensive situations rather than with these two cartridges themselves.

So if a hunter happens to get snuffed out by a big bear in an emergency defensive situation, it won`t be because he happens to own a 300 WSM or the 300 Win. It will be due to his in-ability to rapidly place the shots effectively during the emergency situation.

Now if your above opinion stems from just not liking the 300 WSM, that`s one thing. However, it is another matter all-together to assume that a 300 Win can save a life defending against a big bear whereas the 300 WSM cannot, especially when the ballistics between the two are so close between them.

M D, et.al.

This is my first post in this thread and I've been reading and comparing loads/ballistics between the 2 cartridges.

It 'seems' to me that with newer powders the WSM is virtually identical in performance to/with the WM. That being the case, pun intended, I don't see any grounds for criticism of one or the other.

If I had not been using and equipped for the WM I would give serious consideration to BOTH before buying and getting all the loading equipment for either.

It would be more important to me as to HOW each rifle felt/balanced/weighed AND the magazine capacity.

Personally I have no issues with L As. I DO have issues with HEAVY rifles. My current 300 W M is a M 70 Win Lite, and all up, hunt ready (3+1 in) weighs a little LESS than 7.5 lbs.

I'm happy and see no need---FOR ME-- to change.

None of us has to please anyone ELSE.

Jerry

Why? so I could kill it for you. grins,
No, I only brought up the mag issue because some of the bolt manufacturers do have a difference between the two. and for some people in certain country, that could be a consideration.

"It hits about 1/2 way between 30-06 and 300 WM in equal weight rifles" is an acclaim (or defense, depending on your point of view) for the 300 RSAUM, and look how little respect that cartridge gets on the Campfire... Personally, I think there are darn few hunters who can make use of the additional capability of the bigger capacity 300 magnums. I represent that remark. Until I can take the 300 RSAUM to its limits, I see no need for more magnum unless I just want to get it for gettin's sake. Funny how we beat each other silly with 100-150 fps either way when we know it makes no real difference in the field. There must be something magic about the 300 Bee, though, because I keep reading in magazines that it is the ultimate 300 magnum!! But I also hear about how it beats us mortals silly... which is why some savvy Guides of Old recommended the 7mm magnums for their clients... which takes us to the 7mmRM, and the 7mm Bee, and that fabled Goddess of Perfection: the 7mm Mashburn Super...

About 10 years ago I decided it was time to get a big 300 magnum. Did a lot of research and finally narrowed it down to either the 300 WM or the 300 WSM for what I was looking to do. Finally decided that I could go with either one and had my eye on a 300 WM which was promptly sold before I got to jump on it. Then in 2004 at a gun show I came across a Savage model 10 synthetic package rifle in 300 WSM (brand new). Small independent dealer was in the process of retiring and was clearing things out. Made me an offer I couldn't refuse. It was a pre-accutrigger model and I put on a Riflebasix trigger and a Leupold instead of the Simmons and have been happy ever since. Brass lasts darn near forever and my loads are always very consistent, velocity-wise. Lowest extreme spreads I've ever gotten from any rifle. Oh, and it's also very accurate. My go-to load has a 150 gr. Accubond running at a very consistent 3207 fps; almost 200 fps slower than my buddies 300 RUM launches the same bullet but it's plenty good enough for me. Wanna work up a 180 gr. Partition load so if I ever had the opportunity to Elk hunt that 300 WSM's the only one in the safe I would even consider.

I would buy a 300wsm because it gets velocities within a 100fps of a 300 winmag and because its more accurate. I would not buy one to save a few ounces, especially so in a magnum where a well balanced rig that weighs around 8-8.5 lbs is perfect IMO.
In fact I dont want any rifles that weighs much less than that.

That is a pretty slow RUM load. I mention this so we are not comparing apples to oranges.

Jerry,

Your thoughts and reasoning is well taken. If I didn't have this Ed Brown .300WM already, I'd probably be looking at the WSM to save weight. But this gun is in the 6# range before scope and is a solid sub-moa producer. Not much a WSM would be able to add.

DF


Top rifle


180 gr. NBT

D F - Thnx. It works for me.

Did you notice your bolt is TWISTED ?? <G>

Nice group.

This is my 4-5th WM. I've never had any reason to complain.

Yeah, that the way Ed flutes the bolts on his 704 actions.

The 704 is an innovative design with CRF AND a round bolt with no extractor cut out. The best of both worlds.

DF

More accurate?

(5 shot 300 yard group 300 win mag






Any perceived accracey difference in the hunting fields is a moot point.