Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Single Shots #1 Hornet or Bee?

I use Remington 7.5 BR primers in my Hornets , but just picked up 1000 CCI 450 Mag's, so may try them for accuracy with Lil'Gun. I also have three or four hundred Hornady 35 gr V-Max's but haven't tried them in my Hornets

My Contender Super14 stainless Hornet gives consistent 3/4 to 1" 5 shot @ 100yd with the 35gr VG over 13gr Lil Gun in Win cases and Rem 7 1/2 primers. Also with the 40gr VMax moly and the NBT. I use the Lee Collet dies and have a SWFA 10x42 30mm tube with mil dot on it. There is so little recoil I have no issue with eye relief. Many a rifle shooter has been suprised with the accuracy.

I've owned three Hornets, one of them an Anschutz with a Match 54 action. I've only needed to own one .218Bee and that was in a Ruger No.1S (With the medium weight barrel).

I could never get handloaded Hornet ammo to shoot below an inch. The Anschutz came close but only with factory ammo. Good old W-W white box.

The Bee was the most accurate rifle I owned. Handloaded bulk buy W-W 46 grain HP's safely went 3,000 fps over my chrono. I put a lot of my success with the Bee down to the rifle which has a very strong action.

I'd love to see a small double made in .218Bee and regulated for the old 50 grain Norma FMJ's.

The other lesson to be learned is to have a couple of .357s around to use the powder and primers that don't make the cut in the Hornet! My revolvers are pretty omnivorous.

Thanks again for the ideas, John.

Klikitarik: I have a matching pair of Ruger #1-B's in 22 Hornet and in 218 Bee - both are scoped with Leupold 6x18 variable scopes.
I bought them both new.
I much prefer the 218 Bee for its accuracy and velocity and it was MUCH, MUCH, MUCH easier to develop loads for!
I would have sold my Ruger #1-B in 22 Hornet long ago except it has exceptional wood on it.
After MANY years of trial and tribulation I finally got my #1-B in 22 Hornet to shoot "half-assed" (.900" to 1.000" groups).
My Bee easily attained accuracy better than that.
As much as I love Ruger #1's I would think LONG and HARD before ever buying another in 22 Hornet.
Ignoring my personal experience the #1-B's in both 22 Hornet and 218 Bee command interest on the resale markets!
If a person was buying one to make a buck on then that is another matter.
Hold into the wind
VarmintGuy

Had two hornets. Anchutz and a win. 43. The arnie shot well, I got rid of three ( a .22LR, .222, and a Hornet.) because of the rollover stock. Th Americanized stock had not been invented as yet. It was fine off the bench, but a pain to stalk with.

The sweet little 43 just did not have it. I bought the Marlin 1894 in Bee when it came out. It likes the WW hollow point and Speer flat nose. I can't get the light pointed bullets to feed. There isn't enough recoil to present a magazine problem.

Brass is no problem to me. I got 500 new WW pierces of brass when I got the gun. I think I still have at least 350 pieces unused.

I'm sorely tempted by a 1S. Winchester used to do a run on brass annually around June IIRC. The industry mess may have stopped that for now.

Best wishes,

Jack

Something about a single shot begs a rimmed cartridge so I would go with the Bee. In my experience Bee brass has been available only on a seasonal basis so it is prudent to stock up when opportunity knocks. I think the Hornet is a great cartridge...........to blow out and neck down to a smaller caliber.

I had a No. 1S in 218 Bee and lucked into a big pile of once fired brass for it (800 pieces, as I recall), so brass was never an issue. That rifle liked W296 with the 40 gr V-max. When a friend of mine mentioned there was a custom No. 3 in 22 K-Hornet for sale locally, I couldn't resist and bought it too. I had the feeling I probably bought it out from under him and since he was interested in my 218 Bee, he owns it now (along with most of the brass - I kept some, just in case... ). The K-Hornet thrives on a full case of Lil Gun with about any bullet I've tried, but the 40 gr V-max has been the best so far.

I have #1's in K-Hornet and Bee. If I were forced to eliminate one, it would be the K.

toby2,

So you'd go with the .218 Bee over the Hornet in a Ruger No. 1 because the Bee case is rimmed? Or am I misreading your post?

I like the Hornet necked down and blown out too, but it is very definitely a rimmed case.

I tried three primers today with the #1B 22 Hornet. Win. Sm Pistol, Rem 7.5 Sm Pistol and CCI 400 Sm Rifle.
All were crappy 5 shot groups at 5 inches all over hell at 2900 fps with 10gr Lil Gun. That with a 40 gr. Berger HP.
The Privi factory load with a 45gr. power point style measures 2600 fps and shot about 1.5 inch 5 shot groups.
So my work is cut out for me.

I don't see how you can get 13 gr of LG in the case. That must be one heckuva compressed load.

Never had ANY problem getting 13.0 grains of Li'l Gun in Winchester .22 Hornet cases. It definitely fills them up but there is no problem seating 40-grain plastic-tips, whether Hornady V-Maxes, Nosler Ballistic Tips or Varmageddons, or Sierra BlitzKings.
In fact I just tried it again, in a new Winchester case, and the powder ended up about 1/8" below the case mouth. The charge fits even better in fired, neck-sized cases, which is how I usually size 'em.

What overall length are the cartridges? Depending on the specific plastic-tipped bullet, in my rifle they run 1.90 to 1.95. Many handloaders is either load bullets to the maximum SAAMI overall length of 1.72 (which is meant to fit the length of most magazines, and doesn't have anything to do with accuracy), or firmly believe in the old suggestion of at least one caliber of seating depth. In my rifle NONE of the 40's are seated that deeply, because there's no need to, especially in a single-shot. But I've loaded plenty of 40-grain hollow-points and soft-points at 1.72" with 13.0 grains of Li'l Gun for use in repeaters as well.

Also, many Hornet handloaders don't bother measuring bullet concentricity with the case. (In fact that's true of most handloaders in general.) Hornet bullets are relatively short, with very short shanks. Heavier .224 bullets with longer shanks tend to straighten themselves out in the bore, but short-shanked, light bullets do not. This is why checking for bullet alignment is critical in the Hornet, and other cartridges that use light, short-shanked bullets like the various .17's.

Another factor is that such short, low-BC bullets blow around in the wind considerably, far more than 50-55 grain .224" bullets. Even a 5-mph wind (which many shooters would call "calm") will blow a 40-grain Berger at 2800 fps off an inch at 100 yards. Unless you use wind flags in a 5 mph "calm" wind, or actually shoot in a dead calm, accuracy testing is useless.

Forgot to add that one reason factory ammo outshoots handloads in some rifles is because factory ammo's cases are normally very straight, since they haven't been resized in typical handloading dies. Thus the bullets end up seated straighter than in many handloads. Have seen this a bunch of times over the years.

Aw, geez! Everything was feeling all peachy and you had to bring that up! Now I'm really back to square one again. I shot the donor (218) which I bought to convert to a 225 Winchester (since I have many boxes of factory ammo). Shooting the donor was a bad idea 'cause then I needed another 22 CF I could have rechambered. And that's how I came into possession of the Hornet as well (with a better trigger even). And now I have to think about straight(er) bullets and short bearing lengths. It is almost more than a loony should have to bear. (Never mind the fact that rabbits which stop too long at 100 yards - give or take- are liable to lose whatever occupies the space between their ears with rather boring regularity). I rather like the 45 Sierra spitzer Varminter for that duty - just in case of neck-ranging stray shots; less explosive.

I should add- in these times of difficult rimfire 22 ammo availability- that it has finally dawned on me why having several pounds of Lil' Gun and A1680 wasn't a dumb idea. It happened over a short span of time that I accumulated a few pounds- not really realizing that my stash of quicker powders had grown. One pound the equivalent in Hornet ammo of a brick of 22s. That's a good thing I think

Thanks MD for the info, once again. I'll be at it until I figure this out. Just scored 500 pieces of new brass so I am committed.

It appears that Berger has discontinued the Varmint Grenades as there is no mention of them on their website or in the catalog. Too bad for me, as I loaded a few over H110 a while back and was waiting for good weather to test them. If they shoot real good, I'll really be bummed.

Yeah that JB is such a killjoy; always injecting logic, science, and experience into the conversation. Who the hell does he think he is?

Now that I think about it, it's probably a good thing that Berger's not making Varmint Grenades. Randy Brooks would be pissed!

Need more coffee.