Home Forums Reloading Big Game Rifles Touching the lands or not...

I have loaded for years. Always assumed that if a load wouldn't shoot kissing the lands, I could think of no reason it would shoot off the lands. But as I have said before, each rifle is a story unto itself.

Just a general question...how many of you really fool around with different seating depths and what are you experiences.

Every load I got is seated to just make contact with the lands.

I've seldom found that any load shot best "on the lands". I normally start at .010" off and work from there, usually further from the lands, but I try them all, including "into the lands" until I find a load. However, a number of issues have arisen for me lately where I've decided that the lands are just a convenient measuring point and reference. Even after many, many years of reloading (55) I've recently found loads shooting as well, or better, at the SAAMI designated OAL. Only problem with that is the point of reference is too variable measuring from the tip of the bullet because of the differences in ogives of the various bullets. I've also found loads recently shooting quite well around .025" off the lands in a couple of instances, and another just yesterday at .040" of the lands. I used to tweak loads using different primers and small changes in powder charge at my beloved .010", and I usually found a load at that setting. I now believe you can find loads almost anywhere across the spectrum changing only one of the components, including powder and powder charge, seating depth, primers and bullet grip, but you have to do this only one at a time until each variable is exhausted. Where you start is just a point of reference, I don't believe there is any more magic in one method than there is in another.

I don't own a single rifle,the prefers a jump,to being nestled........................

Should add...that even includes 22lr's.

I've a number of 10/22 tubes,with Bentz and other chambers/throats. Those that "kiss" shoot best.

My Anschutz 54 can really like the notion too,but I'm not gonna have it freebored,for evaluation comparisons....................

None of my loads are designed to touch the lands. I do experiment with various lengths as with powders,bullets, etc. I guess typically I am .010 or less to lands. All my rifles I hunt with, maybe if I were just target shooting I'd do it different.

I can't see laying Precision behind,when it's a seater adjustment away.

For that reason,I don't purposely induce charge weight variances,to keep things from performing at their optimum...............................

Any bullet that I make up is from .020" on out from the lands. Of I was to somehow get into National Target shoots then that would be a whole different ball game. I find it of no interest as the suggested min. from lands from bullet manufacturer and or other "reloading experts" generally suffices and then work from there per rifle. Hunting rifles for me do not require the inherent accuracies of the Target guns and there reloading techniques.

I do not kiss the lands on any of my hunting rifles,I seat for best function through the magazine

Check out these groups the bullets are seated to Standard C.O.A.L. lenght:

http://longrangehunting.com/ubbthreads/s...8976#Post109091

You can bump lands and nestle mag confines.

That'd be the definition of great throat geometry.

You boys go ahead and make sure your knives are dull too and boots leakin'?(grin)

Remember.....handloads void all Warranties.

Kids.....................

What is wrong with the accuracy,follow the link

http://longrangehunting.com/ubbthreads/s...p;page=2#108976

your link doesn't work ...

Didn't even stop to gawk the link,I'm simply saying I've a few rifles and have experimented a smidge. With both my nuts on the chopping block,wagering sight unseen,I'd ante both balls that a kiss is gonna out agg a leap.

I've said it often,that in my opinion,seating depth control is the single greatest benefit of reloading.

Some may favor only filling their truck 3/4 full with fuel,running 3 different tire types upon same and putting vaseline on the windshield to fend the rain and "enhance" vision.

I'll kiss lands,fill 'er up,drive BFG's of like type and hit the wipers.................

Try again;

http://longrangehunting.com/ubbthreads/s...p;page=2#108976

Twenty five years ago when I first started reloading, I had the opportunity to learn a thing or two from a guy named Tony Boyer. He loaded everything he shot to the lands then and I suspect he still does today....

I have two (both .308's) that seem to shoot better a bit (.020") off the lands but I start a new barrel out touching. They have to prove they like otherwise first...

Out of 17 units in the safe, the Weatherby's are the only ones not seated near the lands. Everything else is as close as I can adjust, but no kissing. With the Weatherby's and their freebore, it's nearly impossible to reach the lands. I've tried them long to such a degee that the pills would only marginally remain in the cartridge. Had to chamber them by hand not beause the magazine was too short, but because the bullet/cartridge alignment could not take the lateral stresses of feeding. My thoughts are that freebored Weatherby's need a little more catridge grip on the bullet to generate consistent pressure at light off. So far, each of those has come into line after I started progressively pushing the bullets deeper into the cartridge. I have not tried crimping on the Weatherby's but I might give that some thought. I should shortly have a 240 assembled and I will likely go through the same exercise again. 1Minute

I don't crimp,but ran my SAAMI Wby stuff beyond oft Published COAL's,while retaining a diameter-ish of shank bearing surface in the neck.

Or to mag confines,whichever arrived first.....................

I routinely find that off the lands is better than .005" from the lands, and .005" is as close as I will load for a hunting rifle. I have had rifles shoot very well with bullets as much as .150" deep. Just this past weekend my 270 WSM shot a dramatically smaller group .030" deep than it did at .005, .010, .015, and .020.


Now on both of my BR rifles I start(ed) at the lands and jam. My current rifle seems to like .005 to .010" jam into the lands.

A pretty diversified concensus here with all sorts of seating depth protocol.

Which supports my theory on it...either it depends on the rifle or it really don't make a damn...

I got 'em that shoot great off the lands...got 'em that shoot great stuffed in the lands...got 'em that shoot great no matter what...

Got rid of the ones that don't....

I've experimented with my 6.5x284 and it likes the 142 grain SMK .007" off of the lands for the most consistent grouping and standard deviations.

I've tried loads from .020" off the lands to .010" jammed into the lands in .002" increments and found the sweet spot between .006" and .010"off the lands. I further refined it in .001" increments to between .006 and .007" and finally settled on .007" off the lands.

All this only applies in my gun and may be different in yours.

My point exactly...

Big Stick,
Do you seat your Barnes TSX's kissing the lands?

Thanks,

Huntr

Like Wildswalker said - I have a 300RUM that is seated an entire dial and a half back off of the lands and shoots very well. I was lucky too because the magazine length determined where the closest seating could occur with a 200 gr. NP. But, having said that, I like to start about .005 off and work back seeking out that sweet spot.

No sweet spot, no more rifle. Has only happened once. With enough patience and trying different components, reloaders have a much better opportunity to find that perfect load as opposed to purchasing factory ammo (which is much better than in years past).

I must admit that early on, I wouldn't have believed that I could have gotten even "reasonable" groups not seated right up against the lands. These days, wherever it wants to be seated, that's where I'll seat her.

Like Blaine, I load all my hunting rifles well off the lands, and my varmint target rifles well into the lands. Ultimate accuracy is usually found into the lands, and as long as you have time to tune to the local conditions, this works fine.

"Kissing" the lands has always been an unholy compromise that invited all the accuracy demons to ride on every bullet.

Loading off the lands tends to be far more consistent across conditions (than into the lands), and avoids the undeniable pitfalls associated with loading hunting rounds into the lands.

In hunting rifles, even with match tubes, I've never found the difference in accuracy to be more than a few tenths of a MOA. More often than not, the difference is too small to say for sure there IS a difference. A small price to pay for a load that is robust across conditions and piece of mind. FWIW, Dutch.

Dutch,

I have seen the same thing. A bullet seated .020 or .030+ away from the lands seems to be less sensitive to small variances in seating depth or powder charge than one at or in the lands.