Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Hunter's Campfire Utah's Coyote Bounty program.........

Utah hunters ? Is it working ?

I call them a 'target of opportunity'

Yes...that is one mangy dog in the pic.....

http://www.ksl.com/index.php?sid=29...ion-effectiveness-of-utahs-coyote-bounty

At Chaparral Wildlife Management Area in South Texas the biologist said their neighbors trapped 90 coyotes along their high fence and fawn survival rate on that side of the area was 70% compared to 35% on the untrapped side. The two sides are separated by a high fence. The coyote density on the area has to be one of the highest in the world.

I'm not sure how well killing coyotes to benefit deer would scale to a state the size of Utah but coyotes do kill fawns. I suspect it's not a good use of money for the reasons cited in the article.

It's a good use of money because it provides incentive to kill coyotes when the costs associated with it have gone up.

Four or five years ago wardens told a friend who has 50,000 acres in west Texas leased that coyotes didnt do much damage to mule deer. He disagreed and put in a lot of effort and expense trapping and aerial hunting. First year had killed 400 and the next his place had by far and away the highest fawn survival and deer population per acre of all ranches surveyed by Texas Parks and Wildlife.

wish Ideehoo would do the same. this time of year I see the yotes shadowing the does just waiting for the drop. the most sickening sound I've heard is a fawn being eaten alive. the bunny huggers don't experience that and think it is a quick death for the prey animals. mostly its not.
beside that aspect of it here on my place I have started shooting yotes on sight. the mulie population has increases in the last 5 years greatly. I don't have the time or the inclination to do a scientific count but I know what I see.
between the griz, wolves, coyotes, our elk pop has plummeted.
the wolves and coyotes are on "shoot on sight " orders.
besides, blasted yote woke me up yesterday morning, sitting in the middle of the garden yelling his head off. heard me lever the rifle and left so fast he left hair.

Bounty programs are a failure from the onset.

Controlling predators is effective, but putting a bounty on coyotes has always proven that it makes the educated coyotes that are the main killers even more smart, and produces all sorts of deception to who is offering the bounty by unethical people that don't care if they are helping or not, as long as they get a fat check.

The guys that DO know which end of the coyote the crap falls from have a way harder time contending with the coyotes that cause the problem in the first place because of the inexperienced trappers and callers that do nothing more than waste gas and educate coyotes.

Believe it or not, it's not ALL coyotes that cause a problem. But, in the same breath, I don't think I'll trust those coyotes not causing problems to guard my sheep herd overnight either...

State bounty money would be better spent by hiring more wildlife specialists and enacting flying/gunning programs. That is a fact.

I was wondering if you had some sort of study to go along with the anecdotal evidence you brought forward.

Wouldn't putting $500,000 a year into habitat for mule deer be more of a long term solution rather than just a blip on the radar screen?

Rockinbar: I literally laughed at your posting!
IF... you think that in an area where Mule Deer live that "some of the Coyotes eat Mule Deer fawns AND SOME DON'T" then you simply have another think coming!
I simply am stunned at your bizarre contention.
WHAT..., IF anything do you base that peculiar opinion on!
Those of us that have frequented and live in Mule Deer country all our mature lives, KNOW the damage Coyotes do to Mule Deer herds (and Antelope populations also).
Again, your contention that some Coyotes are "vegatarians" or choose NOT to ingest a nice, warm juicy Mule Deer fawn when they get the chance is, at best, bizarre!
Sheesh!
On bounties for Coyotes - at least one area I am familiar with in Wyoming where Coyote bounties were in place for some time showed definitive improvement in Mule Deer populations thereabouts.
When I was a young Hunter Mule Deer Hunter there was a "bounty" on Mt. Lions in effect. The Mule Deer Hunting and populations in that area were excellent!
Soon though "P/C" came into play and the bounties on Mt. Lions were removed along with impositions on how Hunters could pursue Mt. Lions - the Mule Deer Hunting has declined to the point of being a waste of time, therebaouts, now.
There used to be a "bounty" on Seals and Sea Lions in an area I enjoyed Salmon fishing some decades back - those bounties became non-P/C and now the Salmon fishing thereabouts is BLAH!
Bounties work in controlling certain populations - its that simple.
Hold into the wind
VarmintGuy

What should be planted on a ranchers land without his permission?
Did I say that doing other things would not help the deer population?
The thread was concerning reduced coyote pop. IIRC.
PS, 25,000 acres of his leases are in irrigated cultivation and his deer pop. Increased drastically after trapping and helicopter gunning. He was specifically advised by the biologist and warden for that area it would not significantly help the deer pop.

BTW, he and his kids have taken several deer scoring over 200 in gross.

TP and W biologists have the info of his deer pops before and after.

Well, it wouldn't be the first time that you and I disagree on predators. I remember the 40 something pound bobcat you posted pics of that you shot with a .357... One day, I may show you what a real 40 pound bobcat looks like.

Now, to the matter at hand...



Facts and years of personal experience and being a certified Wildlife Specialist. I was employed by government to cover 7000 square miles of territory that was froth with predators from bears to badgers. But, I mostly killed, trapped and dealt with coyotes. Killed more coyotes in a year than you have ever seen in a lifetime.



Did I say that all coyotes are vegetarians? No. I simply stated that not all coyotes are the ones that KILL prey like that.
Let me expand on that a bit... When calling coyotes as part of aggressive tactics to actually take down the ones that were killing, I would use antelope fawn distress and deer fawn distress sounds along with certain coyote vocalizations. I knew when doing that type calling in certain areas, that the Alpha Males and Alpha females that lead the charge in killing larger animals were what we were going to be killing first. They come in hard fast and aggressive. The coyotes that are further down the pecking order hang back and watch the alphas do the killing.

I never said that all coyotes won't eat mule deer either. One of the tactics I employ is to bait an area with rank, road kill deer, and shoot coyotes that come around to feed.

A coyote is also an omnivore. So, you are letting your ignorance show when you think they AREN'T vegetarians at certain times of the year. A coyote takes the path of least resistance when it feeds itself. If a nearby vineyard has grapes coming off, or grasshoppers are plentiful, or even watermelon patches are ripe, coyotes will eat those things, or even mesquite beans in lieu of wasting time and energy killing something to eat. It is much easier to just harvest and eat what is plentiful. Most coyotes do hunt more in the colder months of winter though.

Your delusional response with what limited successes bounties have had with controlling other species is just that. Delusions. The species you mention are NOT coyotes are they? Nor do they have the same habits and intelligence.

Further, it's obvious that you have not dealt with mass areas of coyotes that have been educated on traps and calling, and seen firsthand what negative effects that has on professionals that DO know WTF is going on, and are putting a dent in the coyote population enough to make a marked difference. Nr have you dealt with the distribution of bounty money to individuals that employ fraud in collecting those bounties.

You don't have to believe me. Just take about 10 minutes and call a supervisor as USDA Aphis and ask THEM if anything I have stated herein is false by even the slightest iota.

All your rant did was let me know how much of a greenhorn you really are about such matters.

having done many ranch surveys counting wildlife, and shooting coyotes from a chopper, and calling and trapping coyotes,i will tell you for every coyote you kill, see,or call or trap there are at least 3 you didn't get or see and rockinbbar. is correct a coyote will eat what ever is handy, they kill a lot of fawns, calf elk, and small animals, i have seen where they have eaten a foal as the mare was giving birth, same with cows, i seen locked up bucks one dragging the other with coyotes following eating the weakest buck alive,predator control is best left to people that know what they are doing, educated coyotes, do more harm than the dumb ones, those are the ones most hunters get.rio7

I will definitely agree that calling is not going to do much to help the deer and shooters who miss and educate coyotes are going to make it more difficult to get rid of those coyotes by call.

It's said coyotes get about 6-7 deer credited to them in their life, so I'd like to think killing maybe 7,000 coyotes did save a few thousand fawns.

It probably would take 10-80 to really help, though.

I've seen ranches that were hunted by good callers get hunted by helicopter and have a hundred or two coyotes taken out as if callers didnt even have an impact.

here's something that will make you wonder WHAT THE HELL!! Last oct.while doing game survey, i shot coyotes for 4 days from a chopper, 1st day i killed 51 sec.day 48. 3rd. day 62 4 th day 53. The 5th morning coyotes woke me up right at daylight howling out side my bed room window.and this on 25000 acres, around the house.rio7

Have flown and gunned quite a bit myself.

It doesn't surprise me at all. In fact, we would always kill more coyotes flying when we flew around the ranch houses... Always. The old "dead piles" where ranchers drug dead animals is always another spot we had lots of luck. And close to water in the desert, was always a good producer.

You use Lange?

Do not know what Lange ? is. rio7