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Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 741
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OP
Campfire Regular
Joined: Feb 2011
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I've a rifle with a bound mag box that I wanted to remedy this weekend. The fwd action screw was dreadfully tight and I went to the shop to get some hardware. Talking to the gunsmith at the desk I was surprised to learn the following: that my rifle was supposed to have the box bound against the action. Only guns like Weatherbys are supposed to have them free. I also learned that my accurizing work was time wasted if I hadn't confirmed poor grouping using a Lead Sled.
Anyway, I decided to wing it with the old Craftsman driver and made out OK.
Last edited by turkish; 07/26/14.
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Jun 2005
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Unfortunately, there is not much in the way of testing or credentialing standards that I know of for a guy to call himself a gunsmith. Seemingly anyone with a pipe wrench and a screwdriver kit can hang out a shingle that says "gunsmith". And, because of the dearth of real gunsmiths in many area's unknowing folks will flock to this guyand take his words as the ultimate in firearms wisdom and knowledge. I have seen and heard pure crap from more than a few. Always check the training, apprenticeship other credentials and references before bestowing that title to another.
Sadly, far too many folks put WAY too much weight or value to what some of these charlitans say, much to their detriment.
Maybe your post and thread will start up sort of a "pure hogwash and zebrapoop we have heard come from supposed 'gunsmiths'here.
LOVE God, LOVE your family, LOVE your country, LIKE guns and sports.
About 2016 team "R" candidates "We definitely need a crew with a sack of balls the size of hot water bottles, bloviated estrogen leaking feel-gooders need not apply." Gunner 500
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Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
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I had the same problem with the lug bolt. It took two of us with an impact hammer and wrench to break it loose. Upon inspection, the lug nut had Loctite on it. Once we got it apart and put a new trigger spring in it to get the pull down to two and a half lbs we shot a fantastic 5 shot group out of the 7-08.
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Aug 2006
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you made the right choice....
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Joined: Dec 2002
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 27,692 |
Had a local "gunsmith" declare any rifle would be ruined by hand loaded ammunition. Only factory ammo is safe enough to use.
Same guy also recommends a minimum 5 to 6 lb trigger pull for safety. Any lighter and " the gun will go off too easily."
Glass bedding and free floating are a waste of time because if it were necessary the factories would do it.
Also zero your scopes dead on at 50 yards because any farther and rifles aren't accurate enough to hit anything.
He also refuses to rebarrel rifles because he can't "afford the fancy equipment the factories use" and "factory barrels are better anyway."
Member: Clan of the Turdlike People.
Courage is Fear that has said its Prayers
�If we ever forget that we are one nation under God, then we will be a nation gone under.� Ronald Reagan.
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Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 741
Campfire Regular
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OP
Campfire Regular
Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 741 |
I had the same problem with the lug bolt. It took two of us with an impact hammer and wrench to break it loose. Upon inspection, the lug nut had Loctite on it. Once we got it apart and put a new trigger spring in it to get the pull down to two and a half lbs we shot a fantastic 5 shot group out of the 7-08. Some patience, tapping on the driver with a hammer, and a little Kroil seemed to help. I normally manage to screw up these jobs with a lack of the first part. It had a dab of Loctite from the factory, it appeared. I need to find a remedy for the trigger next.
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Campfire Sage
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Campfire Sage
Joined: Aug 2007
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Impact drivers are pretty UBER.
So are torches.
Travis
Trump being classless,tasteless and clueless as usual. Sorry, trump is a no tax payin pile of shiit. My young wife decided to play the field and had moved several dudes into my house
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Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 12,530 |
Had a local "gunsmith" declare any rifle would be ruined by hand loaded ammunition. Only factory ammo is safe enough to use.
Same guy also recommends a minimum 5 to 6 lb trigger pull for safety. Any lighter and " the gun will go off too easily."
Glass bedding and free floating are a waste of time because if it were necessary the factories would do it.
Also zero your scopes dead on at 50 yards because any farther and rifles aren't accurate enough to hit anything.
He also refuses to rebarrel rifles because he can't "afford the fancy equipment the factories use" and "factory barrels are better anyway." He should go in with the guy who makes you watch a safety video, they could be rich!
Last edited by MagMarc; 07/26/14.
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Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 27,692
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 27,692 |
Had a local "gunsmith" declare any rifle would be ruined by hand loaded ammunition. Only factory ammo is safe enough to use.
Same guy also recommends a minimum 5 to 6 lb trigger pull for safety. Any lighter and " the gun will go off too easily."
Glass bedding and free floating are a waste of time because if it were necessary the factories would do it.
Also zero your scopes dead on at 50 yards because any farther and rifles aren't accurate enough to hit anything.
He also refuses to rebarrel rifles because he can't "afford the fancy equipment the factories use" and "factory barrels are better anyway." He should go in with the guy who makes you watch a safety video, they could rich! I wouldn't be surprised if they are not relatives.
Member: Clan of the Turdlike People.
Courage is Fear that has said its Prayers
�If we ever forget that we are one nation under God, then we will be a nation gone under.� Ronald Reagan.
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Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 44,824
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 44,824 |
Had a local "gunsmith" declare any rifle would be ruined by hand loaded ammunition. Only factory ammo is safe enough to use.
Same guy also recommends a minimum 5 to 6 lb trigger pull for safety. Any lighter and " the gun will go off too easily."
Glass bedding and free floating are a waste of time because if it were necessary the factories would do it.
Also zero your scopes dead on at 50 yards because any farther and rifles aren't accurate enough to hit anything.
He also refuses to rebarrel rifles because he can't "afford the fancy equipment the factories use" and "factory barrels are better anyway." He should go in with the guy who makes you watch a safety video, they could rich! I wouldn't be surprised if they are not relatives. Cousins and brothers at the same time.
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Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 27,500
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 27,500 |
Had a local "gunsmith" declare any rifle would be ruined by hand loaded ammunition. Only factory ammo is safe enough to use.
Same guy also recommends a minimum 5 to 6 lb trigger pull for safety. Any lighter and " the gun will go off too easily."
Glass bedding and free floating are a waste of time because if it were necessary the factories would do it.
Also zero your scopes dead on at 50 yards because any farther and rifles aren't accurate enough to hit anything.
He also refuses to rebarrel rifles because he can't "afford the fancy equipment the factories use" and "factory barrels are better anyway." I would LOVE to know this guys credentials and background. That guy takes the cake, so far, IMO.
LOVE God, LOVE your family, LOVE your country, LIKE guns and sports.
About 2016 team "R" candidates "We definitely need a crew with a sack of balls the size of hot water bottles, bloviated estrogen leaking feel-gooders need not apply." Gunner 500
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Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 27,692
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 27,692 |
Had a local "gunsmith" declare any rifle would be ruined by hand loaded ammunition. Only factory ammo is safe enough to use.
Same guy also recommends a minimum 5 to 6 lb trigger pull for safety. Any lighter and " the gun will go off too easily."
Glass bedding and free floating are a waste of time because if it were necessary the factories would do it.
Also zero your scopes dead on at 50 yards because any farther and rifles aren't accurate enough to hit anything.
He also refuses to rebarrel rifles because he can't "afford the fancy equipment the factories use" and "factory barrels are better anyway." I would LOVE to know this guys credentials and background. That guy takes the cake, so far, IMO. I know he used to work as a machinist of some kind in a factory. I'd say his "gunsmithing training" came from mail order course or some similar thing.
Member: Clan of the Turdlike People.
Courage is Fear that has said its Prayers
�If we ever forget that we are one nation under God, then we will be a nation gone under.� Ronald Reagan.
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Joined: May 2005
Posts: 14,104
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 14,104 |
Had a local "gunsmith" declare any rifle would be ruined by hand loaded ammunition. Only factory ammo is safe enough to use.
Same guy also recommends a minimum 5 to 6 lb trigger pull for safety. Any lighter and " the gun will go off too easily."
Glass bedding and free floating are a waste of time because if it were necessary the factories would do it.
Also zero your scopes dead on at 50 yards because any farther and rifles aren't accurate enough to hit anything.
He also refuses to rebarrel rifles because he can't "afford the fancy equipment the factories use" and "factory barrels are better anyway." When I was a teenager, just starting to drive, the best sporting goods/gun store in the Houston area was Grant Ilseng Sporting Goods. I was trying to learn as much as I could about firearms, shooting and reloading, so I hung out in Ilseng's and several of the other gun stores whenever I got a chance to go into town. After several visits, I finally got a chance to talk with Ilseng's gunsmith, an older fellow who seemed to be revered and respected. I got almost word for word the same sermon, with the exception of the last two statements. He did re-barrel rifles, but only after he determined that they were completely shot out, and he would only re-barrel them for the same cartridge for which they were chambered by the factory. He was also a firm believer that sighting in a rifle at any distance beyond 100-yards was a waste of time and ammunition. Needless to say, I was very disappointed. After that, I only occasionally dropped into Ilseng's, just to drool at the extensive array of fancy rifles and shotguns on display.
Ben
Some days it takes most of the day for me to do practically nothing...
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Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Sep 2010
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I know he used to work as a machinist of some kind in a factory.
I'd say his "gunsmithing training" came from mail order course or some similar thing. Bet he wasn't much of a machinist either. A guy that puts things in a vise and pushes a button is NOT a machinist. I've had similar experience with motorcycle mechanics. Just because they work at a motorcycle shop doesn't mean they know squat.
I am continually astounded at how quickly people make up their minds on little evidence or none at all. Jack O'Connor
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 26,095 |
Know of one "gunsmith", now deceased, that believed it was stupid to bed a rifle because "nobody could do as good of a job as the factory". His son chastised me to my wife for "ruining" all my rifles after he found out it is common practice for me.
Dave.
Those who are always shooting off at the mouth usually aren't shooting straight. Build a man a fire and he’ll be warm for a day. Set a man on fire and he’ll be warm for the rest of his life. www.wvcdl.org
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Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Dec 2005
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Our local gunsmith sold his machines and is currently in a drunken stupor down some hole.
Arcus Venator
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Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 29,383
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 29,383 |
Had a local "gunsmith" declare any rifle would be ruined by hand loaded ammunition. Only factory ammo is safe enough to use.
Same guy also recommends a minimum 5 to 6 lb trigger pull for safety. Any lighter and " the gun will go off too easily."
Glass bedding and free floating are a waste of time because if it were necessary the factories would do it.
Also zero your scopes dead on at 50 yards because any farther and rifles aren't accurate enough to hit anything.
He also refuses to rebarrel rifles because he can't "afford the fancy equipment the factories use" and "factory barrels are better anyway." Swampy has moved to NC and is a gunsmith?
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Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 27,692
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 27,692 |
Had a local "gunsmith" declare any rifle would be ruined by hand loaded ammunition. Only factory ammo is safe enough to use.
Same guy also recommends a minimum 5 to 6 lb trigger pull for safety. Any lighter and " the gun will go off too easily."
Glass bedding and free floating are a waste of time because if it were necessary the factories would do it.
Also zero your scopes dead on at 50 yards because any farther and rifles aren't accurate enough to hit anything.
He also refuses to rebarrel rifles because he can't "afford the fancy equipment the factories use" and "factory barrels are better anyway." Swampy has moved to NC and is a gunsmith? I wouldn't be surprised if he is Swampy's twin brother.
Member: Clan of the Turdlike People.
Courage is Fear that has said its Prayers
�If we ever forget that we are one nation under God, then we will be a nation gone under.� Ronald Reagan.
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Joined: Jan 2013
Posts: 1,348
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Jan 2013
Posts: 1,348 |
-Matt
"The proof of the whisky is in the drinking, the proof of the rifle is in the shooting."
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Posts: 487
Campfire Member
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Campfire Member
Joined: Jul 2013
Posts: 487 |
Consider myself lucky to have an excellent local Smith. I've brought projects to him before where he simply scratched his head and said, "never done that before, but let me research it to learn more about it and we'll see about getting you fixed up".
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Campfire Greenhorn
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Campfire Greenhorn
Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 83 |
That's great! I like dealing with people like that, both parties end up learning something and business relationships are solidified.
Warren
Pardon my fat fingered I-phone typing
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Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Dec 2005
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Consider myself lucky to have an excellent local Smith. I've brought projects to him before where he simply scratched his head and said, "never done that before, but let me research it to learn more about it and we'll see about getting you fixed up". I have one now that is exactly like that. I tell him what I want and tell him to run with it. He corrects if I am wrong and he has learned some things from my requests.
Arcus Venator
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Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 32,080
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 32,080 |
Had a local "gunsmith" declare any rifle would be ruined by hand loaded ammunition. Only factory ammo is safe enough to use.
Same guy also recommends a minimum 5 to 6 lb trigger pull for safety. Any lighter and " the gun will go off too easily."
Glass bedding and free floating are a waste of time because if it were necessary the factories would do it.
Also zero your scopes dead on at 50 yards because any farther and rifles aren't accurate enough to hit anything.
He also refuses to rebarrel rifles because he can't "afford the fancy equipment the factories use" and "factory barrels are better anyway." He should go in with the guy who makes you watch a safety video, they could rich! I wouldn't be surprised if they are not relatives. Cousins and brothers at the same time. Quite possibly "related" closer than that! Probably "got together" at a family reunion. (Sorry Jeff) I spent 2 years at Colorado School of Trades - Gunsmithing. They even gave me a " Certificate of Completion". I've never been quite certain what that meant.... I always equated it to a 4th grade education... 35 years later (10 of it actively gunsmithing) I might have made the 8th grade... I sure learned a lot after being "educated".... The two rifles I have in Kotzebue for tundra hunting caribou are zeroed at 300 yards (or so - you can get too picky about these things, but they do shoot 2 not much + inch groups out there). Anything closer they ain't accurate.
The only true cost of having a dog is its death.
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Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 27,500
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 27,500 |
las, Yeah, I know what you mean. I have heard many gun shop experts talk about how some of these high BC bullets do not "go to sleep" so to speak until they got out there a ways. And then everyone knows that the real flat shooting rifles cause the bullet to actually begin to RISE as they leave the muzzle, and are just flattening out at 300 yards or so.... DISCLAIMER: All of the above typed with tongue planted firmly and hard into the cheek, as all of it is utter horseshidt. But crap that you will hear from gunsmiths and numbskulls alike in shops about the country.
LOVE God, LOVE your family, LOVE your country, LIKE guns and sports.
About 2016 team "R" candidates "We definitely need a crew with a sack of balls the size of hot water bottles, bloviated estrogen leaking feel-gooders need not apply." Gunner 500
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Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 1,237
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 1,237 |
I've had 2 smiths (local) tell me that the Reloader series of powders are very, very hard on barrels.
Had one just last week, when I was talking to him about a build I'm planning, that if I'm just going to run a 6x scope, a custom barrel would be a waste of time.
Most have always tried to talk me into longer, and heavier barrels. And custom throating seems to be a myth.
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New Member
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New Member
Joined: Aug 2014
Posts: 2 |
I've been a gunsmith for 23 years and currently have 7 gunsmiths that I employee. When I'm looking for another smith, I want someone with natural mechanical aptitude, who is a shooter, a machinist, and then a possible trade school graduate. Half the guys I employee have never been to formal school and I have trained them on the job. Sometimes training them in house is preferred because they don't have a certificate and think they know everything. Half of being a good mechanical gunsmith is being able to mentally picture how a gun functions and what each part is doing during it's cycle. When it comes to custom work (stocks,barrels,checkering, etc) it is about picturing the finished product and building it in your head before you ever touch a single part. I will have to say that I do like those corner/garage gunsmiths, as they create quite a bit of business for us.....LOL In all seriousness, research every gunsmith you trust to do your work. I have seen 100's of incidents over the years that were unrepairable because of a self proclaimed gunsmith. Remember, you get what you pay for....Cheap labor=cheap craftsmanship. Jon
Last edited by jwrdn; 08/03/14.
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Campfire Regular
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Posts: 886 |
I would venture to guess the majority of the most respected innovative smiths and firearm parts makers in the country are home shop based. Many would be surprised that the who's who of gunsmiths are home based. Everyday household names. Only a small percentage of these are formally trained.
"Hired Gun" Quickest and fastest all motor sand car on the planet. 3.008 at 104.8 300' of sand.
NRA Patron Life Member, Gunsmith, Instructor, Chief RSO
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