Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Ask The Gunwriters What was the Jack O'connor load?

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60 or 62 grains 4831?????????

130 grain bullet. But what bullet did he use mostly?

62 back in the day...but it was much slower burning back then. Now it is advised to pretty much max out at 60 with today's burning rate on H4831. Being right down the road from Speer, he seemed to be most fond of their products if I remember correctly.

Thought he was a Partition guy. Evidently used bronze points as well. Reading his biography now, can't say I can see what all the hub bub is about. Never read a single book or article that he wrote so maybe that explains it..

Follow up: my 270's all seem to prefer the short cut version (H4831SC)... They really hum with that load. Most of em prefer 58.5 grains, not a 60 grain max load. I don't lose much velocity, but almost always gain significant accuracy. I'm shooting Partitions if that matters...happy hunting!

Jack's .270 load was 62.0 grains of WWII surplus 4831 powder with the 130 grain Partition. I have used that load myself and it develops over 3200 fps from a 24" barrel.

4831 was originally used by the military in 20mm cannon ammunition. Tons of it were sold as surplus after the war for very low prices. Today's H4831 is a bit faster than the WWII stuff and no manual I am aware of recommends more than 60 grains with a 130 grain bullet.

I still have a couple gallons of WWII 4831 that I bought back in 1968 and it still smells fresh and shoots well.

O'Connor used a bunch of loads in the .270 over the years, but after Hodgdon started selling the surplus powder called H4831 after WWII he used 62.0 grains with 130's, as somebody has already stated. The bullet was usually the 130 Speer or Nosler Partition, depending on the game hunted.

I knew somebody would mention that 62.0 grains is considered too hot with today's version of H4831, but Hornady lists 62.0 grains as max in their manual with 130's and I've used 62 with Hornady 130's in several rifles with no problems. It usually shoots very well, with velocities ranging from 3050 to 3150, depending on barrel length, but did one 26" barreled .270 that got over 3200 with that load. Partitions develop more pressure, and usually 59-60 grains is a more reasonable maximum.

I have some of that old 4831, too. Mine came in paper bags, lined up in a cardboard box. I shot some last weekend and out of a half dozen powders, this old stuff shot the best group, 7RM with 150 gr. NPT's. Pretty amazing.

DF

John, my 4th Edition of the Hornady manual only goes up to 59.6 grains of H4831 with the 130 grain bullet. Have they increased it in later editions? If so, that is remarkable in these litigious days.

Back in the day, they called that recovered 20 mm powder "4350 data" powder because it had no name and if you used IMR-4350 powder data you wouldn't blow your rifle up.

That 60 or 62 grain load depends partly on what brass you're using, too. WIN brass has more internal capacity than REM brass.

I load 60 grains of H-4831 SC in both our 270's (newer Mod 70 Featherweight and MKII Model 77 Ruger) and get good accuracy and around 3020 FPS out of the Model 70. I haven't had a chance to chrono the Model 77 yet.

It's 62.0 in both the 8th and the most recent 9th edition, published in 2012.

One of the problems is that there have actually been three H4831's over the years, the original mil-surp, the replacement made in Scotland when Hodgdon ran out of the mil-surp powder in the mid-1970's, and the present Australian-made H4831SC, called AR2213SC down under.

I lucked into a bunch of the mil-surp stuff just before it was discontinued. Thought I had a lifetime supply and shot it all up within a few years, burning out at least one .270 barrel, as well as making a few other cartridges go bang. It was very accurate in a number of rounds but I like the newest version for its temperature-resistance and shorter granules. It's not nearly as hard to get 62 grain under a 130 now!

When I put 62 grains of that WWII stuff in a FL sized .270 case, it actually fills the case to just above the end of the case neck...there are 3 or 4 granules of powder heaped in a little mound beyond the mouth of the case. When I seat the bullet, I hear crunching noises...does that qualify as a "compressed load"?

Ha! Yeah, I know that feeling.

I found the only way it would "fit" was to use Winchester brass (which apparently still is lighter than other brands of .270 cases, judging from a fresh batch I recently bought) and tap the case while dribbling the powder slowly into the funnel.

I use the green RCBS funnel and an old BIC pen body with the guts pulled out as an extended drop tube.

From the horses mouth: "Here are some of my favorite loads: 130-grain bullet of controlled expanding type with 60-62 grains of old H4831, 61 grains of W-W 785, 60 grains of Norma 205 or 55-56 grains of 4350. Velocity is from 3,050 to 3,150. Excellent bullets that I have used are the W-W Power Point, the Remington pointed soft point Core-Lokt and the Nosler.
This load can be used on everything from rabbits to moose. I have used more Nosler bullets in front of 62 grains of H4831 in W-W cases than anything else."

Thanks neighbor. Do you have a reference for that, I would like to read the full article if it is on line.

I might get banned from these forums for admitting this in public... but I have never read any book or article by J.O., not once, never. But here lately I have been wanting to curb my appetite for every new cartridge and get a lot more plain, mostly because of the recent darth of components. 270 has been available in my neck of the woods all throughout the shortages, brass, loaded ammo and rifles.

You might want to back up about 10% and work up your loads in your rifle. I recall reading an article by Brad OConnor where he stated that he had used his fathers load of 62 gr of 4831 from memory and encountered some pressure problems due to the modern powder being faster burning.

That quote is from the "NEW EIGHTH EDITION HANDLOADERS DIGEST" copyright 1978. That's also the year Jack died so I'm guessing that's one of the last things he wrote(?).

I can't recall the name of one of his hardback books I read, but do remember he wrote liking 130 Partitions with 62/4831 in W-W cases which he claimed got 3140 fps from a 22 inch barrel. I suppose this was his all around load for Elk etc. He several times referred to liking something that opened up more quickly on deer and antelope and made references to a favorite old discontinued open point bullet made by W-W. JOC also said the Speer's were good and loaded 160 Speer in his wife's 7x57 which she used in Africa.

I loaded for a 270 for several years with a variety of case brands. With 60/H4831 it was a compressed load from a drop tube funnel and had good accuracy but did flatten primers consistently. Which causes me to wonder, did the old surplus 62/4831 load flatten primers?

My 270 liked 130 Speer Hotcors so I did too.

StrayDog I don't recall any issues with the load.

I shoot 61 of the present H4831 with 130 Sierra's, NPT's and Bitterroots. I throw the cases out because they get ratty but no issues with primer pockets opening.

Old guys had a shortcut for the whole -06 family with surplus 4831: scoop them full, card them level, stuff a bullet in them.

Two, brothers that load together, friends of my Dad were / are, last I saw them, still working their way thru a 1/2 barrel of the stuff. They weigh sight in and hunting loads, but practice and plinking loads are just scooped full with a wriggly motion thru the barrel of powder and capped with a bullet. They've been doing this to good effect, judging by their targets and mounted horns and hides, since before I was born.