Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Hunting Optics Should I Trust This Scope?

I have a Leupold VX-I (the previous generation). I've had it on a muzzle loader for 3 years or so and it's never given me any trouble while on there, although I did send it in for repair when I first got it and had it mounted on a rifle. I've also had several others of the same scope fail so I'm iffy. Anyway, I've dropped this thing, banged it around, etc. and it's always stayed zeroed. Last year at the end of BP season I put it away like usual. It had been shooting great. It sat in the safe all year until now. I went to make sure it was sighted in expecting to shoot 1-2 shots and be ready to hunt. Well, to my surprise it didn't even hit the target. After some testing I realized I was about 4" high and about 6" to the right. I adjust it back down and it seems to be grouping great, but now I'm wondering what made it shift. It wasn't dropped since the last time I shot it, banged up, or treated rough in any way. I'm wondering if I really need to be taking this into the woods or if I need to just go ahead and upgrade it to something more durable? What would you guys do in this situation? When I left the range it was still grouping tight and now zeroed once again, but I'm hesitant because I'm not sure if it will stay zeroed.

Once a scope loses zero like that it will do it again. It's not an if, but when thing.

Sell it to Formidilosus......

Form, I'm curious with regard to Leupold's 30% failure rate that you've stated as to how long this rate has existed ? 5 years, 10 years, always ? How long has this been your experience with them ? Could this be a quality control issue or just or is this, in your opinion, always been the case.

I'm good. Already have one going back this week.










Honestly don't know. It started highlighting for sure when the 3.5-10x40mm M3 LR's and 2.5-8's were issued. It seems like the older Leupolds (10 +/- years ago) were better but then we weren't really testing them either. I did have a 6-18x40mm Vari-x II that had to get fixed a couple times, but that model is a POS and has been since day one. My gut feeling is that older ones were better, but my brain says that they were always like that and we just didn't notice. If a guy just mounts one up, zeroes with 10-20 rounds and goes kill deer in the woods for the season and then puts it up, he'll probably never know something's wrong unless his misses or wounds one and checks it. By the time season rolls around again he's more than likely shooting different ammo if not a completely different gun so he won't notice that the zero shifted .5 to 2 MOA.


For sure the advent of dialing for distance has made the failures (or the observance of failures) sky rocket.


I'll get a buddy to bring a 2.5-8x36mm with B&C reticle up and I'll mount it on a rifle and use it this season. No tricks, no trying to make it fail, etc. We'll mount it, zero it, check tracking (which all but guaranteed will be way off), rezero it, and then I'll shoot a group with it once or twice a week and post it up.

Remember, if you don't have a sense of humor around here, you ain't $hit

Here is one that has been on this 1953 Model 70 since it was new. I would have to dig it out to check date of mfg.


I took some critters with it in 2004 and then pulled it out and took 2 deer with it maybe 5-6 years ago. Zero has remained same since whatever year it was made. And I do verify that every time before hunting with it. As of right now, it has not been used in 5-6 years. Wish I had some way sharing the info live when I bust it out again.

If it was off, I'd happily share the truth....

Did you say ( you ain't shod? )

Oh, never mind, I read it more closely

Shod

I would never say such a thing

Thanks for the response. Reason I asked was because someone who is well trusted here said to me (in private) that he believed that the quality (control) started to really slip somewhere around 2005 or 2006 so that's why I asked whether it was a QC issue or just that you are using them and expecting much more from them than Leupold knows about the bulk of their customers use of the product lines. Seems, at least from what I'm hearing from you and your pards, that Leupold is capable of building a solid scope with their fixed power scopes anyway, but the list gets short real quickly when it comes to their variables. I started replacing my Leupold variables with Elites around the mid-90's and never looked back. Not that I'm using my rifles the way you and your pards use them, but because of their zero shift after airline travel was significant. Around that time, there were many reports from gun writers about the quality of these Elites ( named B&L back then ) so I decided to give em a try. I think you'd be pretty hard pressed to find another variable in there price range that holds zero and tracks reliably like they do. Just my opinion.

The Elites are of a very common Japanese design also used on Monarchs and Weaver Classics(and others). They are also built in same plant(s) and utilize basicallly the same glass......I have even been told the exact same glass, by some. All are of same basic quality, with only minor differences. The Weaver just sells at a better price point. Not sure why.

I have had a lot of scope failures. None with any of said 3 models, though......

That same OEM made Nightforce scopes too. Lots of high quality scopes come out of LOW, not to mention bino's and spotters as well.

Most assume it is always LOW. But 2 others, one being Hakko and another which escapes me right now, also make many.

You now see scopes that were once Japanese made in Phillipines and Taiwan. Nikon being one example. That is because they are contracted out to the lowest bidder.....

I'd shoot 1 shot before the hunt and make sure I'm good. But I'd have a backup gun or iron sights just in case I find it to be not good.

I remember Mule Deer saying something to that effect that many start out life at the better Jap OEM's to get a good reputation going and then, as you stated, start shopping around. To my knowledge, the Elites from their original designation as B&L with the 3000 and 4000 models, to this day are still made by LOW. News travels fast on the net and it would be a shame if Bushnell didn't maintain the same level of quality by going to a different OEM. On the other hand so to speak, the SWFA SS's are made by an OEM in Japan, that most people probably never heard of so it's not like there is only one dance room. IIRC, Hakko no longer exists or was bought out by Japan Optical. In the end, so long as the scope, bino or spotter performs, it doesn't matter who made it.

Yes Hakko is now called Japan Optics.

I can't say who really makes what, but I'd not assume that LOW makes all of anything. They get shopped around. LOW is still largest and considered best. But I know Hakko did work with NF and some of the B&L 4000 scopes, Tasco, Springfield Armory.......

Asia Optical Japan is who I couldn't think of. They make Sightron. I think they are owned by Kenko in the Phillipines, who makes Nikons, Bushnell Legends, Simmons, and some others. Think they are also in China and possibly Taiwan.

My best guess is that Japan Optics makes the SWFA SS...

There was a picture on a website where QC/inspection sticker was left on the scope as to who made the SS scopes. I just won't say, but more importantly as I said before, where/who makes them isn't really all that relevant. Personally, I don't follow my words here as for me, I want what I paid for, meaning companies like LOW have a great reputation for QC and I'm just not the type who wants to brag about how fast I get my broken scopes back like so many folks here do. I think Form stated that also and I've been saying that for years. There was a guy here that was so excited to report about his VX3 breaking one day at the range that he just posted the event with no details and stated that he would give a full report in the morning...........really, I'm not kidding you. I guess he was so excited that it was going to interrupt his sleep w/o announcing that he became a member of the broken scope club.

I do think that something Formidilosis said is probably the most significant statement I've heard regarding scope breakdowns. It's the fact that so many folks are turning turrets. That must really increase the mechanical stress on scopes. Since I'm not a turret turner (not much anyway) and mostly 'set & forget' them, that probably explains why I haven't had many scope failures.

And, if a poor shot who also happened to be a set&forget person was flinging bullets all over the place, he probably wouldn't have a clue what the cause was even if he noticed that there was a problem. In my own case, I have a 223 that I shoot a lot. The scope on that one died, but it wasn't a bad death. I was working up loads at the time and just assumed the rifle was being picky, when it wasn't the rifle at all. The bad news is that I put a Leupold VX2 6-18 on it, and now I find that it's a POS. Formy, I hope you are wrong on that one. I will admit that it is my least favorite scope.

Sorry brother,

The 6-18x Leupold has all the bad attributes of scope design. I've had Leupold reps outright admit that it's a problem. Long thin tubes do no favors on zero retention or longevity. How the erector is designed and also comes into play on that model. I hope it lasts you a lifetime just keep it on mind if the gun starts acting wonky.


Despite what it may seem like I am not a Leupold hater. If I had to pick one scope to hunt the devil with it'd be between a NF and a Leupold Mark 4 6x. They just really need to get their act together. It would bring me great pleasure to be able to say that Leupold builds the best scopes available.