Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Ask The Gunwriters Accubond vs. Accubond Long Range

Yeah, my hunting bud was wondering if we had messed up, building the 26 Noslers. I told him I didn't think so, these are going to be good LR rifles. We just need to find the right loads for what we're gunning for. He killed a NM Pronghorn at 450 yds. in August with his .270, holding for two feet of drop. The 26 should be easier to use for such shots.

For our hunting, most shots less than 200 yds, a std. round works great. He loves his .270 Sendero, naming it E. F. Hutton, as in "when E. F. speaks"...

Stuff usually dies...

DF

I know the bullets like the Swift A-Frames and Northforks seem to retain their frontal area better than most with hard impacts. While not the highest in BC, the 140 Swift A-Frame might be a little better in the 26 Nosler since it would hold onto more of the frontal area and help with making bigger wound channels. Not saying they are infallible, as I am sure some folks have some negatives on them as well.

What about a Nosler E-Tip? Those seem to have a broad frontal area when driven hard and retain it well. That might be something in the 26 Nosler since it has pretty decent BC as well.

Great info DF. It is tough being a looney someday with all of these choices...

This was pulled from the ball socket the scapula rides on, on another spike elk. 300 Win Mag, 150-175 yards, 180 PT. I would have almost best money this bullet would have flown right on through, since it didn't hit much of anything on the near side.













[img]http://i723.photobucket.com/al...-A6E4-AC165AD6B47E_zps173vzspr.jpg[/img]

Not much left of the bullet, the rear core went somewhere else, most of the frontal area is gone, but the bullet worked as it was supposed to and the elk went no where. I almost wouldn't beleive it was a 180 PT if I didn't know the shooter, but I skinned, quartered and butchered the elk, so there you have it. Bullets do funny things sometimes...

Thanks for all the insights

I picked up a box of blem 120 E-tip rounds from Nosler Pro Shop. So, I have 20 rounds to see how they shoot and maybe bust a WT. IIRC, 120 gr. E-tips grouped pretty well in JB's study/articles.

Could be an interesting option.

DF

Depends on the rifle. Usually they shoot really well, but once in a while a rifle just hates 'em, a lot like Barnes X-Bullets used to be before they put grooves in 'em.

It will be interesting to see how these E-Tips shoot. Both rifles have 26" #2 Shilen Match tubes, are glassed and free floated. His was already glassed, so I just free floated the barrel. I pillared and glassed mine.

At first, groups weren't that impressive, but after "shooting in", mine went 1/2" (five shots) with 140 NAB's at 3,300 or so fps at a hundred. The other one seemed to like 130's, but hasn't been shot as much as mine. Both were DB Coated and fouled at first, but after a Wipe Out cleaning and several more rounds, I don't see copper fouling thru the Hawkeye.

So, I'm hopeful 120 E-Tips will group OK and maybe we'll get a chance to test terminal performance.

DF

DF, I'd love to see that 26 Nosler would do with the 120 ET. I'd imagine you could drive that thing at 3400 or so, and man, not sure of the twist on your barrels, but I would have to think it would be fearsome...

Please post up your results when you do try them. Heard great things about the 130 ET out of the 270WSM and Weatherby.

It's ashame theirs no Bitteroots for your 26 Nosler, pretty sure that would hold the frontal area...

MD, have you noted any difference with the new ET's since they have added a groove in the front of them?

They have a groove now? I like the E-Tips in .25cal, as they are one of the sleeker offerings in that caliber and they penetrate very well on medium game.

Regarding the LRAB/AB discussion, I can only say that I've had fantastic results with the standard AB when muzzle velocities were 2,900fps or lower. Good penetration and trauma, but not much in the way of explosiveness. The 130gr 6.5mm and the 160gr 7mm versions have shown me nothing but good things.

beretz,

The twist in 26 Nosler rifle barrels is 1-8.

I've seen references to the groove in E-Tips but can only guess that somebody got some seconds from the Pro Shop with crimping grooves. Have never seen a groove on any of the E-Tips I've obtained.

Scotty looks to me like it was running out of "poop" since it was at the end of the wound channel.

They do tend to slow down after penetrating a ways. In fact I've found one bullet that slit the skin on the far side of a deer, but didn't have enough zip left to make it out of the hole. And that was a 360-grain .416 Woodleigh Weldcore. But it was a severely angling shot....

Wow Muledeer, those Whitetail get tougher every year.

Wasn't a whitetail. It was a fallow deer doe that weighed maybe 100 pounds, and I didn't shoot it. The killer was another gun writer, shot used the .416 purely in the interests of science.

There's nothing magical about terminal ballistics or what bullets do in tissue fellas.

How quickly a bullet kills has everything to do with what the bullet hits and how big the wound channel is, and absolutely nothing to do with what it looks like after the fact. It's a credit to western marketing and human gullibility that so many worry more about how pretty a bullet is after it's taken a life rather than how it actually performed it's job.



DF,

As has been stated, at those speeds the front portion is tearing off leaving just the base to exit. The Accubond's are not "too hard" for deer. Look at the entire wound channel to see the story.

That makes sense, as there was tissue damage between the small entrance and exit wounds.

Seems to me, there is more blood flow from entrance/exit wounds when the projectile is fired at 2,800 fps or so, vs. 3,400 fps. I guess hyper vel hits cause tissue shock and trauma such that wounds don't bleed as freely as from lower velocity hits.

I saw this with the .240, shooting an 80 gr. TTSX at 3,600 fps. Lots of blood shot tissue, not much bleeding.

Hyper vel does seem to create its own set of bullet choice/bullet performance issues.

DF

Seems like I almost always get good blood trails with cup/cores or bondeds at MVs under 2,900fps or so. You guys are likely right that it is because the bullet still has a decent frontal area when it exits. Holes on rib shots that are quarter to half-dollar size will generally leak a lot. Medium-weight versions of Interlocks, Gamekings, Speer Boattails, Ballistic Tips, and Accubonds from moderate capacity .26-.30cal chamberings will "knock a good hole" on lungs most of the time.

You know, for LR, I see the merits of high vel rounds. For our kinda local hunting, I'm not so sure.

Like the 80 gr. .240 at 3,600 fps. It's really not a LR round because that little bullet loses knock down at extended ranges, doesn't hold velocity and KE well enough to be a LR contender for deer sized animals. Smaller critters, maybe so.

The 26 Nosler with 140 NAB's, 142 and 150 Matrix VLD's, 140 Berger VLD's, etc. should be a good LR round with fairly adequate wallop way down range.

I don't think these hyper vel rounds offer much over std. rounds for 200 yd. and under everyday deer hunting. And, bullet selection isn't that critical; most any good C&C projectile will do the job at 2,800 or so fps.

Learning as I go; that's my current thinking on the subject. As always, appreciate input.

DF

Honestly, 400-500yds is "long range" around here, but shots do sometimes present themselves. Even so, I'll generally carry something that offers good retained velocity and lower wind drift when I hunt areas that may offer those kinds of shots. As you say, speed is nice, but not necessarily if that speed bleeds off rapidly. JBM software can be an eye opener and can help identify the merits of one bullet/chambering combo versus another regarding ballistics. Since the modern laser rangefinder came along, roasting stubby bullets at warp speed has lost a lot of appeal in nearly every department.

I think that's pretty valid.

Interestingly I've settled on AB's as a got to for several rifles from 110 grain in my .257 Weatherby at approximately 3400 up to 200 grain in .338 around 2800.

All have performed very, very well, as a matter of fact I don't remember any animals moving much after shooting them, but the terminal performance is never the same based on speed, distance, and angle of shot.

Essentially, stating the obvious that external factors obviously influence terminal performance. But I've been happy with AB's because they consistently give me great results with a broad spectrum of variables.