Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Handguns 44 spec = 45 acp

I was looking at Hornady 8th ed reloading manual and Speer's 14th reloading manual.

It looks like the 44special is ballistic equal to the 45acp? Or am I missing something

.429 VS .452

In certain guns that will stand 'Elmer Loads', the 44 Special tromps all over the ACP. But in applications where a practical, concealable defense gun is needed, the ACP steals the show.

A 5 shot .44 sp and a 5 shot XD-S would be just about identical to any felon who encountered the wrong end of them.

They need to update that book,I read the same thing in 1965?

The 45 can be uploaded as well, 45 Super and Rowland.

Exactly!

I load my .45 with a 230 gr. bullet at about 850, or original specs. My standard .44 spec. load is a 260 gr. bullet at 960. I'm not sure anything shot with them could tell the difference, but I'll take the .44 deer hunting, not so much for the .45. take that for what its worth.

I shoot a 255 hard cast 960+ FPS out of my 1911 45 ACP and the same bullet 1075+ FPS in 45 Super. Very comparable.

Both will work fine depending on if you are a wheel gun or semi-auto man. I personally would take the 45 acp semi-auto over the 44 spl wheel gun for self defense

I think the two cartridges are more alike than they are different. One is more suited to the revolver and the other, semi automatics.

Both are very pleasant to shoot and will do nicely to ride the river with, so to speak.

Take a look at the Speer GoldDot Personal Protection loads for reference.

.44 Special standard load is a 200 grain .429" JHP at 875 fps with a BC of .145 for 340 ft.lbs. at the muzzle

.45 ACP standard load is a 230 grain .452" JHP at 890 fps with a BC of .143 for 404 ft.lbs. at the muzzle.

The .44 is tested from a 6" barrel; the .45 from a 5".

The .45 in the short barrel (4") uses the same bullet at 820 fps for 343.

I've shot the .44 from a 3" barrel and clocked it that right at 820 fps, and the .45 from a 3" barrel and found it at just under 800.

If those are near ballistic twins, I'm not sure what would be. I will take, and do take, either and feel quite secure in their capabilities.

Right.



Wrong.

I take it that you don't give the added diameter any merit.

It's not that I gave it no merit, but not substantial, just like the difference in sectional densities (.155 for the .429 to .161 for the .452).

That's why they are "near ballistic twins" and not "identical ballistic twins".

The 3" .45ACP (mine) clocked about 785 on average. At 785, the .45ACP 230 hits with about 315 ft.lbs. The .44 at 820 hits with about 300 ft.lbs.

There ain't gonna be a whole lot of difference known by anything that gets hit with either as to whether there was 15 ft.lbs., or .023" difference one way or another.

Foot lbs of energy is a poor way to equate lethality. From my experience the added diameter is indeed beneficial. Shoot the same type bullet in each (such as LBT LFN) in each and the 45 ACP with comparable velocity will leave a larger wound channel. I obsererved this shooting game with a handgun since the early 70s.

There is a difference if you are observant, not saying a day light and dark difference, but a difference none the less.

The reason behind my question is because I have a Redhawk in 44mag and 1911 45acp.

In an effort to get use to the recoil of the 44mag, I'm attempting to download to 44spec levels.

When it occurred to me, that I'm loading to similiar ballistics of the 45acp.

And from listening to other post that the 44mag doesn't have to be loading to magnum levels to be effective, then why not stick to 45apc or 45acp +p loads if not gaining much in performance?

What, exactly, are you trying to accomplish?

For hunting, the Redhawk wins. For CCW, the 1911 wins.

A 45 ACP or 45 ACP +P with a good bullet will cleanly take deer and pigs. Using the Buffal Bore 255 grain hard cast +P load I shot into 9 one gallon jugs full of water and exited all 9.

I don't disagree with that assessment at all. However, for self-defense usage, there won't be LFNs involved; there will be JHPs and the larger initial diameter, as small as it is, won't matter much at all.

For hunting purposes, yes, there's a slight difference but very, very slight.

In either case, I'd not feel undergunned with either and not fret the very small differences between the two as for practical use.

Of course it will, but it won't match a .44Magnum performance wise for hunting. The Redhawk gives that flexibility.

The Redhawk can't match the carry capabilities of the 1911, either, so the 1911 takes that category easily, too.

Put the .45ACP and the .44Special in identical platforms, like a double action revolver with a 3", 4", or 5" barrel, and flip a coin as to the meaningful difference. When the two different platforms are considered, the platforms make the difference.

Agree. I was upset that deflave managed to snag a S&W 396NG off the classifieds just before I logged in to buy it, but any concerns about my misfortune went away after the XD-S in .45 was introduced. I saved money, too.

Not sure how or why you felt the need to bring a 44 mag or a RedHawks into the thread.

Since that's the .44 that the OP has and was discussing, I thought it pertinent.

Did miss the part that he wanted to down load to 44 special levels to reduce recoil? So how is it relevant in 44 mag? It's not.

No, I didn't miss that. Did you miss the part where he mentioned that as a means to get used to the recoil of the .44? That's relevant to the use of the Redhawk as a .44 Magnum, and the Redhawk gives him that flexibility should he decide to use it.

He's right that the .44 doesn't have to be loaded up to magnum levels to be effective, but for hunting it certainly is MORE effective at that level and the capability exists in that Redhawk to do so.

For self-defense use, the 1911 is the better platform (in my opinion) as it carries and conceals more easily while offering time-tested power.

44 Spec = 45 ACP

Pretty sure I said that earlier. Can't see where there's an argument/disagreement here at all.

No dog in this fight but the original statement was that the 44 special & the 45 ACP are pretty much identical & they are. All of us can juggle the numbers to suit us depending on which one is our favorite. If EVERYTHING is equal, bullet weight, speed, bullet style, etc. then the bigger bullet diameter is going to win, it has to. But if you run the 44 special up to its max velocity in a suitable gun (Ruger) then you can get bullet expansion that will exceed what the 45 is capable of just by additional velocity, so there's many way to juggle the results to come out on top.
What started out as a 44 special vs 45 ACP comparison soon got tangled up with the 45 Super, the 460 Rowland & the 44 maggie, strange! At the end of the day, with good ammo you are very well armed with either one, maybe give a slight edge to the 44 special for hunting & a slight edge to the awesome 45 auto for a fighting/ carry/ close range hunting gun. Again, good ammo makes or breaks the deal.

Dick

Spot on. Exactly on point